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Update on the sailboat accident on Clear Lake.

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Tom Potter
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1913 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/18/2007 : 19:42:18

This accident happened last year and I recall reading about it then.

[url="http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=i_team&id=5569012"]This link has a couple of TV interviews[/url] I found very interesting to watch.

I stole the link off the Trailer Sailor site. I figured some of you guys might not visit there and would find this as interesting as I did.

Edited by - Tom Potter on 08/18/2007 19:43:32

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/18/2007 : 22:20:54

How could this not have blown up?? The California Attorney General should be all over this one! Where is he??

Edited by - on

Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 08/19/2007 : 00:52:18

It's an absolute crime that the authorities in Clear Lake are getting away with this travesty of justice. Latitude 38 did a piece on it last month. Write your congress-critters and Atty. General. Jerry Brown. Just horrible...

I wouldn't call it a sailboat accident - it was a drunk driver who was a cop killing people.

Edited by - Stu Jackson C34 on 08/19/2007 00:53:37

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 08/19/2007 : 07:07:17

My question, is the stigma that hangs over the deputy a driving force to convict someone else so the deputy can claim exoneration?

If maritime law were applied, there'd likely be no single blame.

I'd also be interested to know the alcohol level of the sailboat skipper with the point being that if it were only slightly above the legal limits established for driving a car at 70 mph on the turnpike and the reaction time needed there, I don't necessarily think that level would equate to negligence behavior of a sailboat skipper operating a boat in far less congestion at 7 mph or less.

Edited by - Arlyn Stewart on 08/19/2007 07:21:38

atgep
Master Marine Consultant

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1009 Posts

Response Posted - 08/19/2007 : 08:04:34

It would be a good story for 60 minutes to air. Tragic to say the least. Sounds like the "good old boy network " at work here. There was clearly no reason for the powerboat to be going that fast at night.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/19/2007 : 22:24:32

When power boats do go that fast in the dark, somebody often dies. In Stamford, CT, it was a couple of guys who'd had a few too many beers, cranked up their 25-footer to 30-something, and went head-on into a breakwater. Both died instantly. Fortunately, the breakwater didn't. I saw the boat against concrete the next day--not pretty.

Edited by - on

jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts

Response Posted - 08/21/2007 : 09:08:04

The story is from last year...what's the current status?

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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/21/2007 : 09:13:05

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by jerlim
 The story is from last year...what's the current status?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Tom's link is to a followup story written last week. But the actual status is a little fuzzy... (...just possibly a pun there.)

Edited by - on

Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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USA
855 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2008 : 21:25:36

Here's a link to a current status of this case --> [url="http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/iteam&id=6152923"]Preliminary hearing into Clear Lake boat crash[/url]
The ABC news station in SF has been doing follow-up stories.
On this link, there are 9 different segments (so far).
Use the scroll bar below the video to see previous videos.

I own property on Clear Lake so I've been following this story.
Note: here's an archive post from this forum --> [url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/forum/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=12491"]sailboat - power boat collision[/url]

Russ C250WB #793

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redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2008 : 08:20:10

Drunk Sailor, Drunk Owner, Drunk Crew, heck, why do we need stinking lights attitude for sure. Where was their spot light flashing on the sails periodically? The helmsman apparently wasn't keeping a good watch on anything but his beverage. Do you think they did the sobriety test immediately after the accident? NO, it probably took a couple of hours before it was administered. The guy probably shouldn't have been driving a red wagon.

That been said, the whole think sounds like a crime of opportunity. Two fools - actually sounds like quite a few more than two - and one of them has a badge. Sorry kid, you lose. It may not be right or fair, but much of life is neither. The civil suits will be more important in the end, unfortunately.

You lake sailors take heed. Light em up! A smaller space than at sea and only so many directions to head in and the probability of collision goes way up. See someone heading your way, give them 2 million candle power flash directly from your mega light. Don't wait for them to hit you.

sten

Edited by - on

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2008 : 08:48:58

Not diminishing the consequences for all of those concerned, the rest of us at least get to bring this issue to the fore so that we can update our knowledge and proceedures.

When I first came to this country, my, then, girlfriend (now my wife) told me when I drove her car that I should assume that everyone else on the road is an idiot and to expect the most stupid action from them. I guess the same goes true on the water.

(Say's I that didn't put oil in my engine!)

