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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Re-Sealing Aluminum Windows..

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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Initially Posted - 01/25/2003 : 16:36:35

In-between trailer fix-up, teak refinishing, rewiring and hull polishing, It's also time to fix the leaky aluminum windows.

I have already purchased the replacment plastic mouldings and sealer from CD.. any advice or pointers to articles on the renewal of the windows is greatly welcomed...

At first glance, it looks pretty straightforward, but I imagine like anything else, there can be some 'gotcha's...

TIA

-- CB

Currently maintaining two holes in the water...'77 Venture 23 and new to the family,
'78 Catalina 25

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2003 : 16:51:51

http://www.catalina25-250.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2231

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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2003 : 20:32:51

Thanks.. that's just what I needed.

-- CB

Currently maintaining two holes in the water...'77 Venture 23 and new to the family,
'78 Catalina 25

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lcharlot
Master Marine Consultant

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Antigua and Barbuda
1301 Posts

Response Posted - 01/28/2003 : 23:41:09

What are these "replacement plastic mouldings"? Is this a complete new window frame that replaces the original factory aluminum frame, or is it just some type of weatherstripping you use with the existing aluminum frames and glass panels?

Larry Charlot
Catalina 25 #1205 "Quiet Time"
Sacramento, CA

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/28/2003 : 23:49:38

"What are these "replacement plastic mouldings?"

These are replacement window items from Catalina Direct.

Vinyl Glazing Channel. This is the "U" shaped extrusion which surrounds the glass. It actually holds the glass into the frame.
<img src="http://www.catalinadirect.com/images/product%20images/vinyl%20glazing%20channel.jpg" border=0>

This vinyl extrusion is the one that installs in the channel just inboard of the glass, inside the boat.
<img src="http://www.catalinadirect.com/images/product%20images/vinyl%20window%20extrusion.jpg" border=0>

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
Cradled on the hard, 200ft from Lake Erie

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 01/29/2003 : 19:22:24

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
It actually holds the glass into the frame.

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
Cradled on the hard, 200ft from Lake Erie
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Don, if someone else on a previous thread hadn't said their glass was NOT epoxied into the aluminum frame I'd disagree with your comment above. Mine are epoxied to the frame - inside surfaces. I just can't imagine how the glass would be held securely, much less water tight, with only the vinyl profiles <img src=icon_smile_question.gif border=0 align=middle> .

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/29/2003 : 19:41:40

"It actually holds the glass into the frame."

"Don, if someone else on a previous thread hadn't said their glass was NOT epoxied into the aluminum frame I'd disagree with your comment above. "

That's not my comment. It was copied word-for-word from Catalina Direct.

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2cc32b3127cce92e981259d130000001010" border=0>
Cradled on the hard, 200ft from Lake Erie

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Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3323 Posts

Response Posted - 01/29/2003 : 20:24:47

I've just rebedded a window after much consultation with Catalina Direct. The U-shaped vinyl is what the actual glass fits into - and it's a real bear to get the sealant down in there and then fit it around the glass! The glass with it's vinyl gasket then fits into the aluminum frame and after the whole window is rebedded in the hull, the other vinyl strip is basically cosmetic to fill the inside space between frame and glass.
Derek (who's window no longer leaks!)<img src=icon_smile_approve.gif border=0 align=middle>

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 01/29/2003 : 21:24:24

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
The U-shaped vinyl is what the actual glass fits into - and it's a real bear to get the sealant down in there and then fit it around the glass! The glass with it's vinyl gasket then fits into the aluminum frame . . .
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Now I understand how the ribbed gasket works. It certainly in no way resembles what hull #2428 came with.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/29/2003 : 21:47:59

I've never had a window out, but this spring I may remove one of the windows. The reason is that a PO replaced the glass in one window with a different material. This one window is not clear and hard like the rest, but tinted brown and flexible. It is also cracking, probably from exposure to the sun. Additionally, this PO came from the smeared peanut butter school of caulking, so not only doesn't it match, but the installation looks like sh#t.

Anyway, my question is, "what kind of glass(size, type,...etc) was originally installed in the C25? What I'll probably do is remove the bad one and the opposite good one and take it to a glass shop.

