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Installing a Fiamma Bi-Pot

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Initially Posted - 04/05/2009 : 23:12:40

We got our new toilet last week, and I noodled for a while on how to install it on the boat. It didn't come with any factory hold downs, so I needed to come up with some way of keeping it in place.

It has tapered slots on both sides beneath where the upper reservoir clamps down onto the waste tank. These slots are about 4" tall x 3" wide, so fairly substantial. I had some rock maple laying around the shop, so I made some custom wedges to fit tightly in tapered slots to keep it from moving around inside the head.

Here you can see the two wedges being screwed into the head deck. I used hotmelt glue to hold them in place while I clamped the Kreg jig to them with the Visegrips. I made it a fairly tight fit, and once there's 40+ pounds of water & waste holding it down, I'm not overly concerned about it moving vertically. This might be a mistake, but I'll find that out the first time we're in heavy weather I guess.

I was able to fit it in w/o modification to the hanging locker door. I have it situated so it just brushes the top of the tank as it opens.

And:

David
C-250 Mainsheet Editor

Sirius Lepak
1997 C-250 WK TR #271 --Seattle area Port Captain --

Edited by - delliottg on 04/05/2009 23:14:45

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 04/06/2009 : 14:22:32

Nice clean install! Do you have wedges at the front and back too? What does the plaque say behind the head?

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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Response Posted - 04/06/2009 : 14:48:46

We're debating the necessity of wedges for the front & back. The back is flush against the back of the head deck, pushed against the trim piece, so it's actually constrained on three sides. Rita didn't like the look of a front wedge, and I'm not sure it's necessary, so we'll try it like this for a while & see what happens. In any case, there's no way to wedge the back, it's asymetrical because of the carry handles. I have thought about a single stick up through the handles that attaches to the back wall, and if any changes are necessary, I think that's the way I'll go.

The plaque says something to the effect of:

"Please don't put anything in the head unless you've eaten it first"

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
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Response Posted - 04/06/2009 : 14:51:02

I was thinking a front block would come in handy while trailering and making a quick stop. Not sure about choppy sailing conditions too.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/06/2009 : 15:03:38

Hmm... that's a good point I hadn't considered. However, the wedges are about 1/2" deep, it'd have to do some pretty good deforming, or break out the wedges from the floor to move forwards. However, all of those are possible in a panic stop.

I'm liking the idea of a bar to secure it to the bulkhead better. Needs to have a removable top so you can get it down over the bar, or maybe the bar itself is removable. Nah, bar has to be solid, so some way of attaching the bar at the top to preclude both vertical & forward motion. Maybe make the top of the bar swivel so it'll fit through the handle, then attach to the bulkhead with a catch or something.

I'll think about it for a while, our next road trip's not for months (the San Juan Islands trip).

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
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Response Posted - 04/06/2009 : 19:15:49

Oh, I see, the wood wedges the toilet so it can't go forward. Nice design and a very nice installation. Also good you didn't need to trim the door.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/06/2009 : 19:55:16

I thought about this one the way home just now. I think I have a relatively easy solution to the panic stop & vertical movement problem. Some sort of screw in stop that rests on top of the upper reservoir's carry handle to tie it down to the back bulkhead of the head to prevent it from moving in extreme situations. I like that idea better than a bar connected to the floor. I still need to figure out how to make the stop, but it might be as easy as a custom made piece of wood that engages the handle, but still not sure how it'd attach to the bulkhead. Could simply be velcro. For that matter I could double side tape velcro to the bottom of the lower reservoir and the deck.

Problem solved, and you'll never see it. Vertical motion will be perpendicular to the velcro, which should be just enough to stop it from moving in a heavy chop situation, and it'll be in shear in a panic stop situation where it's strongest.

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
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Response Posted - 04/06/2009 : 20:35:59

Velcro, truly one of the wonders of the modern world.

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piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 04/07/2009 : 14:30:17

David, Nice job. Cant wait to test it out!

I use bungee cord to keep mine from going forward.
Steve A

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/12/2009 : 00:51:49

A couple more pictures of the install showing how the wedges engage the reservoir:

I also picked up some "industrial strength" velcro at Lowe's today, but that was on the way home, I'll install it the next time I'm down to the boat.

Edited by - delliottg on 04/12/2009 00:53:16

Nautiduck
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Response Posted - 04/12/2009 : 08:21:39

I see how the wedges fit now. That thing isn't going anywhere. Nice job!