Paul

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2008 : 09:46:36

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking
 Drunk Sailor, Drunk Owner, Drunk Crew, heck, why do we need stinking lights attitude for sure. Where was their spot light flashing on the sails periodically? The helmsman apparently wasn't keeping a good watch on anything but his beverage. Do you think they did the sobriety test immediately after the accident? NO, it probably took a couple of hours before it was administered. The guy probably shouldn't have been driving a red wagon.

That been said, the whole think sounds like a crime of opportunity. Two fools - actually sounds like quite a few more than two - and one of them has a badge. Sorry kid, you lose. It may not be right or fair, but much of life is neither. The civil suits will be more important in the end, unfortunately.

You lake sailors take heed. Light em up! A smaller space than at sea and only so many directions to head in and the probability of collision goes way up. See someone heading your way, give them 2 million candle power flash directly from your mega light. Don't wait for them to hit you.

sten
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

And you wonder why Sea Tow does not want to help you and Homeland Security eavesdrops on you!

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2008 : 12:20:24

I'm sorry you reminded me of that case. It stinks like a dead skunk. 45 at night on a lake is total, absolute, gross negligence, and that prosecutor appears to belong in jail along with the cop.

BTW, if the sailor had shined one of those "million candlepower" spots in the powerboater's face, he very well could be found at least partially at fault. He should only use it to illuminate his sails.

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2008 : 20:06:54

next time my sailing buddies make fun of my Xmas tree boat, I'll send them a link to this story.

Edited by - on

dave holtgrave
Captain

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USA
427 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2008 : 21:12:51

we live in a very corrupt country.
last year the day after thanksgiving in a heavy mall retail shopping area an insadent happened that is just like this.

there was a state trooper responding to an accident on a state highway in which a local sherrif deputy had already responded.

this trooper was traveling on an interstate near the shopping areas.
he was traveling at 126mph on the left shoulder when he lost control of his car and crossed over into the on coming traffic killing 2 teenage sisters.

now the state troopers really don't talk about it, and the trooper is still on disabled pay.

come on what the hell is this about.
if i drove on the left shoulder ot 126 mph i would never see the light of day.

great country as long as you don't here about all this poison.
why are we so corrupt??

i have great respect for those who stop cars full of problems during the night but, is this not wrong??

really sad.

dave holtgrave
5722 sk/tr
getting wet on sunday on carlyle lake in southern illinois

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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2008 : 22:31:36

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dave holtgrave
 we live in a very corrupt country...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Well, as aghast as I am about this case, let's not get into Fox News mode... For each of the few out-of-control officers we hear about (sometimes for 48 hours straight), there are hundreds of thousands of officers putting their lives on the line for us, and doing jobs every day that would leave us (or at least me) quivering in our beds, unable to sleep. If you want to see a corrupt country, I can show you a few. This one isn't perfect, but it's pretty good (Canada, too), and we're unbelievably lucky to have been brought into it at this time in history, through no fault or effort of our own.

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Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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USA
855 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2008 : 00:53:29

Since I brought this up again, I feel responsible for dragging everyone down.

I agree it's a sad situation, but I want to learn from this example.
Here's my reason for posting this week's link.
. I own property on Clear Lake so it hits close to home.
. It's a real life example of what to be prepared for as a sailboat owner.
. It shows how stupid the "Other Guy" can be, so you have to be prepared for them too.
. I thought it would generate interest along the lines of "What would you do as the sailor?" or "What would you do as the powerboater?"

There are few points missing from the news segment.
. The sailboat had been racing earlier that day in the annual yacht club regatta.
. The wind died after sunset and they were basically adrift.
. They were drinking, not paying attention, but couldn't get out of the way if they wanted to.
. It was a calm night, so the powerboater wanted to go fast. If there was any wind chop he wouldn't have been going 30-35-40-45MPH (depends on who you listen to).

. It's too bad it was an off-duty deputy using a sheriff boat for a joy-ride with his friends, but any idiot can drive recklessly and hit you.
. It's too bad the DA charged the wrong guy, but don't get yourself into the situation. Be prepared for idiots and don't depend on the law to help you.
. It's too bad both guys are suing each other, but what do you expect them to do.
. Personally, I agree with Sten. Keep all your lights on and have a mega-candle handy.
. Concidentally, I bought backup mega-candle last Saturday (before this story was in the news again). I guess it has been in the back of my mind.
. My point was both guys screwed up and someone died.

Russ C250WB #793

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2008 : 06:26:33

Quote: "And you wonder why Sea Tow does not want to help you and Homeland Security eavesdrops on you!"

nah, I never wonder - I just know!

