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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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So you like to keep the old gas?

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islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/29/2011 : 11:50:59

Interesting video on how fast ethanol fuel will absorb water out of the atmosphere. This is probably one of the main reasons many members have engine problems. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaJorLQUuxc& feature=related

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 12:47:39

I think he's misinterpreting at least some of what he's seeing. The drops of water forming on the sides of the bowl above the gasoline and then running down into it are probably condensation caused by the evaporative cooling of the gasoline in the shallow dish metal dish, which is in turn cooled by the gasoline, especially near the surface. I suspect he would see the same effect with non-ethanol gas. It doesn't appear to be phase separation--that's a different process where the alcohol, as it cools, releases water it's holding in suspension within the alcohol-gasoline mixture.

Even with non-ethanol gas, you often see condensation above the fuel on the walls of a tank, caused by evaporative cooling. That's why the vent should remain closed except when the engine is running--to minimize the circulation of humid air as the tank "inhales and exhales" with rising and dropping temperatures.

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JohnP
Master Marine Consultant

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1520 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 12:49:05

There is no question that E10 gasoline absorbs water, which can then separate and harm our outboards.

But what this video showed was gasoline evaporating in the sun in the open air, with some droplets of gas condensing on the cool walls of the metal dish and running back into the bulk liquid. If the day the video was shot was very humid, then it's no surprise that the gas got cloudy in 10 minutes in an open container.

I think the video just shows us the worst case scenario.

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islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 13:35:17

Its definitely water. He does this test in this other video with a fan to speed it up some but you will see the puddles of water in the bottom of the bowl at the end. You will have to wait through the first half of the video to get to the test in the second half.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hOWYSIl3DsU& feature=channel_video_title

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Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 13:43:45

Did anybody read the E-10 myths article by BoatUS? I know that facts rarely dispel opinions and pseudo-science demos, but I'm just curious.. The truth is out there, just ask Fox Mulder.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 19:48:19

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/29/9804028-6-billion-a-year-ethanol-subsidy-dies-but-wait-theres-more

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 21:31:54

So what does this mean for the E-15 battle? The subsidies are going away, but the volume requirements are still there. It looks like the only way we make the volumes is E15+, which puts our current cars, boats, and lawn mowers in jeopardy--including those being built this very day. It's a dilemma for each of us who wants a better alternative to petroleum but owns stuff that can't tolerate the known alternatives.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 06:57:55

http://blog.heritage.org/2011/12/08/and-that%E2%80%99s-why-you-don%E2%80%99t-give-subsidies/

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Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 12/31/2011 : 11:05:18

Gas stations aren't mandated to carry E-15, all cars and trucks made in the last few years will run fine on E-15, E-15 pumps must have an ID label stating that it can only be used in vehicles manufactured after a date that I don't remember right now and it isn't compatible with any small engine equipment. Read the label if you come across it. Better alternatives than ETOH are being tested and will likely replace it over time.

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