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Sten's Harsh Mistress

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/29/2011 : 12:21:47

For inland sailors, here's a brief look at what "blue water" can be...

[url="http://www.soundingsonline.com/news/dispatches/287547-video-the-majesty-of-the-sea"]Majesty of the Sea[/url]

Reminds me of a few times with my windshield wipers running...

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 12/29/2011 12:24:09

NautiC25
Admiral

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USA
957 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 12:33:00

Weak.

lol, wow! I wonder how a C25 would do out there. I'm imagining the hull cracking in half shortly after the mast comes crashing down.

Edited by - NautiC25 on 12/29/2011 12:34:38

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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4024 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 12:35:29

O.K... Now were did I put the Dramamine....

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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3444 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 12:55:35

Interesting that the camera was always on a very stable platform.

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panhead1948
Captain

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345 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 15:12:51

I was on a aircraft carrier the US Kitty Haek. We ran into a storm in the pacific and were taking waves over the flight deck. That's about 90 ft above the flight deck. Yeah it was intense.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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4382 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 17:51:26

Great video! Really does illustrate the power of mother nature. Thanks for sharing Dave.

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DavidCrosby
Navigator

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USA
240 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 18:19:33

Here are some pictures of a very different view. I crossed the Atlantic from USVI to Azores to Scotland. We worked very hard on weather routing and storm avoidance.

If you would like some reading material my blog from the trip can be found at http://webpages.charter.net/morgan300/index.html

Edited by - on

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 19:44:49

Seen a few of those from both a Destroyer's and Aircraft Carrier's Deck (not a weather deck as they were 'out of bounds' during that kind of weather.) Kevin, yep, 90' (or more) but doesn't include the dive! The feeling when the deck is heaving as you descend a ladder is... well, not the most pleasant of feelings!

Odd thing is that I got sea sick every time the weather turned nasty on board the Navy ships, but have never felt that way aboard JD.

(But then, 8' has been the biggest water we've seen.)

Paul

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2011 : 21:26:38

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I was on a aircraft carrier the US Kitty Haek (sic). We ran into a storm in the pacific and were taking waves over the flight deck. That's about 90 ft above the flight deck. Yeah it was intense.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That must have been quite the storm! The worst weather I've ever seen was in the Mediterranean just before we transited the Suez en route to the Persian Gulf. We were taking green water over the bridge wings on our destroyer (four decks up from the water line). It was eerie to stand in the galley (there was no sitting, the chairs were all tied to the bulkheads for good reason) and watch the ship roll through about 80 degrees, and it went on for hours and hours. At one point the starboard side shore power cable reel broke it's welds on the 02 level (ASROC deck, two decks above the waterline). The XO, our division officer and four of us roped up during a lull, and went out to tie it down with several people tending our lines from both the wheel house side as well as the stack side. That was quite the experience. Nothing like trying to tie down a hippo sized reel of cable that weighed over 100lbs/ft while it was being tossed around on the deck. We finally got it and didn't lose it over the side, but it was a near thing and terrifying to do. That storm tore off lifelines, bent stanchions, and removed electrical fittings on the weather decks like someone had run a scraper down the hull. Stunning. We had to put into the yards in Dubai or Manama, don't remember which, to get repairs done.

As that storm was cranking up, we had taken on fuel via UnRep (Under way Replenishment) and had cycled back to lifeboat stations behind the tanker. A Greek freighter lost a man over the side while taking on fuel, we searched for two days looking for him, along with at least a dozen other ships, he was never found. The water was so angry, I don't think the guy ever had a chance, and this was before the storm really got wound up. We were maybe a mile back and off to port maybe 4-500 yards? The skipper got everyone who wasn't on watch up on deck in foul weather gear to get as many eyes as possible, but to no avail. A very lonely way to die.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The feeling when the deck is heaving as you descend a ladder is... well, not the most pleasant of feelings! <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

We stored our bales of rags way up in the fo'c'sle which was directly below the forward escape trunk, so there was about 30' of space below the foredeck about 6' in diameter or so. The bosun's mates (who lived up just aft of this space) had figured out that if you climbed up the escape trunk and jumped as the ship was pitching down, you could drop in "low gravity" and drop onto the bales of rags for a "soft" landing. I tried it a couple of times but not from all the way up, too scary. It was all great fun until one of the guys (called "Stro-bean") misjudged the drop and the ship bottomed out as he was falling. One busted femur later, the practice was banned.

Edited by - delliottg on 12/29/2011 21:40:41

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 06:22:23

Remind me not to show that to anyone! Geez! I'll bet even Lin and Larry would be in trouble. It's all about the weather. Looks like the Captain was just sitting there trying to stay bow to the waves. Would not like to think about a broach. Worst I have seen were 15 footers and the random 18-20 after passing Charleston one trip south. Sliding sideways off of a wave will get your attention quick. T'was at night and I ordered the spreader lights turned on so I could see the waves and run off. Headed towards land and diverted into Savannah. It's all about the weather.

sten

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5902 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 07:19:05

My racing friends just completed a delivery of a +40 footer to Virgin Gorda. I was very concerned about them, because they made the passage around the time hurricane Sean rolled through, but they apparently missed it.

