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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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$2500.00 Cat-25 in Destin Florida.

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pwhallon
Admiral

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USA
694 Posts

Initially Posted - 11/23/2003 : 11:20:52

http://www.sailboatowners.com/classified/ownerad.tpl?owno=10691907601717934& fno=300& brsku=10691907601717934.2& bd=All& p1=0& p2=1000000& xs=All& l1=1& l2=26& active=T& sb=brand& dr=de& ad=owno

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deastburn
Captain

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USA
334 Posts

Response Posted - 11/24/2003 : 23:46:56

Hmm, a "fixer-upper" for $2500, no sails (add $2000, unless you can find viable used sails), no motor (add $2500 for a 4-stroke and $400 for the mount to carry it). Likely needs a new furler and some new standing rigging. prob needs mostly new running rigging (let's say $400). You still have not paid for bottom paint, instrumentation, a trailer, or time-on-task. And the boat now costs $7800. A really well-maintained SK/SR on a viable trailer can be had for around that money, mid 80's model, around here. Fixer-uppers are not always bargains.

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lcharlot
Master Marine Consultant

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Antigua and Barbuda
1301 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2003 : 00:14:13

If the upholstery cushions are worn out or mildewey, add another $1000 to replace those with a set of 12 new cushions. The swing keel cable is probably at least a few years past it's service life and would need immediate replacement, ditto for the keel pivot bracket and pin. There's another $300, plus yard labor charges. It likely still has the old-style cast-aluminum spreader sockets and light-duty chainplate eyes on the lower shrouds.
And worst of all, it is a Mk. I (1977-1981), which means that even if it were in Bristol condition, it would be worth no more than $4000 by itself, maybe $6500 with a trailer and 4-stroke motor in good working order. This is why I decided not to do the swing-to-wing conversion on my '79 Mk. I. The wing keel would have cost $4000 installed, but the boat would have still been a Mk. I, making it unlikely I would ever be able to recover even a fraction of the cost of the keel conversion at re-sale. Out here on the west coast, old Catalina 22's and 25's that are damaged, missing equipment, in bad overall condition, or have no trailers or engine, often end up being donated to a charity or the Sea Scouts; sometimes you can get more of a tax deduction donating them than cash trying to sell them.

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ppetracca
Navigator

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USA
163 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2003 : 08:39:02

Larry,

Does anyone really fix up their boats with intention of getting their money back out at re-sale? I've always felt that if a boat has depreciated as far as it is likely to, and I don't pay over that amount then I've done well. I consider any money spent improving a boat beyond it's value is the price I pay to enjoy the boat.

I bought my '25 last year for $4,500.00. The bottom was shot. I put another $4,000.00 in the bottom. It had the original main which blew out on the second race I entered. I opted for the Ullman offered by CD which went another $850.00. New canvas for everything around $400.00. That makes me into the boat for around $10,000.00. (There was no trailer in the sale, I share with another member of my club when I need it.) So now I am sure I am over the re-sale value, however my old boat looks brand new, everyone comments on its "dock appeal" and is very fast on the lake. If I should ever sell it, I know I won't get that much for it, so I consider the difference the price of having a fun, attractive boat.

On another note, I can't see myself ever selling it unless I stop sailing all together or move to a larger sailing venue area. It is as big as we need for the dwindling lakes of New Mexico and we can still trailer it. Once the kids are gone it will still serve my wife and I well. Considering we've lived in NM all our lives, moving to the ocean seems pretty unlikely.

One project I have not approached is replacing or repairing all the instruments. It has old SR speed, depth and wind meters. None work. It would probably take another $1,500.00 to replace each one. However, I learned to sail on my '22 without any instruments so I've not missed them, yet. I do use a portable depth finder when anchoring, but other than that I sail by the feel of the wind and boat. It has served me well enough. If I really want to know my speed, I use my handheld GPS.

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matsche
Captain

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USA
280 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2003 : 09:25:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">And the boat now costs $7800.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

If the structure, fiberglass and teak are decent or can be easily restored, then I would condider a 1980 Cat25 with brand new rigging, sails and motor (all of my choosing) a pretty darn good deal for $7800. Besides, the $2500 is just an asking price. Even a nicely maintained boat with orignal rigging, sails and motor is going to need things replaced.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">It has old SR speed, depth and wind meters. None work. It would probably take another $1,500.00 to replace each one.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Not so! Give SR a call. They sent me "replacement" instruments at a big discount. I don't remember the discount off hand, but I'm thinking it was better than 50% off. All you have to do is send them the old display unit (not the sending unit) to prove ownership. And you can replace your old model with any of their new models.

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pwhallon
Admiral

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USA
694 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2003 : 09:26:26

I agree Larry,

If you want a nice boat it's gonna cost some money.

I must say, I dont see the need for a $2500.00 new 4 stroke when you can find nice used motors for $500.00 to $800.00. The big dollar motor on the "fixer-upper" is kind of like putting a $2000.00 set of wheels on a $500.00 car.

Used sails would be fine too.

The rigging and keel hardware are important.

The upolstery does not have to be the top notch Catalina direct stuff either.

And, Who says he's firm at $2500.00. Maybe a grand would buy it. He wants rid of it.

Someone on the Gulf, who doesn't need a trailer, will probably snatch it up, clean it up, and have a nice low $ boat.

Next time I see an interesting ad, I'll post it on the Hunter Page.

Edited by - pwhallon on 11/25/2003 09:29:10

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2003 : 10:26:49

PW, I don't think anyone was disparaging your post...
Folks were just pointing out that bargains can get expensive.

I agree with you, if you have mechanical skills, time and tools, and have the gumption to dig up used equipment, you can fix up an old boat for less money than you'd sink (pun?) into a newer 'bristol' one.

Quite a few people have made their sailing dreams come true in exactly this way. But you gotta go in with your eyes open.

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ppetracca
Navigator

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USA
163 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2003 : 10:36:25

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Not so! Give SR a call. They sent me "replacement" instruments at a big discount. I don't remember the discount off hand, but I'm thinking it was better than 50% off. All you have to do is send them the old display unit (not the sending unit) to prove ownership. And you can replace your old model with any of their new models.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Thanks John...I'll look into that in the new year. I've grown so accustomed to no instuments, it will be high class living if I get them going.

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deastburn
Captain

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USA
334 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2003 : 16:15:23

Clearly, part of the point of bringing back an old boat is the pleasure of doing the work yourself, and the fun of seeing the results of your labor. Time is not always money--sometimes it translates to real plesure.

Still, it is still a good idea to cost out a rehab project ahead of time...

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pwhallon
Admiral

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USA
694 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2003 : 20:39:33

Thanks WOTAM,

It's cool. I just wanted the gang to know what I found. I wasn't trying to sell anyone on it.

I too get into that, "It's got to be bristol" mentality. With that in mind, a well kept older boat is the better way to go. In fact that is what I am looking for. Not a project. I wish I had been able to buy Bruce Ebling's old boat. It was Bristol and a very good deal too.

I spent a ton trying to restore an old Chevy Suburban/silverado 4x4 11000gvw trailering special a few years ago. Talk about a money pit. I bailed out before I started to bleed. I should have kept the engine. 350/327 HIPO heads, edelbrock manifold, Holly 780 4bbl. It was a stomper.

An 8 mpg stomper.

Happy Thanksgiving,

PW

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