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Lazy jacks

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RandyAmy
1st Mate

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USA
40 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/11/2020 : 09:50:00

Thinking about installing lazy jacks on my C25. Many of you all use them? Are they more trouble than they are worth or are most that have them happy with them?

Lee Panza
Captain

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USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 05/12/2020 : 23:36:55

I think it's safe to say that most sailboat owners don't really need lazy jacks. They can catch the battens when the sail is going up, so they pretty much have to be adjustable, and that complicates things. They get in the way of the sail cover. They're another thing to have to deal with when you go to remove the mast. And if you've got experienced crew to help manage the sail as it comes down they aren't necessary at all.

I, on the other hand, consider them to be one of the most important modifications I've made to my Catalina 25.

Like so many things, it all depends on how and where you sail. I usually sail alone or with inexperienced passengers, and the wind on San Francisco Bay in the summertime is typically in the mid-twenties. So, when I need to drop my mainsail, I really need that "cat's cradle" web of strings to keep the sail from becoming an unmanageble mess. At the end of a typical day of sailing I could motor into the wind with plenty of throttle so the auto tiller-pilot could keep the bow from falling off, and I could lower the sail in stages and bundle it in the sail-ties as I go. And I'd be slamming into the chop the 20+ knot winds have kicked-up, holding on for dear life with one hand and gathering up the sail with the other (speaking from experience).

My bigger concern, however, would be trying to manage that sail if I have to drop it quickly in an emergency. Think passenger-oveboard recovery (or rescuing someone off another boat). My boat naturally wants to go broadside to the wind when it comes to a stop, and it won't stay stopped for long while the mainsail is up (even when hove-to it wants to keep moving). An uncontrolled mainsail would be a serious complication in that kind of situation, so I want to be able to drop it and ignore it as I fire up the iron genny.

There are a number of lazy jacks systems out there, and I think any of them would be useful. I wanted a system that I could deploy from my cockpit after I raise the sail, but that I could put away after the sail is down and secured (so it's out of the way for the next time the sail goes up). I also wanted it to be easily detachable when I drop and stow the mast as I'm preparing to hit the highway.

I can post the measurements I came up with, as well as some key rigging and routing details, but as I said there are a number of systems - some commercial and some DIY - out there.

The important first question, of course, is do you really need lazy jacks?

They can be really, really nice to have!

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

Edited by - Lee Panza on 05/12/2020 23:39:35

RandyAmy
1st Mate

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USA
40 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2020 : 04:35:55

Thank you so much for the input Lee. Do I "need" lazy jacks? I often sail single handed and have made do so far, but like you mention, the main does end up everywhere when putting down.
So all that being said, probably dont so much need as want...or think I want. LOL.
I would greatly appreciate the measurements, rigging, routing details that you have found work well for you.

Lee Panza
Captain

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USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2020 : 22:51:21

Within the next few days I'll try to get down to the boat and take some pictures. I'll put them up on my Smugmug site and I'll post a link here. Maybe I'll post one or two images here as well.

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

Lee Panza
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2020 : 11:28:48

In the meantime, here's a diagram and a description.

The three small black circles are SS rings (I'm intending to replace them with low-friction rings). These dimensions (in inches) allow the lower legs to lie along the boom, with the upper legs parallel to the mast, when the system is stowed in the down position (the halyards lie far enough away from the mast to avoid slapping against it in the wind). When the sail is raised, there is no interference from the lazy-jacks. Once the sail is deployed the lazy-jacks are deployed. They are left loose enough that they don't interfere with the camber of the sail, but the system is in place ready to catch the sail whenever it needs to be dropped.

In this diagram, the yellow halyard passes up through a check block on the mast, a little below the gooseneck, and then back down through a small block high up on the mast. It attaches to the upper ring with a small detachable clip that allows the entire lower system to remain with the boom when the boom is removed (when the mast needs to be lowered). The magenta line passes through the lower and upper rings and is tied to the middle ring. The red line passes through the middle ring. These lines are secured to the boom by padeyes.

The turquoise down-hall line passes through a cheek block on the boom and then slides through the lower ring; it is tied to the middle ring. The halyard and the down-haul line both run aft through pad eyes along the boom, and both lines have clam-cleats near the aft end of the boom to secure them in the up or down configuration. The excess portions of both lines get bundled and secured on the boom over the cockpit so the system can be deployed or stowed from there. I currently use small velcro ties to secure the bundles, but I'm intending to sew little horizontal pouches for them.

