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Catalina 25 Design Class Rules

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sailing2
Deckhand

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USA
23 Posts

Initially Posted - 09/22/2005 : 11:41:09

TextTextText
I thank the officers for their work in revising the Constitution, bylaws and class rules. I was only able to open the Catalina 25 class rules today Sept 22. Thanks Jim for fixing the glitches in the attachments. There is not much time to the deadline for voting but make the following recommendations

VOTE:

YES, on the New Constitution, but agree that there are a few shortcomings that need to be fixed in the next year, specifically the organizations name. Welcome the Capri 25’s.

NO, on the revised CATALINA 25 DESIGN CLASS RULES. In my first read I have the following questions which should be addressed before they are adopted.

1. B. Rudders para. 4 added: Why make the requirement for a three year period? Is there a problem I don’t know about? This new paragraph will require me to declare that my rudder is not original. My original rudder delaminated and I had to purchase a new one 10 years or so ago from Catalina. Para. B1 indicated that I have a legal rudder. I ask why the requirement?

2. There is language added that is not indicated as being revised. The latest class rules were revised in 1998. In that set, published on the Catalina 25/250 web site, the verbiage in para E Sails, 1a. does not read the same as what is attached to the ballot. I wonder if there are other discrepancies like this one.

Old as published and copied from the web site:

a. Spinnaker sails are authorized and may be used in the National Championship Regatta and all sanctioned Regattas as a separate spinnaker class. Only two measured spinnakers may be used in the same regatta.

Old as published and copied from the ballot attachment:

a. Spinnaker sails are authorized and may be used in the National Championship Regatta and all sanctioned Regattas as a separate or combined spinnaker class with appropriate handicap. Only two measured spinnakers may be used in the same regatta.

3. I find para F., Ratings, confusing. The example in F1B is supposed to be substantiated in para F2. I may be missing the big picture; where is it substantiated. This is confusing.

Scott Hefty
Ho'O Kolohe C25 #5539

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Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 09/22/2005 : 13:22:53

Hi Scott,
There are several members of your board that work realy hard for this association, (I am not one of them), Duane has spent an incredible amount of time as chief measurer, keeper of the class rules, and link master. Any problems with the class rules will be sorted out as time goes by and any conflicting information will be superseeded by the notice of race at the nationals. Thanks for your efforts to help the process along. Since we only vote annually it may take a while to have a perfect document to vote on. I hope that next year you will nominated yourself for an office, you have shown a lot of interest in the nationals and how they are run, you would be a great VC or CM.

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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 09/23/2005 : 08:27:55

NO, on the revised CATALINA 25 DESIGN CLASS RULES. In my first read I have the following questions which should be addressed before they are adopted.

1. B. Rudders para. 4 added: Why make the requirement for a three year period? Is there a problem I don’t know about? This new paragraph will require me to declare that my rudder is not original. My original rudder delaminated and I had to purchase a new one 10 years or so ago from Catalina. Para. B1 indicated that I have a legal rudder. I ask why the requirement?
The simple fact of the matter is that we are not really a one design boat. But let me elaborate – Since our fleet is aging, rudders, much like yours have delaminated. Others have cracked, been broken or any of a myriad of things have occurred. Because of that many owners have had to replace their rudders, some were not replaced with Catalina Factory rudders. Many owners have asked if their new rudder was class legal. If we were truly one design the answer would be no it’s not unless it meets original specifications. That answer for this fleet would be unacceptable. One of the main goals of this association (section 2d) is to keep costs associated with ownership down another is to promote fair competition while racing. Yes, currently owned replacement rudders have been “grand-fathered”, for the time being and most likely forever. Yet we need to document how newer rudders balanced or otherwise perform during racing over some amount of time. If there is a great disparity, then that will need to be addressed down the road in most likely with a time penalty or allowance. Therefore, in order to properly look at results and make intelligent comparisons we will need to have skippers “declare” the modification. Beyond that end, your rudder was purchase from Catalina therefore it is considered a factory original and wouldn’t fall into this category.

2. There is language added that is not indicated as being revised. The latest class rules were revised in 1998. In that set, published on the Catalina 25/250 web site, the verbiage in para E Sails, 1a. does not read the same as what is attached to the ballot. I wonder if there are other discrepancies like this one.

Old as published and copied from the web site:

a. Spinnaker sails are authorized and may be used in the National Championship Regatta and all sanctioned Regattas as a separate spinnaker class. Only two measured spinnakers may be used in the same regatta.

Old as published and copied from the ballot attachment:

a. Spinnaker sails are authorized and may be used in the National Championship Regatta and all sanctioned Regattas as a separate or combined spinnaker class with appropriate handicap. Only two measured spinnakers may be used in the same regatta.

This was a cut and paste error – I apologize. I was working with 4 documents at one time (2 old – 2 new). However, in the past spinnakers and jammers have at nationals sailed both together and separate depending on the year. The change was made to note that fact and allow for it. There was no intent to put one over on anyone. I’ve re-read all documents and do not see any other such anomalies.

3. I find para F., Ratings, confusing. The example in F1B is supposed to be substantiated in para F2. I may be missing the big picture; where is it substantiated. This is confusing.

 If you will notice, Section F2D rates a tall spinnaker boat as scratch boat. Everything else is rated based on that boat, which theoretically should be the fastest configuration. So in the example a standard spin rated 228 would mean that the tall spin which doesn’t have a host club PHRF rating would be a 222. PHRF ratings are regional handicaps based on regional factors – average wind, wave, and in some cases competitive factors (rare). This method allows for full integration of those factors if they exist. Prior ratings within the rules were incomplete and did not explicitly define all conditions possible. I believe that this is the best attempt yet to bring the ratings in line.

I ask that you reconsider your decision to vote no. While we can have a ballot every month, its pretty unrealistic that it will occur before the next general election. We really need to bring these rules up to snuff and move forward as an organization.

Duane

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The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.