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Lifting 9.9 mercury 4 stroke?

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little effort
Deckhand

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Initially Posted - 11/10/2013 : 16:23:01

Our mercury 9.9 2-stroke engine finally died-- a1983 long lifer. We are looking at getting a mercury 9.9 4-stroke with electric start and long shaft, from west marine. We currently have a two spring bracket to lift and drop the old motor which is only about 82 lbs. this new motor will weigh in around 103 pounds and will be a heavy dude, Though Mercury brags that it is the lightest available with elect start and long shaft, Catalina Direct sells a 4 spring motor bracket that is suppose to work for motors up to 105 lbs. Does anyone have experience lifting a 100 lb four stroke motor with one of these 4 spring brackets? How much easier does it make lifting?
Mary on the Cheasepeake

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 11/10/2013 : 16:48:51

Not to answer your question,

but...

I'm pretty sure the Tohatsu 9.8 with extra-long shaft and electric start is lighter and especially with the association discount, less $$. I also believe Merc uses Tohatsu's engine in their small models.

And when you say "long", I hope you mean extra-long (25")--especially on the Chesapeake.

Now back to your question... (Sorry)

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 11/10/2013 16:56:31

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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Response Posted - 11/10/2013 : 17:24:40

It depends on which model of Tohatsu, they vary from 94lbs to 107lbs for the XLS (same one we've got), with the power tilt version being the heavier of the two (ours doesn't have power tilt). The Mercury is the exact same engine, but the Mercury has some nice features that the Tohatsu doesn't (shift on the tiller).

We have a Garelick mount designed for a four stroke, and I really like it. I injured my back a couple of years ago, and I can still easily use the lift mechanism. My 5' tall wife struggles a bit with it, but she can move it up and down as well.

Edited by - on

WesAllen
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Response Posted - 11/10/2013 : 18:21:28

I have the Mercury 9.9 4 stroke (big foot) which gives you the power tilt and 4 blade prop. I also have upgraded to the 4 spring lift and it works very well. IMO it is a great motor and just the right size for my C25. It will push mine about 6 mph at 3/4 throttle for 14 hours at a crack using 9 gallons of gas. I think you can't go wrong. But then I might be partial because I already have it.

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Voyager
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Response Posted - 11/10/2013 : 18:54:29

The Honda 8 four stroke weighs a little over 100# and it hangs off a 4 spring bracket. It is still tough to raise up at the end of the day. I've considered adding a set of blocks to the stern rail or replace the springs. That sucker is heavy! Moves the boat smartly while being miserly on gas.

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panhead1948
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Response Posted - 11/10/2013 : 19:28:10

Check the Tech Tips under outboards. I used the single spring in the second diagram posted by Cokie Bear.

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little effort
Deckhand

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Response Posted - 11/11/2013 : 09:45:20

Many many thanks for this feedback. I will share it with my three other boat partners. I personaly like the Garrick hydraulic lift but will it necessitate adding a block to transom to brace it. Can one tilt the motor with the Garrick lift? Will it enable an extra long shaft to go deep enough into the water? I have heard that the vertical drop and rise in the Garrick is a couple of inches less than the one on the 4 spring bracket from Catalina direct but maybe this is just their sales pitch. As you can tell I am interested in enabling out boat to live up to its name, Little Effort,... What sailing at its best should be!
Mary and Boat partners
Little Effort

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 11/11/2013 : 10:00:29

I think you're right about the vertical travel--Garelick models have generally had less than CD's (from Garhauer). Every inch counts--5" or more to the antiventilation plate is desirable.

The CD bracket matches up to the holes for the original from Catalina, except on the very earliest model years.

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 11/11/2013 : 10:04:27

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Voyager
 The Honda 8 four stroke weighs a little over 100# and it hangs off a 4 spring bracket. It is still tough to raise up at the end of the day. I've considered adding a set of blocks to the stern rail or replace the springs. That sucker is heavy! Moves the boat smartly while being miserly on gas.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Bruce--did you replace the aluminum Fulton bracket I put on? If not, I'll just point out that it's different from any being discussed here, and probably no longer available.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 11/11/2013 10:05:25

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 11/12/2013 : 09:17:22

All of us have opinions about outboard motors. Those with Hondas swear by them. I bought the Nissan (Tohatsu) 9.8 hp, electric start, 25" shaft from Onlineoutboards for our '84 C-25 and was very pleased with it. That motor was only about 5 lbs heavier (93 lbs) than the 9.9 2-stroke Suzuki it replaced. I did change our the 2 spring mount.
The Nissan is very quiet, especially at low throttle.
http://www.onlineoutboards.com/Tohatsu-9-8-hp-Outboards.html

If you are an Association member and buy from them through this website, you will get a discount, if they are still offering it.

Edited by - on

pastmember
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Response Posted - 11/12/2013 : 09:55:29

I have had both...

Bad idea because of inadequate drop range... I like the design but did not consider the application. Buying it was a mistake I did not repeat o my next boat.

This one worked beautifully.

Edited by - on

CarbonSink62
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Response Posted - 11/12/2013 : 12:57:44

I bought the 4 spring Garhauer from CD this earlier this year. It is the one you want.

I have an '05 Honda (118#) that it raises easily. With the motor raised, I can just get the cowling under the stern rail to tilt it. My cowling looks taller than the one pictured in Frank's post above.

Ken

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little effort
Deckhand

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Response Posted - 11/12/2013 : 13:21:38

So when you lift the 93 lb motor with the four spring bracket, does it feel like lifting say 50-60 lbs? Just wondering if the two women could lift this.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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Response Posted - 11/12/2013 : 13:29:44

Using the Garelick bracket I installed on our boat, my wife can lift our Tohatsu 9.8 outboard. It's a bit of a struggle for her, but mostly because she doesn't have much practice at it, not that it's all that difficult. She's 5'-0" & about 125lbs.

