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GPS on sale at WM

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Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2010 : 12:43:22

The difference between the GPSMap76CSx and CX is the barometer and altimeter, that's all. And yes, if you want charts from Garmin they cost around $100 for an unlock code for your area. Interesting ideas about using others software. There are also unlock codes for downloading the Garmin charts for free from the internet (Google Garmin unlock codes) but all they do is allow you to download them to the MapSource software on your computer, they will NOT work to get those charts onto your handheld. You NEED a specific unlock code for that for each chart area. So while you may be able to use them on a laptop on your boat, that defeats the whole purpose of a simple handheld unit. Garmin ain't givin' anything away.

Edited by - on

Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/04/2010 : 14:45:17

You may also be interested in this: http://forums.catalina.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?t=120188

Heck, I send so many new C25 guys from co.com over here, more of you guys oughta hang out there, too. www.catalinaowners.com

Edited by - Stu Jackson C34 on 07/04/2010 14:45:36

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 07/05/2010 : 06:41:57

I think you sent me here from there 4 years ago now Stu

and I visit over there occasionally.

Edited by - on

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 07/05/2010 : 12:08:54

The Garmin handheld product line has always been so confusing to me. I feel like their product descriptions are always worded so misleadingly, so you can't tell whether they're including marine charts or not with any given model handheld (usually it's not included). WM's description for the 76Cx is similarly misleading, but if you read it very carefully you can see that you pretty much need to buy marine charts separately, which makes it a not-so-great deal for sailors.

Last November WM had the Oregon 400c on sale for $299 with coastal marine charts pre-loaded, and even though I did not have a boat yet, I grabbed it, mainly because I did not want to hassle with purchasing separate marine charts for another model. I have no regrets - it has worked very well for me (virtually indispensible getting started in an unfamiliar river), and I have figured out how to interface it with both SeaClear II and OpenCPN so that I can plot routes on my PC, transfer them into the GPS, and even run them together with my netbook in the cockpit if I want a wider view than the GPS alone will provide. Those who don't like a touch screen could consider the Colorado series - I understand that the Colorado 400c also has coastal charts pre-loaded. But not sure if you can find either of these models any more.

The main complaint about the Oregon and Colorado series is that their screens are not as bright as the 76Cx. However, they are much higher resolution and also greater bit depth (i.e., more colors), leading to clearer depth markings and more realistic charts. I have not had a problem with the dim screen. On the rare occasion that I am in bright sunlight, I have always been able to get the screen angled to see the screen in reflective mode, which requires no backlight at all.

If you have a pedestal guard, I highly recommend that you buy the $10 bicycle handlebar mount and put it at the top of your pedestal. The Oregon does NOT float, so you want it firmly mounted in your cockpit. The bicycle mount does this perfectly, and allows you to pivot the device for good viewing standing, sitting, as well as optimizing the transflective screen for different lighting conditions. Plus it's easily removable at the end of your sail for secure storage. (I make sure to store mine in a cell phone pouch with "WaterBouy" inflatable flotation, just in case it ever goes overboard.)

If you're going to have to buy Garmin's Bluecharts anyway, one option that has always intrigued me (but I cannot vouch for whether it would work) is to get one of Nuvi 500-series models, which are waterproof. It seems to me that this could give you a much larger, nicer display with touchscreen for about the same price point as their much smaller handheld GPSs.

As for the free PC-based chartplotter software, if any of you can suggest any free/low-cost software for Windows (besides Seaclear and OpenCPN, which I already have), I'd love to try it out. There's a good discussion on this topic over at Sailnet:

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/electronics/60681-free-noaa-charts-nice-chart-plotter-free.html

Edited by - TakeFive on 07/05/2010 12:22:33

TakeFive
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Response Posted - 07/05/2010 : 12:48:09

I'd appreciate it if Peter could let us know whether the Garmin 76Cx comes with marine charts pre-loaded. When I look at the WM listing, I cannot tell. This is what I mean by confusing.

This part makes it sound like you need to buy marine charts:
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">You can also purchase new microSD cards that are pre-loaded with MapSource® Topo and inland lake maps, BlueChart® marine cartography, and City Navigator™ street maps.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
...but then this part makes it sound like they <s>are</s> might be pre-loaded:
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Please note: Garmin mapping units come with built-in, permanent basemaps that cannot be altered. These basemaps come in a variety of global designations (i.e., Atlantic basemap). Please see your local dealer when purchasing a Garmin mapping unit to ensure that you are purchasing one with a basemap that's appropriate for your location and needs. Factory-installed basemaps cannot be altered.

Standard map coverage includes

1. Oceans, rivers, and lakes (greater than 30 sq. miles)...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
It is really frustrating that you can't tell what you are actually buying.

Although I'm not in the market for another handheld GPS, I may recommend this to friends if I can figure out whether it includes full marine charts.

Edited by - on

Harleyworker
1st Mate

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USA
73 Posts

Response Posted - 07/05/2010 : 14:36:34

I have a lowrance, and like garmin it came loaded with "base maps". These are just that, they show a body of water and that's it, no markers, no channel bouys, no depth contours. I had to buy the inland lake region chip for my area to get all the detail.

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Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5378 Posts

Response Posted - 07/05/2010 : 18:02:02

As I mentioned, I got the GPSMap 76CSx. As Harley mentioned, NO MARITIME CHARTS come with the unit, only base maps.

It was about 100 degrees out today and no wind, so I hung out indoors and programmed about 50 waypoints into my GPS using charts, some old Maptech charting software and my other GPS (with real life waypoints).