Justice comes to those who can afford it... I think OJ is still walking around after now committing numerous crimes. Homeland Security loves me BTW. I just reported a little stinkpot tied to a bridge while fishing. I think they might pin a medal on me. They do NOT think that is funny.

off topic - We were offshore at 01:00 and overheard an Airforce Jet hail a Motor Vessel who was traveling at 10 knots directly towards an oil platform. They do watch this stuff.

sten

Edited by - on

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2008 : 07:36:33

Written by Dave Bristle;<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">This one isn't perfect, but it's pretty good (Canada, too), and we're unbelievably lucky to have been brought into it at this time in history, through no fault or effort of our own.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Nicely put Dave. Ya know, the world is not the same as it was 40 years ago. There's a lot more people and it's a harsher place. All the more reason to take a look around and understand how lucky we are here in America. Oh yes there's greed and lack of conscience but considering the alternative, I think I'll stay here and work at making this a better place.

Edited by - on

Renzo
Admiral

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USA
621 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2008 : 07:43:30

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Dave Bristle
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dave holtgrave
 we live in a very corrupt country...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Well, as aghast as I am about this case, let's not get into Fox News mode... For each of the few out-of-control officers we hear about (sometimes for 48 hours straight), there are hundreds of thousands of officers putting their lives on the line for us, and doing jobs every day that would leave us (or at least me) quivering in our beds, unable to sleep. If you want to see a corrupt country, I can show you a few. This one isn't perfect, but it's pretty good (Canada, too), and we're unbelievably lucky to have been brought into it at this time in history, through no fault or effort of our own.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Hear, Hear! Way to go Dave! Most of us need to be reminded of how good we have it in this country, especially these days. Not that other countries don't have their appeal, but if we are honest with ourselves many of us wouldn't be where we are or have what we have (as little, or as much as that may be)or feel as secure, if we were in another country.

A similar incident occurred on Lake St. Clair a couple of years ago when a Sheriff's Deputy took some friends on a joy ride in the wee hours of the morning, in a cigatette boat. He ran into the, highly visible, shore line near Metro Beach at 90 miles an hour, killing one of his passangers. Just proves that: super fast boat + small lake = trouble, even in the hands of a trained professional.
Being visible helps but this guy was moving so fast that he couldn't even miss a prominent, well known point of land.

Edited by - on

aeckhart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1709 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2008 : 14:08:25

For me the best lesson learned in this incident is to not have alcoholic beverages on your boat........period. In todays sue everyone society, you cannot leave yourself open. There hasn't been a single can of beer or other alcoholic beverage consumed on my boat while under way in at least 15 years. I can't vouch for the 3 years of ownership previous to that though. I do carry a few bottles of wine when cruising and imbibe only after anchored or docked. It's the safest policy.

Edited by - on

piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2008 : 15:50:13

Al, I am very sure that is true for most sailboat owners. But I am also very sure that is the opposite for motor boat owners, except for Dave B of course.
Steve A

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Renzo
Admiral

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USA
621 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2008 : 16:47:05

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by aeckhart
 For me the best lesson learned in this incident is to not have alcoholic beverages on your boat........period. In todays sue everyone society, you cannot leave yourself open. There hasn't been a single can of beer or other alcoholic beverage consumed on my boat while under way in at least 15 years. I can't vouch for the 3 years of ownership previous to that though. I do carry a few bottles of wine when cruising and imbibe only after anchored or docked. It's the safest policy.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Sadly I must agree with you Al. Although, I can't see how a sailor drifting along at walking speed on a clear day (or evening for that matter)enjoying a beer or two, can be equated to a bow in the air, high speed, power boat with an innattentive helmsman. In the present zero tolerance for everything mentality I suppose it is necessary to cover your stern at all times and try to live the life of a saint.

It sure puts a cramp in the pirate image of sailors though.

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 15:54:07

Sadly - the owner of the vessel struck was not charged even though he was aboard!!!!!! What the f...? I don't get that part. Look, if your boat is involved in any type of incident, your consumption of bevs WILL become a piece of the puzzle and you will NOT have the upper hand. Regardless of how harmless these "sailors" were, they did NOT take adequate care to insure their safety and that is clear by the facts of the case. Anyone operating a powerboat at that speed is clearly and idiot regardless of day or night. His tiny little speedboat coulda bust a steering cable and all woulda been lost. These guys trust their equipment WAY too much in my opinion... have something that fast out of control and the deputy could be the dead one...

Sten

DPO C25 #3220 "Zephyr", SR, FK
SV Lysistrata - C&C 39 - norfolk VA

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