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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

Any advice on buying a C22?

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NautiC25
Admiral

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USA
957 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/31/2012 : 08:30:36

My brother is in the market for a small trailerable boat. I saw this on the club's bulletin board. I plan to take a look at it this weekend. For such a small price, you really can't lose too much money in a bad deal. I talked to the seller breifly and he says it's in great shape, just needs a cleaning and bottom paint which he'll provide. Anything I should look out for? Should he hold out for a newer, better model, or does it matter?

1989 C-25 TR/WK #5894
Miss Behavin'
Sittin' in LCYC on Canyon Lake, Texas

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dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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4593 Posts

Response Posted - 05/31/2012 : 08:56:58

The price is reasonable, and it sounds like a fair deal. Check for soft spots on the deck. I'd love to see a pic of the fuel tank setup. Unless someone plans to do a lot of cruising involving motoring, I couldn't imagine needing an eleven gallon fuel tank on a C22. Three gallons will last me almost all summer.
Issues to consider are not all that different from a C25. Stainless spreader brackets are good. Check the rest of the rigging, especially inside (shroud eyebolt anchoring, pulling up into the roof?, etc.), window leaks, keel cable, rudder delamination, does all of the lighting work, the usual culprits.
Are there scuppers in the transom. If not, you'll want to add them.
Does it have the optional built-in foam floatation? Easy to check, is thete open space between the cockpit floor and the outer hull? If it has the floatation, it may be too heavy to be a competitive boat in fleet racing. I'm in the process of removing that stuff from our boat.

Edited by - dmpilc on 05/31/2012 09:06:01

NautiC25
Admiral

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USA
957 Posts

Response Posted - 05/31/2012 : 09:14:05

Thanks. I'll check for those and build a list to take with me. Do you have any pics of this floatation thing so I can get a better idea of what to look for?
I'm fairly sure he's gonna want to race.

Edited by - NautiC25 on 05/31/2012 09:14:44

awetmore
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1144 Posts

Response Posted - 05/31/2012 : 10:40:40

A friend of mine with a slip near our C-25 has a C-22. I haven't been out on it yet, we'll probably race it next week in Duck Dodge (this week we took out my C-25).

The galley is strange in the C-22, and it sounds like it is missing in that boat. If he wants to cruise that might be an issue.

It sounds like it comes with nice accessories (autohelm, trailer, good sail inventory, etc). My friend spent less on his C-22 (it was about half the price), but this might ultimately be a better deal.

My friend with the C-22 had a lot of issues with the prop coming out of the water until he upgraded to a extra long shaft motor (from a long shaft). I don't know what the waves are like where you are, but this would be something to check out. Motors are expensive (but cheaper on a C-22 than a C-25).

Keel bolts are harder to get to. We found them by removing a storage drawer near the dinette, and then pulling up a wooden access panel held in place with 6 or 8 screws.

A nice thing about the C-22 is that everything is about 60% of the price of same items on the C-25. Sails, motors, etc, are all a lot more reasonable. However so far my friend with his C-22 (he's also sailed on my C-25) seems less happy with it's performance compared to the C-25 and a C-27 that he used to sail on. Both pointing and light air performance seem to be reduced. We both have similarly worn out sails (my new main should finally be ready tomorrow).

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dmpilc
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4593 Posts

Response Posted - 05/31/2012 : 13:12:59

Keel bolts on a C22 are accessed from under the boat, there are 4 1/4" bolts that hold the hanger brackets in place, just like a C25. Check to see that the radiator hose for the keel cable is in good condition and that the keel winch performs properly. You are looking at a 1977 C22. If it even has a galley, which was optional, it will be a slide-out thing the size of a small coffin on the starboard side that slides back under the cockpit seat, holding a sink, icebox and water tank (the depression on the starboard bunk that looks like a funnel is the drain for the slide-out galley sink). Our galley is in the storage shed, too much extra weight for racing, plus we almost never used the thing. We roll our sails and store them on the starboard bunk. BTW, the cushions are also in the shed to reduce weight while racing.
As for the built-in floatation, no pics but think blown in expanding foam. On my 1975 boat, it fills up the larger storage compartment under the v-berth leaving only the anchor well available, the entire space under the cockpit floor, walled off from the port cockpit storage area (dungeon) by plywood, and the space under the starboard bunk running the length of the cockpit. The idea behind this floatation was that if the boat capsized and filled up with water, it would not sink. I've come close but have not fully tested the theory!