I was able to transfer basic waypoint Lat Long info from the Maptech software, but had to manually enter meaningful names (RN'10' just doesn't cut it) and additional descriptions (what bay, town or island is nearby?)

Aside from the data entry tedium, the Garmin user interface is clumsy and arduous to use. Spelling names using a rocker and an "enter" key really stinks!

Edited by - on

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 07/05/2010 : 18:18:07

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Voyager
 As I mentioned, I got the GPSMap 76CSx. As Harley mentioned, NO MARITIME CHARTS come with the unit, only base maps....Aside from the data entry tedium, the Garmin user interface is clumsy and arduous to use. Spelling names using a rocker and an "enter" key really stinks!

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
OK, now I'm starting to learn Garmin-speak, and realize that "base maps" are much less detailed than charts.

The clumsy and arduous interface is limited to non-touchscreen handhelds (including the Colorado, unfortunately). The touchscreen Oregon models offer an onscreen keyboard that allows you to easily tap out letters. The comparative reviews of the two point out that the Oregon is superior in this regard. Example:

http://garminoregon.wikispaces.com/Colorado vs Oregon

I would suggest that anyone looking for a handheld for coastal sailing seek out a good price on an Oregon model with marine charts pre-loaded (typically noted by a "c" at the end of the number, I think). This will save you the money of an additional purchase for charts. If you are in an area that requires you to purchase charts anyway (like inland lakes), this consideration is less important.

Edited by - TakeFive on 07/07/2010 10:50:45

Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/06/2010 : 10:35:50

http://forums.catalina.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?p=729484&highlight=laptops

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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5378 Posts

Response Posted - 07/09/2010 : 22:20:24

I took the Garmin out on Passage today and to my delight, when I zoomed in while passing several Aids to Navigation (ATONs), there they appeared on the screen.

If I have my paper charts, then all I need are real time position and the ATONs, and I will be able to chart my position with great accuracy.

I'm starting to like it more and more.

One thing I noticed is that all my charts use a geographic reference system called WGS 84, and the GPS allows you to set the coordinated to this setting.

Unfortunately, my chart plotter software on my laptop uses a different system (NAD83), so any waypoint I plotted on the laptop was a few tenths of a minute of arc off in the GPS.

So Race Rock showed up about 100 yards to the SE of its actual position on the GPS and my charts. This is not good, because the error is just as likely to be the opposite, which could put me up on a reef in a fog.

Thank be to the almighty that I noticed this, otherwise I could have been up Stinky Creek without a paddle!

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9081 Posts

Response Posted - 07/10/2010 : 08:33:50

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Voyager
 ...So Race Rock showed up about 100 yards to the SE of its actual position on the GPS and my charts. This is not good, because the error is just as likely to be the opposite, which could put me up on a reef in a fog...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Maybe that's why there's a tugboat up on the rocks inside of the red nun NE of Race Rock (Race Point Ledge). It belongs to a guy from New London bringing home the tug he had just bought in Baltimore.

When were you around Race Rock??

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 07/10/2010 08:35:41

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5378 Posts

Response Posted - 07/10/2010 : 19:41:53

Dave,
I haven't been there in a while. I am planning an eastward trip in August however, depending on my contract at work.

What I meant was when I was plotting waypoints using my Maptech Offshore Navigator navigation software (using NAD 83) connected to the new GPS (using WGS 84), the discrepancy at Race Rock showed up as described above.

Unfortunately, I cannot use the PC software with the GPS because the reference datum is not resettable (as far as I can tell), and I will not run my GPS using NAD 83 reference.

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Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/12/2010 : 11:56:29

http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5747.0.html

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Voyager
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USA
5378 Posts

Response Posted - 07/12/2010 : 15:35:20

Stu
I read enough from the c34 forum to be dangerous. I bought the Maptech Offshore Navigator product about 3 months ago from WM for $9.99 on a closeout, and thought hey, what the heck!?

I found that the Maptech product complained about the tidal current data, and it sits around for a while, then it opens the product. I always use NOAA's Tidesandcurrents.com to get up-to-date current predictions. Usually, if the chart shows average current speed, you do a little mental math based on tide height deviation to get current deviation. I have tide data on the GPS.

The other major problem I have with Offshore Navigator is that it uses NAD83 instead of WGS 84 for the map datum, and that's why I reported the 100 yard error (more or less) if I use it to program my GPS.

Any idea how to get aound that problem?

I also read about how to get current updates.

Edited by - on

Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/12/2010 : 17:57:41

Bruce, I just Googled "wsg84 chart datum" and came up with this from the Babel website:

Marine charts are published in varying chart datums. Generally in Australia there are 2 major types of charts. More recently produced/updated charts have been converted to metric soundings and use the WGS84 chart datum for latitude and longitude. Older charts have soundings fathoms (1 fathom = 6 feet) and the chart datum can be varied but are generally not WGS84. This requires the user to make adjustments to latitude and longitude data taken off the chart before entering this data into a GPS. Generally these correction factors are noted on the chart and can be manually added to any readings taken off the chart.

I'm sure with a little bit more poking around you can find it.

Edited by - on

Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/12/2010 : 18:05:16

The other major problem I have with Offshore Navigator is that it uses NAD83 instead of WGS 84 for the map datum, and that's why I reported the 100 yard error (more or less) if I use it to program my GPS.

Bruce, I just checked the HELP screen on my Offshore Navigator Lite. Read yours, do a search on datum. There's a long explanation. TOOLS, Datum Calculator (Reading the manual again, darned boys!)

Also, I'm sure you're aware of the dd mm ss and dd mm.mm

Edited by - Stu Jackson C34 on 07/12/2010 18:10:37

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