When the system is stowed after the sail has been bundled, the turquoise line has pulled both rings down to a position close to the cheek block on the boom. Both legs of the magenta line run straight up to the halyard, which is then nearly plumb down from the spreader blocks (this is why the blocks are on the spreaders, a little away from the mast). The downhaul line has also drawn the red lines taut along the boom.

When the boom is to be removed, the halyard clip is "parked" on a padeye on the mast within reach. Then, the lower end of the halyard is pulled out of the boom hardware and is tied-off to the same padeye (and the excess is just bundled there)

This verbal description seems complicated, but a couple of photos are posted below, and more photos are at:

https://panza.smugmug.com/MYSAILBOAT/The-Boat-Renovation/Lazy-Jacks/

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

Edited by - Lee Panza on 05/26/2020 11:37:35

RandyAmy
1st Mate

Members Avatar

USA
40 Posts

Response Posted - 05/18/2020 : 05:12:41

That looks like a great system. I like that it can so easily be stowed. What size/material are you using for all the lines? Or did I miss that somewhere? Thanks for the info Lee.

TEM58
Navigator

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USA
113 Posts

Response Posted - 05/24/2020 : 09:55:49

I bought a system from http://jiffyjax.com/index.html several years ago for my C25. Easy guy to work with and seemed to really care. Easy installation, and I never once regretted installing them. Being able to stow them once anchored or back in the slip, then deploy from the cockpit when needed was the key point in buying from this site. I did replace the wire lock hitch pins with small snap shackles however. From the current description it looks like he may have �upgraded � a couple of components since I purchased.

Tim M
�Perfect Match II�
2003 C350 #35
Cruising FL
PO "Wine Down"
2000 C250 WK #453
PO "Perfect Match"
1983 C25 SR/SK #3932
Lake Belton
Belton, TX

Lee Panza
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 05/30/2020 : 07:37:05

quote:
Originally posted by Lee Panza

Here are a couple of photos of the system. There are additional photos at:

https://panza.smugmug.com/MYSAILBOAT/The-Boat-Renovation/Lazy-Jacks/

In this first photo the "cradle" created by the lazy-jacks is clearly evident. There is sufficient slack in the system that the sail will be able to fill without being constrained. The sail is reefed in this photo, but the lazy-jacks will function just as with a full sail.

In the second photo, the sail has just been dropped and is cradled on the boom by the lazy-jacks.

In the foreground, the system halyard (white) is coiled and still stowed in the yellow velcro strap, but excess hangs loose after tightening the halyard up from the relaxed sailing position to the taut position for containing the sail.

The down-haul line (white w/ blue tracer) is fully extended; the bitter end is hanging from the same bundle as the halyard.

The halyard and down-haul pass through clam-cleats and then run forward on the boom (halyard above the down-haul).

By placing the controls toward the aft end of the boom it's possible to deploy the system from the cockpit right after the sail is hoisted (also from the cockpit) while motoring into the wind.

The pale blue lines hanging from boom are the second-reef lines; they will be bundled on top of the sail, in their fully-extended condition, allowing the sail to be hoisted without having to stop to extend them at that time.

To function most effectively the boat needs to be pointed directly into the wind when the sail comes down. If I need to drop the sail without stopping to start the motor and set the autopilot, I tack through the wind as soon as the halyard is let free. This is the first step I do when I practice my Crew Over-Board drill (the second step is to start the motor, because this light little Cat 25 is difficult to keep stable at the pick-up point whenever there's much wind blowing).

This system was designed to be easy to disconnect when the boom is removed. Since the boom and sail need to be detached from the mast whenever the mast is lowered, this is a pretty important feature that might not be allowed for in other systems.

If I'm going to use a system or accessory frequently, it needs to be convenient and easy to use. I deploy my lazy-jacks every time I raise the mainsail, so I designed this system to be generally convenient and easy. The one change I will eventually get around to is to make little horizontal pouches to stow the halyards and down-hauls in instead of the velcro straps.

Again, there are additional photos at:

https://panza.smugmug.com/MYSAILBOAT/The-Boat-Renovation/Lazy-Jacks/

I hope this gives you some ideas.

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

Edited by - Lee Panza on 05/30/2020 07:50:21

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