Check the trailer - tires in good condition, bunk wood and carpeting okay, axle straight? If it is an original trailer, it may not have brakes. Mine doesn't. Consider adding a tongue jack to the frame at the rear, especially if it doesn't have scuppers. The forward drains clog easily.
Has the mast step been upgraded - does the mast have the original Frankenstein pins at the bottom and an open bracket at the base, or a removable bolt with wingnut that goes thru the mast and elongated slots in the base? The former makes stepping the mast easier, but be careful to not twist the mast going up or down.
If it has the slide-out galley, there will be a cut-off valve in the piping under the cockpit drains, accessable from the removable step board just inside the companionway. Be sure that cut-off remains closed except when using the sink.
I just noticed that it has pressurized water with a sink in the V-berth. That's an interesting and unusual modification. wouls love to see a pic of that, too.

Edited by - dmpilc on 05/31/2012 13:40:08

awetmore
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Response Posted - 05/31/2012 : 14:59:02

Sorry, my friend's boat is a fixed keel and I just realized that I probably added confusion by talking about the keel bolts. He hasn't had it out of the water yet, so I don't know what they look like from underneath.

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NautiC25
Admiral

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Response Posted - 06/01/2012 : 06:31:49

Thanks for the help guys. I did some research on the foam, so now I know what to look for. Hopefully there's no structural damage because it does seem like a good deal with all the accesories.

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dmpilc
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Response Posted - 06/05/2012 : 09:09:08

So, did you buy the C22?

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NautiC25
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Response Posted - 06/05/2012 : 09:34:57

I kept forgetting to reply to this. My brother came to the club to take a look at it. It's very dirty, which isn't a deal breaker. But, the deck has tons of spider cracks and a few really deep ones. If I were to describe the worst area, it looked like a dried out lake bed. How can this boat get so baked in the sun while other C22's of the same vintage still look ok? I'm not an expert on these kinds of hull repairs, but I'm sure they aren't cheap.

Considering us counter offering $2000, should we still pass? Are the repairs too involved?

Edited by - NautiC25 on 06/05/2012 09:39:34

awetmore
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Response Posted - 06/05/2012 : 12:55:10

Are you sure that the plywood in the deck hasn't failed, and it is spider cracking because it is no longer strong enough? Look and see if it still appears to have it's original shape, or if it is sinking in the direction of the spider cracks.

Do you have any photos?

I bought a dirty boat and that was fine, but dirty and broken wouldn't have been.

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NautiC25
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Response Posted - 06/05/2012 : 14:03:02

There were massively wide cracks on the rails. I didn't bother jumping into the cockpit to find out more.

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GaryB
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Response Posted - 06/05/2012 : 19:14:58

Buy the boat for no more than $2K along with a chainsaw. Cut up the boat, part out the motor, sails, mast, updated interior cushions,VHF, tiller pilot, boom, etc...

Sell the trailer. You should be able to make some money on the deal. The trailer should bring at least $1,000 and maybe $500 - $800 for the motor.

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NautiC25
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Response Posted - 06/06/2012 : 05:44:46

Thought about it, but it sounded like a lot of work for very little payoff. Might be able to squeeze a grand out of it, but there sure would be a mess to clean up, and a ton of parts to hold onto until they're sold. I do want that tiller pilot though.

Edited by - NautiC25 on 06/06/2012 05:45:19

Joe Diver
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Response Posted - 06/06/2012 : 07:35:09

You might ping Eddy here..."eguevara"....he might still have his C22...he told me he was going to sell it once he got his C25 in service....

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