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2013 Evinrude 4 hp

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redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 10:44:50

<< purified alcohol attracts moisture, not what you want your fuel to do >>

Very good point Islander... That presents a problem, if that is in fact the case. I don't think Naphtha is purified alcohol. I'll ask my brother the chemist...... I wonder if there is any other fuel that would be good as a starter fuel? ( and also be stable )

Probably not... I'd guess that's why they keep the starter fuel in a compressed can..

I wonder why 100% white gas has worked so well for me in Briggs and stratton engines for the last 40 years?? ( only 3 lawn mowers in 40 years ) All winter in the tank and they still crank up on the second pull. And those two died not because the engine quit working..

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

Edited by - redeye on 03/11/2015 10:56:57

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 10:57:06

quote:
I'd guess that's why they keep the starter fuel in a compressed can...

Are you talking about starting ether? Different animal than alcohol. Why do you think you need anything other than gas to start this motor? I think you had 'Old Blue' for too long. That new 4 cycle is going to surprise you.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

redeye
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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:00:41

The Wiki for Coleman Fuel is very interesting!

Says it will destroy your valves..

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:04:18

<< Why do you think you need anything other than gas to start this motor? >>

That also is a very good point..

I should stick with Evinrude's recommendations and see if any problems surface first.

( Oh.. that's right.. that's what I did with all my other engines and the problems led me to white gas as a solution. )

But regardless this is a new deal today and I imagine they have addressed the older problems..

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

Edited by - redeye on 03/11/2015 11:08:27

redeye
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Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:05:45

<< starting ether? >>

Yepper.. I wish the carb had a place to spray the starting fluid in without removing the cowling...

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

islander
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4032 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:07:20

I'm real curious to see how a 4hp will work out on a Cat25. I can only guess that it might take a little longer for the boat to react to the little prop. Going forward is not a big deal if it takes longer to get the boat moving but if you pop it into reverse coming into a dock I don't think it will do much for braking if needed. I'm expecting a full report on this.

P.S I hope the engineers at Evenrude who spent a lot of time developing the engine don't read all of this. If they are I imagine they are jumping out of the upstairs window's....

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

Edited by - islander on 03/11/2015 11:20:32

redeye
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Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:17:38

<< I can only guess that it might take a little longer for the boat to react to the little prop. >>

No question about that .. I was using a 1974 4 hp Johnson ( as well as the 84 johnson sailmaster 6 hp ) with a "standard" 2 blade prop vs. the 3 blade flat prop of the Sailmaster...

and reverse was not very powerful at all.. I once blew the head on this engine trying to reverse out of the gas dock in 15 mph wind. cavitating like the dickens and revving up till the headgasket blew. Not the kind of engine you would use in an area with heavy currents.

Forward was never a problem and in fact it was better than the sailmaster.. Happy as could be moving right along. ( always surprised me.)

This new 4hp looks like it has a similar prop so I'm not expecting to have much of a reverse. ( the prop looks to be a design somewhere between the two, I think... )

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

Edited by - redeye on 03/11/2015 11:55:50

redeye
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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:25:43

I think will keep the white gas in a small metal container and add it to the internal tank only if she will not crank..

Add the special souse if she gets cranky...

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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4032 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:26:32

That looks a lot like this...

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

redeye
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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:26:52

<< engineers at Evenrude who spent a lot of time developing the engine don't read all of this. >>

I Agree

I Imagine they are cringing...

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

redeye
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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 11:45:03

<< That looks a lot like this...Egg beater >>

Ahh.. but that little eggbeater served me for many years!

And cranked every time... ( well ... almost )

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

Edited by - redeye on 03/11/2015 11:48:52

islander
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4032 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 12:03:38

Who took that picture....Sea-Tow?

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9089 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 12:05:55

quote:
Originally posted by redeye

I don't think Naphtha is purified alcohol. I'll ask my brother the chemist......

Two different sources: crude oil and corn. Different molecules

As for your Briggs, those things could burn just about anything, including 2-year-old gasoline. Their low compression could tolerate low octane, while higher compression ratios cause low-octane fuel to ignite prematurely and burn too fast and hot, causing knocking, valve damage, and possible piston damage. I looked up Coleman fuel--it's about 50 octane, which is way out of range. It might fire from the compression alone (prior to the spark), which might help starting but is bad for running. A higher octane rating essentially means the vapor is less "explosive," so it ignites when it's supposed to and produces more usable energy as it burns.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage before going over to the Dark Side (2007-2025); now boatless for the first time since 1970 (on a Sunfish).

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 03/11/2015 12:34:40

islander
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4032 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 12:12:35

Exactly Dave, Thats why I said it could cause engine damage. The Dieseling Ray is talking about is just that. The fuel is ignited on the compression alone. It also doesn't burn across the piston but instead explodes. When fuel does that you hear the 'Ping" or 'Knock" Higher octane fuel has waxes added to slow down the burn rate. May people think that high octane fuel is more powerful but actually it is the opposite.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

Edited by - islander on 03/11/2015 12:21:56

redeye
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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 12:25:52

<< The fuel is ignited on the compression alone. >>

Perzactly..Dieseling which is why it cranks.. and why I would only use it for cranking... ( or not )

certainly not for a running fuel.

But again.. this is as though I anticipate problems cranking with this new engine, which is probably not going to be the case.

I can imagine cranking problems when the air humidity is up to 90%, which happens here in summer in the Deep South...

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

redeye
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Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 12:29:58

<< Who took that picture....Sea-Tow? >>

Nope... that was before sea tow and we had to figure out how to make the engine crank reliably every time...

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

Edited by - redeye on 03/12/2015 03:50:04

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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3758 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2015 : 13:26:55

My inherited 1954 Lawnboy mower started easily and ran fine on whatever fuel was available over the decades (lead, MTBE, ETOH blends) until I hit a stump and broke the deck in the early nineties. I love the myths about all of the magic fuels and evil fuels. Change the plugs occasionally and old 2 strokes are hard to kill.

Dave B. aboard Pearl
1982 TR/SK/Trad. #3399
Lake Erie/Florida Panhandle

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/12/2015 : 03:57:52

<< Change the plugs occasionally and old 2 strokes are hard to kill. >>

THat's part of what bothered me with this deal.. I quit using white gas and the last tank I filled up at the marina was the tank that both old engines quit working ... one backfired, which is something I'd never seen either of them ever do in 30 years.

Next I hear that the marina have just started using some mystery additive in their fuel

So whattdaya know???

And of course the Dealer Owner selling me the engine has some mystery additive I've never heard of that he recommends adding as a stabilizer.

ANyhoo.. I'm excited about having my first new 4 stroke outboard and interested in hearing any myths others have had with theirs...

Sounds like Frank deep sixed his for Electric ( maybe we can hear some battery myths

)

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

Edited by - redeye on 03/12/2015 04:34:08

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3478 Posts

Response Posted - 03/23/2015 : 04:32:28

Thumper is very happy....

Non-ethanol gas in the external tank.. cranked 2nd pull every time. Very quiet ( compared to my old 2 stroke ) Not as smooth as a 2 cylinder but not bad.. Certainly not like what I think of as an old thumper.. I always kinda wanted one of those..

The kids at the dealer said it sounded like a lawn mower..

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

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