Association Forum - 2010 Nationals

Assn Members Area · Join

Home.

Association Forum

Ships Store

Cruising

Racing

Technical Tips

Photo Gallery - New

Boat Search - Updated

Manuals & Brochures

Swap Meet

Links

Officer Flag Line & Staff

Bylaws & Constitution

Members Area

Join the Association

Notice:
The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.

Association Forum

Username:	Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

All Forums

Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

2010 Nationals

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Author

Topic

JimB517
Past Commodore

Member Avatar

USA
3285 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/02/2010 : 12:32:17

Its fast getting time for the Nationals. If you are thinking about doing it, please get your entries in. If you have any questions, please fire away.

So far we have 2 25s, 1 250, and 2 Capri 25s

Come on we need some more

Indiscipline 1978 FK SR #398

Edited by - on

djdurrett
Navigator

Members Avatar

124 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2010 : 13:14:31

Loan me a trailer and I will be there...

Edited by - on

dave holtgrave
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
427 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2010 : 21:12:45

jim

is there any catalina 25 owners out there that would want a seasoned skipper to sail their boats??

i'd gladly pay the entry fees as long as the owners sailed with me.

this ciould really spark some interest.

i'll be in your area aug 17-24 maybe we couls hook up and discuss and detail further

dave holtgrave
5722 sk/tr
sailing a hot carlyle lake in southern illinois.

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 11:29:15

I may be able to arrange for you to borrow a boat. However, I don't think the owner would want to be on board. The boat is a 1985 tall rig fin keel. Good dacron sails, roller furling, 6 HP Nissan. This would be a tough boat for me to beat. Boat is clean, bottom is clean. It is only used a few times per year.

I'll write to the owner and see.

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2010 : 08:13:44

Time to get your entries in for the Nationals. I think we are up to 4 maybe 5 C 25s/250s and 3 Capri 25s.

You can do it on line

http://www.catalinanationalregatta.com/

email me or call with any questions.

Edited by - on

aeckhart
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1709 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2010 : 12:42:02

Jim,

How do you account for the fact that, in the Cleaveland Nationals, at least in the first year, we had 10 or 11 C25's, and in the heart of Catalina country, there are only two signed up to race? I would have thought that at least your fleet would be represented in total.

Al

Edited by - on

Peregrine
Admiral

Members Avatar

830 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2010 : 16:50:42

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by aeckhart
 Jim,

How do you account for the fact that, in the Cleaveland Nationals, at least in the first year, we had 10 or 11 C25's, and in the heart of Catalina country, there are only two signed up to race? I would have thought that at least your fleet would be represented in total.

Al
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

What year was that?

I do hope that the great sailing weather in Southern California attracts more of our members to participate.

Edited by - on

andy
Navigator

Members Avatar

USA
228 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2010 : 17:54:42

We have 5-8 C25's usually participate in our club races... and we don't even have a fleet. I think we'd have at least ten local boats signed up if we hosted. If anybody wants to come to Payette Lake in McCall,Idaho next year, we'll do the nationals. Or we can incorporate it into our Payette Cup regatta in June. I really don't know how you can call it the "Nationals" with only a couple of boats participating. If you could guarantee 15-20 racers this year, I'd make the trip.
We've had GREAT

sailing this season.

http://mhyacht.com/Race_Results.html

Edited by - andy on 08/16/2010 18:01:53

Peregrine
Admiral

Members Avatar

830 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2010 : 20:50:58

"...and we don't even have a fleet."

Why not start a fleet?
The bylaws give preference to fleets who want to host the Nationals.
A well attended Nationals would do the Assoc. proud.
Step up to the plate instead of criticizing those who are doing their best to be a host to our National Regatta.
The call for hosts always goes out a year before the regatta.
We did not hear from you.
We would be glad to hear a request from you to start a fleet and a bid to host the Nationals.

Edited by - Peregrine on 08/16/2010 20:54:18

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
9082 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2010 : 21:32:15

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Peregrine
 Step up to the plate instead of criticizing those who are doing their best to be a host to our National Regatta.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Did he not just "step up to the plate"? And where did he criticize anyone? And why should he "start a fleet"? He might very well already have as much of one as anyone there needs.

I'll be sorry if my friend Jim B's regatta doesn't bring in a nice number of competitors, but that's the nature of Catalina 25-footers. It has nothing to do with him, and Andy never implied that. The few racers (most with fin keels) mostly don't have trailers (just as Jim doesn't), and the folks with trailers and heavy-duty tow vehicles (for the most part) aren't into racing or giving up a week of their family vacation time to do it. That's the nature of the beast--it is not a J-24 that serious racers will tow around the country to regionals and nationals. It isn't even a one-design boat. No single venue or organizer will overcome this issue.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 08/16/2010 21:34:05

Peregrine
Admiral

Members Avatar

830 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2010 : 21:54:11

"Did he not just "step up to the plate"? And where did he criticize anyone? And why should he "start a fleet"?"