I think with a bit of practice to understand getting it into & out of it's detents & the tightening brackets, she'd be able to do it much more easily.

Edited by - on

CarbonSink62
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Response Posted - 11/13/2013 : 13:58:19

Two women? Maybe, maybe not. The bracket makes the engine nearly weightless; maybe 10-20 pounds of upward pull to manage. The issue will be the bracket that locks it up or down.

To raise my engine:
1. Lean over the stern rail; grab the handle
2. Push the handle down a little and aft to disengage
3. Pull the handle (and engine) up
4. Move the handle forward to lock in the UP position

For step 2 the body mechanics are bad for anyone. Lean over, reach down, push out.

Ken

Edited by - on

MrKawfey
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Response Posted - 11/14/2013 : 12:02:19

Ken hit the nail right on the head. I have a Yamaha 9.9 which is just under the 100lb mark and I bought the CD 4 spring mount new when I installed the engine.

Moving the engine up or down in the middle of the travel range is very easy. But the body mechanics of getting the mount out of the detents when it is locked (or into the detents when moving) can be pretty awkward. I don't think that a different motor mount would change this aspect.

I will say that once you figure out some little tricks you should have no problem. For example, when raising the engine, I first stick my foot on the mount handle and push it down and off the detent, then reach over the railing to pick it up.

The are two other things worth noting. First, tilting the engine up is very awkward and requires a bit of strength. This may be specific to the Yamaha though.

Second, the CD mount has two positions at the lower end. The first one is the one we use most of the time and when you lower the motor, you actually have to push down a bit to get it low enough to engage. The second position we only use when it is rougher and we need the motor down deeper. In this case, you have to apply a lot of downward force to get the engine low enough to engage the detents.

Any spring assist will have a level of force that varies depending on how compressed the springs are. It is difficult to design something that gives perfect balance for a wide range of conditions. In my experience, the 4 spring CD mount with a 100lb motor is just about perfectly balanced just below the very top of the range of motion. The further you push it down the more the springs tend to overpower the weight of the engine. At the very bottom it actually takes quite a bit of downward force to overcome the springs.

I suspect that this mount was designed with a 125lb motor in mind. Just guessing, but I think that would create a balance point right in the middle of the travel range and require a small amount of lifting at the top and a small amount of pushing at the bottom.

Hope this helps

Edited by - on

MrKawfey
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Response Posted - 11/14/2013 : 12:07:57

Also, I should mention that this would be a good time to add the support brackets to the interior of the boat when installing the new mount. Even with the smaller 2 stroke, our hull was bowing quite a bit after 25 years. Also, if your hull is very bowed, like ours was, you should not try to compress it flat in one shot. It may be overkill, but I was worried about cracking the fiberglass so when I added the new mount I tightened it slowly over the course of 2 years.

Just a little bit of extra compression each month and after 2 seasons it was flat again. Also, I now remove the motor every winter and store it in the garage.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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Response Posted - 11/14/2013 : 14:06:58

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by MrKawfey
 Ken hit the nail right on the head. I have a Yamaha 9.9 which is just under the 100lb mark and I bought the CD 4 spring mount new when I installed the engine.

Moving the engine up or down in the middle of the travel range is very easy. But the body mechanics of getting the mount out of the detents when it is locked (or into the detents when moving) can be pretty awkward. I don't think that a different motor mount would change this aspect.

I will say that once you figure out some little tricks you should have no problem. For example, when raising the engine, I first stick my foot on the mount handle and push it down and off the detent, then reach over the railing to pick it up.

The are two other things worth noting. First, tilting the engine up is very awkward and requires a bit of strength. This may be specific to the Yamaha though.

Second, the CD mount has two positions at the lower end. The first one is the one we use most of the time and when you lower the motor, you actually have to push down a bit to get it low enough to engage. The second position we only use when it is rougher and we need the motor down deeper. In this case, you have to apply a lot of downward force to get the engine low enough to engage the detents.

Any spring assist will have a level of force that varies depending on how compressed the springs are. It is difficult to design something that gives perfect balance for a wide range of conditions. In my experience, the 4 spring CD mount with a 100lb motor is just about perfectly balanced just below the very top of the range of motion. The further you push it down the more the springs tend to overpower the weight of the engine. At the very bottom it actually takes quite a bit of downward force to overcome the springs.

I suspect that this mount was designed with a 125lb motor in mind. Just guessing, but I think that would create a balance point right in the middle of the travel range and require a small amount of lifting at the top and a small amount of pushing at the bottom.

Hope this helps
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

This is a pretty good write up of how I manage ours. The foot trick is a good one that I use nearly all the time when pushing the engine down into position. Raising it up, I pound the handle with my fist to pop it off of the detent (after releasing the friction hand screws on each side).

Edited by - on

little effort
Deckhand

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Response Posted - 11/14/2013 : 16:35:25

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by MrKawfey
 Also, I should mention that this would be a good time to add the support brackets to the interior of the boat when installing the new mount. Even with the smaller 2 stroke, our hull was bowing quite a bit after 25 years. Also, if your hull is very bowed, like ours was, you should not try to compress it flat in one shot. It may be overkill, but I was worried about cracking the fiberglass so when I added the new mount I tightened it slowly over the course of 2 years.

Just a little bit of extra compression each month and after 2 seasons it was flat again. Also, I now remove the motor every winter and store it in the garage.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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