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Dave Brown
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174 Posts

Response Posted - 04/12/2009 : 16:41:52

Bpot/ Port-a-pot.
After filling the "top" of my new Por-a pot, and making an "H" frame, with 3" sides, and back, Screwing that down to the floor, Then placing the Port-a-pot in place, I put the boat into the water for the first time. ( I just pick this boat up this winter. ) We and some friends went sailing.
WELL--the wind picked up and guess what happen, the boat did one of those lean over things, and the POT tipped over!! To the STB side.
So, with the upper tank-full, and the bottom tank empty, I have a problem. Only clean water came out.
Any thoughts. We just placed a large bag on the STB side of the tank for the day, but something must be done to fix the Prob.
Delliottg, Have you had the same Prob??

Dave B.

________________/)_________________/)_________/)))))_____________

.

Edited by - Dave Brown on 04/12/2009 16:43:24

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/12/2009 : 16:48:49

Dave,
Well, we haven't had the boat out since I've installed it. We broke our tiller last time out & I'm in the process of making a new one (separate thread if you want to read about it).

Being top heavy is one of the things I'm worried about, so after noodling on it for a while, I'm going to install "industrial strength" Velcro on the base of the waste reservoir to stick it to the deck in the head. I think as it gets loaded, the movement of the weight from the top to the bottom will steady it out.

Theoretically, even if it's upside down it shouldn't leak, but I don't want to test it in "live" conditions to find out. I know for a fact that the upper reservoir will leak if it's not sitting flat, it has vent holes & the flush mechanism is open to atmosphere.

Edited by - on

Dave Brown
Navigator

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174 Posts

Response Posted - 04/12/2009 : 17:12:01

The Port-a pot I have , the bottom has a slight recess in it, But I like the thought.
I'll give that a try.
D B.
_______________/)_____________/)________________/))))____________

.

Edited by - on

Dave Brown
Navigator

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174 Posts

Response Posted - 04/15/2009 : 10:58:35

I tryed the Velcro, and it still tipped over. Maybe more velcro-- but I added a storage bin to the port side of the port-a-pot, took the boat out and tryed to tip it over ////. With the bin in place, NO tipping.
Let me know how it worked for you.
Dave B.

_____________/)______________/)__________________/))))_________

.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/18/2009 : 17:48:18

Well, I installed the Velcro today, we'll see how well it works.

I spent some time to clean both the bottom of the toilet as well as the deck in the head very-very well so I'd get good adhesion. Then I spent some time to cut the Velcro to fit quite closely:

I filled the top reservoir with around four gallons of water to provide some weight to keep the Velcro's adhesive tape compressed. I'm assuming it's PSA (Pressure Sensitive Adhesive), so I'll let it sit that way for a while to get the best chance of it sticking well.

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Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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2980 Posts

Response Posted - 03/12/2010 : 05:15:33

Looks like some bungee straps might be in order.... oh yeah... I love bungee.

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jlannutti
Navigator

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102 Posts

Response Posted - 03/12/2010 : 06:02:48

Which model of the bi-pot did you use? It seems that the clearance for the locker door is just right.

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Dave Brown
Navigator

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USA
174 Posts

Response Posted - 03/16/2010 : 21:15:56

I don't have the name of the BI-pot/or boat at home now, but I picked it up from the loco camper dealership. I did set it in place and try the door, befor I built My "H" frame. I did.nt buy the small one, a larger one work's and the door still opens.
ps. I did'nt use the velcro, nore did I use straps, I built an "H" frame with 6" sides, see above ____/)__/)__/)))___ then placed a tupperwear/storage container to the port side, for 2 reasons. 1 for towels and storage. 2 it helps keep it in place. no tipping.
Velcro, I'm sure it works, but with all you need to keep it in, it's got to be a bear to take it out. and we use our's like it should be used. ( YA YA you did'nt need to know that did' ya.)
good luck.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 03/16/2010 : 21:50:25

I thought I'd answered this a while back, sorry.

We used the 5 gallon (39 liters) version, and I think we bought it from JC Whitney?

Edited by - on

MartinJW
Navigator

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USA
241 Posts

Response Posted - 03/31/2010 : 11:08:48

We secured our porta-pottie (similar size) via Velcro for the past two seasons, and it's working great thus far.

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