The bids for the Nationals are open to all "Members" with a preference going to local fleets.
This is the first time we have heard from "Andy" regarding the Nationals.
Curious that we are now hearing strong objections to the current host of the Nationals. Jim Baumgart served our Assoc. well as Commodore.
I do hope that those that can and want to host the Nationals or want to host a "regional" regatta, that the officers have recently approved, will step up and get their members involved in a competitive regatta. We welcome their bids.

Edited by - on

Peregrine
Admiral

Members Avatar

830 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2010 : 22:14:59

VII. NATIONALS:

The National Championship Regatta is an annual event hosted by a Fleet and that is sanctioned and sponsored by the Association. 
It is not an Association event and, therefore, is not guaranteed to occur every year.

The Vice Commodore, acting as NOC Chairman and by any means deemed effective and appropriate by the Officers, shall issue a call for Fleet bids to host the Nationals for the following year by April 1.
Fleet bids to host the Nationals shall be submitted in writing to the Vice Commodore by June 1 for a vote of the Officers (Article VIII, Section B) by June 30. 
If no satisfactory bid from a Fleet has been received by June 1, then bidding shall immediately be opened to non-Fleet organizations desiring to host the Nationals.
The Vice Commodore and the Chief Measurer serve to help the winning Fleet coordinate and promote the Nationals. Every effort will be made to secure the participation of those Fleet representatives most responsible for previously coordinating the hosting of the National Championship Regatta.

The Association's sponsorship of the Nationals also comes in the form of temporarily funding upfront expenditures and deposits, and provision of a “stop gap” for any reasonable losses incurred by the Fleet for hosting the Nationals. The reasonability of such losses remains the sole discretion of the Association Officers. Additionally, the hosting Fleet shall be allowed to retain any profits generated by the event after a full accounting has been provided to the Officers.

The Officers shall make every effort to solicit bids to hold the Nationals on an East, Central/Mountain, West, East time zone rotation in order to attempt to provide the greatest number of Regular Members a chance to compete for the title of National Champion.
If no bid has been accepted by the designated rotational time zone by June 1, then bidding will be opened to include all time zones with preference going to the time zone not most recently hosting the event.
In relation to this section, Indiana shall be considered in the Eastern Time Zone, Arizona in the Central/Mountain Time Zone, and the 2006 Nationals shall begin the rotation in the Eastern Time Zone.

The officers have made every effort to solicit bids from all "members", the 2010 Nationals were awarded in good faith as have the 2011 Nationals.
The next open "Nationals" will be awarded for 2012. Please consider submitting a bid.
Regional regattas are open to any and all fleets and members. Please submit your bids.
We welcome any and all bids to host future regattas, with the caveat that local fleets have priority.

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2010 : 07:23:55

Don't get your feathers ruffled. Nobody is criticizing Jim. Al simply wondered at the small numbers given the concentration of C25s in Southern California. Andy just invited the Association to his lake for next year.

Are you saying that the 2011 nationals venue has already been decided? Where?

Edited by - on

Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1181 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2010 : 08:34:16

I think the numbers in participating in San Diego are primarily low due to the C25 population being so spread out. Fleet 7 has members all over SoCal and as far east as Arizona. Getting to San Diego is no small feat unless you have a trailer and rig. I consider myself local but still will have to sail 40 miles just to get to the venue and another 40 back. Thats okay I enjoy cruising. Racing not so much and I imagine others feel as I do or there would be more C25s racing. Other than Jim I do not know of another C25 or C250 that races on a consistent basis around here. Capris do race around here but their participation in the association has been very sparse. Throw in time and money considerations and the numbers able and willing to participate decrease further.

Edited by - Sloop Smitten on 08/17/2010 09:56:56

andy
Navigator

Members Avatar

USA
228 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2010 : 11:46:00

Guys... I didn't mean to put the outboard in the cesspool and certainly didn't mean to be critical of Jim. In these economic times, he's got an impossible job. I calculated what would cost me to get the boat to San Diego (which would be a fantastic and fair venue)and it was out of the question. Dave hit the nail on the head. C25's are not Melges 24's. Guys who like to race (like me) race them in club races on their home water... they don't trailer them half way across country to a national event. Sponsored rich guys do that with their race boats.

