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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

VHFs, coax, and mast wiring.

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vipermagic
1st Mate

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USA
69 Posts

Initially Posted - 04/05/2012 : 06:36:08

So I uncovered the boast last weekend, and drug it out of the yard onto the driveway and started to find all of the stuff I need to fix before getting the boat all wet (for my first time! And her 31st).

I pulled VHF out last fall and cleaned it up some and tested it. It powers up okay, the display works, and it makes all the appropriate beeps, but is there anyway to test its transmit/receiving abilities? Obviously it will need connected to an antenna, which leads me to:

The boat has a VHF antenna on the top of the mast, with a coax cable running down to the deck. It also has a VHF antenna mounted in the back of the cockpit. The PO disconnected both at one point or another with wire cutters. Is it possible to splice these without attenuating the signal too much? I'd really like to use the mast head antenna if possible.

Also, the PO used his handheld quick disconnects on the 4x1 mast wire. What kind of connectors are usually put on here? I'll need to lower the mast annually, so I need some kind of plug, rather than soldering and heat shrinking the wires.

Thanks!

79 C25 #1433 SR/FK - 'Carina' - Destroyed by Sandy
84 C25 #3817 TR/SK
Cleveland, OH

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 07:07:18

Splicing coax will result in significant signal loss, as will adding a male/female connector. Every joint is an opportunity for water intrusion, corrosion, and failure. You can add a connector and through deck fitting if the mast coax was cut at deck level. Uninterrupted runs are the goal, but we have to make concessions for things like lowering the mast, just use as few interruptions as possible. Coax is pretty cheap and I can think of no good reason to have an interruption between a radio and a rail mounted antenna.

This is what I use for mast wiring: http://a248.e.akamai.net/f/248/21700/1d/content.westmarine.com/images/catalog/large/181867.jpg

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JimGo
Admiral

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USA
962 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 07:49:54

Here's a link to the connector order page: http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=11151&partNumber=181867&langId=-1

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Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 08:31:49

I would assume a VHF is like a CB, in that without an antenna connected, do not key that mike! On a CB you'll burn (can, maybe) out your finals. I'm guessing a VHF would be the same?

If I were going to test my VHF, I'd do a radio check on 16 (can annoy some folks), but you have to do this on the water. Again, it's my understanding that it's only legal for an unlicensed person to use the marine VHF while actually on the water. Telecommunications Act of 1996.

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TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 08:36:29

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Joe Diver
 ...If I were going to test my VHF, I'd do a radio check on 16 (can annoy some folks), but you have to do this on the water...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Maybe on a lake this is OK, but on tidal waters doing a radio check on 16 will get you a stern scolding (at least) or a fine (at worst) from the USCG.

Here's a better option if you're in the right area:

http://www.seatow.com/boating-safety/automated-radio-checks

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Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 08:40:26

Yeah, we don't have the repeaters here so the checks come over on 16. It doesn't bother me (or our local USCG guys) but some folks get real pissy about it.

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awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 09:26:06

I just want to point out that there is a long VHF thread at the top of the Catalina 25 forum right now. You might find the top post on page 2 useful, it goes into a lot of details on VHF wiring.

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Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5372 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 10:43:09

I agree that a straight homerun is the only option. It'll work fine with splices for a while, but like your speed impeller in August, it will be gone before you know it. Water, salt or fresh, loves copper. Rust never sleeps.

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vipermagic
1st Mate

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USA
69 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 13:51:03

Jim/Dave - Thanks! That connector is pretty much exactly what I was looking for. I could not for the life of me find it on WM's site.

RhythmDoctor - Thanks for the link. Looks like they don't operate around lake Erie though. Maybe I'll just have to call a friend across the bay or something. Wouldn't want to rub the USCG the wrong way already!

awetmore - I can't believe I missed that. VHF must be in the air today. Thanks.

Voyager - Is there any special splices I can use for the mast? Or is it a losing battle? Maybe gold plated connectors or something?

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GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 19:09:24

Rather than drilling a hole in the deck has anyone ever thought or tried just running the coax down the mast, leading along the handrails, and then coiling it up when not in use? When needed just uncoil and drop down into the cockpit or cabin and connect to the radio.

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TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2012 : 19:20:21

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by vipermagic
 ...That connector is pretty much exactly what I was looking for...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

FWIW, I'm not a fan of metal connectors. When the plug is disconnected it will flop around on your deck, and when metal collides with fiberglass, the metal usually wins.

You might look at [url="http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&product_ID=205&ParentCat=227"]this plastic deck connector from CatalinaDirect[/url].

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by vipermagic
 ...Is there any special splices I can use for the mast? Or is it a losing battle? Maybe gold plated connectors or something?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

You need two male PL259 coaxial connectors, joined with a female PL259 joiner. (I've never seen a bulkhead version of this.) I'm not crazy about [url="http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&product_ID=2203"]the ones at CatalinaDirect[/url]. I think the male connectors should be soldered (not solderless), and I've seen female joiners with a lot more "teeth" that provide a more solid contact. But they're probably fine, unless you want to shop around for something better. Your antenna probably connects via a PL259 plug at the top of the mast.

Edited by - TakeFive on 04/05/2012 19:21:56

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 04/06/2012 : 08:26:47

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 Rather than drilling a hole in the deck has anyone ever thought or tried just running the coax down the mast, leading along the handrails, and then coiling it up when not in use? When needed just uncoil and drop down into the cockpit or cabin and connect to the radio.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I've thought about it. It seems like it is already pretty busy in the narrow area between the handrails and pop-top though (especially if you've got a full compliment of lines going back to the cockpit) and it is one more thing to mess with.

I ordered a Bluesea CableClam so that I can just run my cable and connector all the way through to my radio with no intermediate connector. I don't have to lower my mast on a regular basis though.

Edited by - on

sue
Deckhand

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20 Posts

Response Posted - 05/29/2012 : 05:33:10

As part of our project to install a mast top antenna, we purchased the Bluesea CableClam also with the idea of being able to lower the mast though we planned to set it up with a connector in the boat close to the point where the wire will enter the boat.

2 questions though before we get going.

1- Which size Bluesea Cable Clam will fit the Shakespeare Centerpin® Gold-Plated PL-259 Connector? We bought the smaller size but I am now concerned that it is too small to fit the PL-259 through it.

2- Does anyone have photos or a description of how you routed your wiring through the deck to the radio? Our radio is mounted above the quarter berth just left of the companionway stairs. I think the key will be how to get it through the deck itself.

Thanks,
Sue

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