From the following account, it must have been an exhilarating passage.

"The passage to Virgin Gorda went great with nine days of beam reaching in 15-25k of wind ave 6-8k of speed, first from the W and then the Easterlies came through. Commander Weather was predicting a few days of light air, but that never happened. Caught a couple of Mahi Mahis. One night of storms the last night with sustained winds of 30-40k, but the boat handled it fine."

The skipper invited me along, but I declined, and missed out on a fast beam reach almost all the way. Darn!

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 08:15:57

My lady's son crewed in the 2010 Sydney-Hobart... They just missed the worst of a gale that had 100' maxis (well ahead of them) alternately going airborne and then submerging through 30' waves.

Think about how big your house is... then go outside and look at it... and then imagine a 30' wave! Here's the storm they were sailing into:

<center>

</center>

The boat in that pic wouldn't be mine.

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PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 10:07:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Stinkpotter
 My lady's son crewed in the 2010 Sydney-Hobart... They just missed the worst of a gale that had 100' maxis (well ahead of them) alternately going airborne and then submerging through 30' waves.

Think about how big your house is... then go outside and look at it... and then imagine a 30' wave! Here's the storm they were sailing into:

<center>

</center>

The boat in that pic wouldn't be mine.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Since I got the Kindle Fire I've been on a storm sailing book reading rampage. The best so far was 'The Proving Ground : The Inside Story of the 1998 Sydney to Hobart Race' by G. Bruce Knecht.

This book was terrific, I finished it in two days.It highlights the power of the sea and the weight of decisions made by individual crew members and skippers. Worth every penny,I now have a whole new insight on heavy weather sailing and tactics as well as paying attention to weather reports. If you haven't read it I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

Edited by - on

Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 14:37:20

Wow, watching that video I'm thinking to myself how fun it would be to be aboard one of those boats. Of course this is from a naive reservoir sailor with dreams of sailing around the world and no experience in any conditions close to what was shown. So posing the hypothetical; would a properly prepared ocean-crossing designed sailboat be able to survive the storms displayed in the video? It may be a silly question, but it would seem to me that a 40 or 50 foot sailboat would really struggle to stay upright, particularly with that wave the ship was climbing towards the end of the video. What happens if a sailboat gets a big wave on the beam and rolls? Do the keel and mast get torn off?

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5902 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 17:58:32

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Ben
 Wow, watching that video I'm thinking to myself how fun it would be to be aboard one of those boats. Of course this is from a naive reservoir sailor with dreams of sailing around the world and no experience in any conditions close to what was shown. So posing the hypothetical; would a properly prepared ocean-crossing designed sailboat be able to survive the storms displayed in the video? It may be a silly question, but it would seem to me that a 40 or 50 foot sailboat would really struggle to stay upright, particularly with that wave the ship was climbing towards the end of the video. What happens if a sailboat gets a big wave on the beam and rolls? Do the keel and mast get torn off?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I'm pretty sure none of us has been on a small boat in a storm like that. On one of his circumnavigations, in the vicinity of the Cape of Good Hope, Sir Francis Chichester's 57' boat was rolled through 360 degrees twice, without dismasting the boat or ripping off the keel, or doing any other serious structural damage. After both instances, the boat righted itself, and he was able to continue sailing to Australia. Nevertheless, in those conditions, anything can happen. If the boat survives those towering waves, luck and good seamanship have something to do with it.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 18:18:03

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Steve Milby
 . . . On one of his circumnavigations . . . Sir Francis Chichester's 57' boat was rolled through 360 degrees twice . . . After both instances, the boat righted itself, and he was able to continue sailing to Australia . . . Nevertheless, in those conditions, anything can happen . . . luck and good seamanship have something to do with it.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Just as amazing - he did this solo on a ketch (mizzen mast and 2 headsails) in 226 days - at age 65.

Edited by - OJ on 12/30/2011 18:19:37

jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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1484 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2011 : 19:07:43

gotta say...looks a lot like CG to me...

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2012 : 10:57:53

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Ben
 ...So posing the hypothetical; would a properly prepared ocean-crossing designed sailboat be able to survive the storms displayed in the video? It may be a silly question, but it would seem to me that a 40 or 50 foot sailboat would really struggle to stay upright, particularly with that wave the ship was climbing towards the end of the video. What happens if a sailboat gets a big wave on the beam and rolls? Do the keel and mast get torn off?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I believe the most widely recognized classification standards for seaworthiness are the CE (European) ratings, where "Class A" is the top. IIRC, that's a boat that has demonstrated it can withstand Force 10 (~60 mph) winds and something like 10 meter seas--I'm not finding the details right now. There are other requirements such as self-righting ability, storage space for a life-raft, etc...

For crossing an ocean, I'd call "CE Class A" the minimum standard, although people have done it in everything short of a bathtub. Beyond that, the boat has to be properly equipped and prepared for "the worst". In most cases, seamanship is the critical variable. When you're 10 days away from "anywhere", forecasts will have errors, and weather can and will happen. I have friends to whom it has happened--hearing their stories is as close as I need to get!

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