We have been discussing forming a fleet and probably will. We have 10 C25,s in the marina. I believe I could also garner enough support from our club to host the nationals. They had the C22 nationals on Cascade lake (28 miles south of us) in '03 or '04. McCall is a beautiful resort town. I'm not sure how fair the venue would be however. Payette lake is very challenging wind wise. I've been sailing on it for ten + years as have the best racers in our club. Local knowledge is critical...just like San Francisco. If we hosted the nationals... and nobody came, I don't see how one of our club members winning could claim a national championship...because it wouldn't be. I know for a fact that there are C25 racers out there who NO DOUBT could motor us on their home water.

Ok...I'm off the soapbox now.

Edited by - on

Peregrine
Admiral

Members Avatar

830 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2010 : 15:42:07

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by John Russell
 Don't get your feathers ruffled. Nobody is criticizing Jim. Al simply wondered at the small numbers given the concentration of C25s in Southern California. Andy just invited the Association to his lake for next year.

Are you saying that the 2011 nationals venue has already been decided? Where?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Yes.
There is a post in the General forum under [url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=21341"]Bids for the 2011 Nationals.[/url]

And a notice in the Racing forum under [url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=21704"]Association Racing[/url]

No ruffled feathers.
We encourage all members and local fleets to participate in hosting either the Nationals or a "Regional" regatta, a new opportunity for racing that the officers initiated this year.

Underlined words are HOT links.

Edited by - Peregrine on 08/22/2010 17:00:39

Peregrine
Admiral

Members Avatar

830 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2010 : 15:53:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by andy
 Guys... I didn't mean to put the outboard in the cesspool and certainly didn't mean to be critical of Jim. In these economic times, he's got an impossible job. I calculated what would cost me to get the boat to San Diego (which would be a fantastic and fair venue)and it was out of the question. Dave hit the nail on the head. C25's are not Melges 24's. Guys who like to race (like me) race them in club races on their home water... they don't trailer them half way across country to a national event. Sponsored rich guys do that with their race boats.

We have been discussing forming a fleet and probably will. We have 10 C25,s in the marina. I believe I could also garner enough support from our club to host the nationals. They had the C22 nationals on Cascade lake (28 miles south of us) in '03 or '04. McCall is a beautiful resort town. I'm not sure how fair the venue would be however. Payette lake is very challenging wind wise. I've been sailing on it for ten + years as have the best racers in our club. Local knowledge is critical...just like San Francisco. If we hosted the nationals... and nobody came, I don't see how one of our club members winning could claim a national championship...because it wouldn't be. I know for a fact that there are C25 racers out there who NO DOUBT could motor us on their home water.

Ok...I'm off the soapbox now.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Andy,
It sounds like the sailors in your area are prime for starting a local fleet and hosting a Regional Regatta next season(the 2011 Nationals are spoken for). The Regional Regatta is an Assoc. sanctioned event.
If it is successful and your members want to put the work in you could put a bid in to host the 2012 Nationals.
If you need help in forming a local fleet contact me or any other officer and we will be glad to help.
We are actively trying rebuild the fleet structure whether the fleets race or not.
Stay on the soap box and host a regatta or two.

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 08/22/2010 : 13:41:51

I think last year's Nationals had only 3 boats. Last year's National Champion is coming to San Diego. I am really looking forward to the event. 4 boats or 40, for ONCE I will be racing all boats of the same handicap.

Even if it was 5 match races just between me and Steve I would be excited.

Its the nature of the beast. No one is seriously PHRF racing C25s in southern CA. Lots of club races, yes. But racers are in race machines.

We may actually have more Capri 25s entered this year than Catalina 25s. I am very proud of that.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5904 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2010 : 07:17:43

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by andy
 If we hosted the nationals... and nobody came, I don't see how one of our club members winning could claim a national championship...because it wouldn't be.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
If the C25 National Regatta is held at your venue, and you win it, you're the national champion, regardless of how many other boats show up. I have seen other racing classes that have fewer numbers appear at their national regattas than we usually have. But, you can be sure that anybody who goes to the trouble to prepare his boat and trailer it to and from your home venue to race in a national regatta will be the best C25 racer at his home venue, and won't be easy to beat. For the most part, the only guys who will make that much effort are the ones who think they can win it.

The Indianapolis 500 champion is the champion of all the drivers who showed up and raced in it that year, even though there might well be other, better drivers elsewhere in the world who didn't show up and drive in it. The same is true of any national or world championship.

I have raced in six C25 national regattas, and I don't recall any, except the first ever, in 1983, that didn't have at least one or two past national champions participating. It's unlikely that no outsiders will bring their boats, but even if that's true, it's very likely that some excellent racers will want to crew for local racers, and that alone will raise the level of racing considerably. It sounds to me like your lake has good potential as a venue for a C25 national regatta.

Edited by - Steve Milby on 08/23/2010 07:28:39

Topic

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Jump To:

Association Forum

Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.