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2cc32b3127cce92e981259d130000001010" border=0>
Cradled on the hard, 200ft from Lake Erie

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Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3323 Posts

Response Posted - 01/29/2003 : 22:45:23

"and the opposite good one"
Don - if it ain't broke....
I don't know what year your boat is Don, TSU is an '81 and it appears to have regular glass in it. I would take the aluminum frame to a glass cutter and ask him to cut to fit inside the frame, leaving room for the gasket. Maybe CD has replacement glass...
Derek

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/29/2003 : 22:55:19

North Star is an 80' and you are right about leaving the good one alone. I just want to get the proper replacement. As you suggested, I'll give CD a ring and see what they say. Thanks.

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2cc32b3127cce92e981259d130000001010" border=0>
Cradled on the hard, 200ft from Lake Erie

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 01/29/2003 : 23:13:52

I had new (tinted) glass made for OJ by an auto glass store. They used my old glass as patterns. After cutting them out they sent them out to be tempered.

"If it aint broke you're not trying!" Red Green

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Daniel
1st Mate

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78 Posts

Response Posted - 02/01/2003 : 00:06:01

Someone asked about glass type. On my 1980 the glass is 3/16" tempered safety glass. I had a bit of trouble finding replacement, but one windshield shop did have the right kind. It wasn't tinted.

I'm curious: did Catalina Direct recommend using some kind of caulking with the vinyl channel spline (weatherstrip) that holds the glass in the frame? If so, what kind was recommended?

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Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3323 Posts

Response Posted - 02/01/2003 : 10:16:42

Daniel - yes they did - in fact were most insistent that I should use the one they sent - I believe it was a polysulphide, and the small tube was just sufficient to go all around the window.
Derek

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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 02/01/2003 : 10:21:14

Derek, did CD send you enough to do one window... or all the windows?

Currently maintaining two holes in the water...'77 Venture 23 and new to the family,
'78 Catalina 25

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Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3323 Posts

Response Posted - 02/01/2003 : 12:32:02

Clam, I only had one window to do. They do carry larger tubes of it.
Derek

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luckystar
Navigator

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USA
236 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2003 : 00:39:45

I helped a C30 owner redo his this past weekend. I had already removed and rebedded my port side windows to fix a leak four years ago when I bought the boat (turns out the leak was from the cabintop handrail, after I dried it out and rebedded it, the leaks have stopped, so make sure that it really is your windows leaking coz they are a bitch!). I knew my way around the window construction but it still took us 4 hours to get the first one out (figuring out how the PO had poorly rebedded with gobs of 4200 still not fixing the leak which was really in the u-channel stuff). The rest of the windows took only an hour a piece after that. Once you get the hang of it, and I recommend at least two people to help, if anything swab your brow and get beers for you!
We used silicone on the inside of the channel (small bead), silicone bead on inside of aluminum channel and put the bottom on first, then mounted the top half of the frame, one person holds it together, the other puts on the TINY screws and backing plates. be sure to fill the voids around the frame half joints with either silicone or 4200. We used silicone around the glazine channel and 4200 outside and to bed the backing plate. You have to press the corners of the new glazing in several times while the silicone is setting up, but they do stay put after that. It looked great, just like new. As a final safety measure after bedding entire frame with the proper amount of 4200 in the proper place to keep the flange nicely bedded to the cabin top, we smeared a finger with silicone around the outside of the new glazing and getting it on the window as well. The next day when it had set up, we carefully (I mean carefully, you don't want to cut that which you've worked so hard for !!) used a razor blade to make a score and then scraped the leftover silicone residue from the glass. Used a water hose with nozzle and one person looking closely outside and one inside. NO LEAKS!! It's an effort but if you take your time and be systematic about it, it can be done properly. Good luck to all that try it. I'm sure my day will come soon when the sun breaks down my uchannel glazing, UGH!

Patrick Burnett, Little Rock, AR
S/V Lucky Star #2707 1982 SK/SR

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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2003 : 08:36:43

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
"It actually holds the glass into the frame."

"Don, if someone else on a previous thread hadn't said their glass was NOT epoxied into the aluminum frame I'd disagree with your comment above. "

That's not my comment. It was copied word-for-word from Catalina Direct.

<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

When you place the order for the glazing they specifically ask you if you want the sealant as well. It is essentially a life caulk product. They expect you to caulk the living heck out of the glazing, the glass and the frame.

D. Wolff - "The Flying Wasp" #401 sr/sk
Chief Measurer C-25/250 National Assn.
<img src="http://www.flags.com/dreamimages/Flags/measurer.jpg" border=0>

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