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Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Teak and Holly sole again

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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/12/2004 : 08:15:34

There have been a few posts regarding a Teak and Holly cabin sole since Sail Magazine did a story on it last month. This has always been a dream of mine and I actually came into some teak and holly plywood for a real good price. Installation brings, as with any boat project, some questions that could only be answered by other owners of the boat or someone who did the project already. Or in this case someone who read the article

In the article, the guy uses MDO (I think it was MDF) as an under-layment, because “the sole is not level in all areas. QUESTION 1 – with the exception of the head area, do you think I would be able to use ¼” ply in the main cabin area without an underlayment?

The second question directly pertains to the article. It seems this guy used West system to coat the wood prior to installation to “water proof” it. He said he did this on both sides. I read the story twice, but am having a brain fart. Did he just coat the underlayment???? Wouldn’t the use of West-system to adhere the plywood to the sole be enough of a coating? If he did coat everything, it would appear he West-systemed the teak and holly ply prior to putting on the stain or sealant?

Lastly – Lets just say I actually get to the point where everything is installed. How would you coat the surface – Finish stain? A glaze, some other teak treatment?

Thanks for you opinions,

dw

D. Wolff
DPO C25 Hull 401
Currently Sailing "Champagne and Ripple" 1982 O'day 30

Chief Measurer 2002-2006
Vice-commodore 2007

Edited by - on

Earl Landers
Navigator

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USA
157 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 10:42:26

Duane,
Looking at the article in "Sail", it looked to me that the author installed a flat level floor, covering any voids. I don't see how you could get an underlayment to contour to all the bends that exist on our soles, particularly MDO/MDF. How flexible is your plywood?
For your second question, I suspect that he did coat both sides of the underlayment. MDO/MDF isn't water tolerant. When it gets wet, the binders fail and it starts absorbing moisture and swelling. Think of a beautiful teak and holly floor with mumps.

That raises a question in my mind, how do you undo a damaged wooden floor that has been epoxied to the fiberglass sole of a boat? Sanders? Grinders? Flame throwers?

EDL

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 11:57:51

Question: Does this teak and holly floor have grooves to improve traction? I ask this because I know how my wet foot behaves on my Cetol'd companionway ladder

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Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3321 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 12:13:20

"I know how my wet foot behaves on my Cetol'd companionway ladder".

Don - you can buy non-skid adhesive backed strips at Home Depot for .97/ft. I used the 1" width and spaced 3 strips on each step - solves your problem perfectly.

Derek

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
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Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 12:22:15

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Derek Crawford
 "I know how my wet foot behaves on my Cetol'd companionway ladder".

Don - you can buy non-skid adhesive backed strips at Home Depot for .97/ft. I used the 1" width and spaced 3 strips on each step - solves your problem perfectly.

Derek
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Derek,

I've resisted putting non-skid strips on my ladder steps because they look so "purdy"

, but you are right, I should and will put them on for safety's sake.

Edited by - dlucier on 02/12/2004 12:22:40

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 14:23:41

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Earl Landers
 Duane,
Looking at the article in "Sail", it looked to me that the author installed a flat level floor, covering any voids. I don't see how you could get an underlayment to contour to all the bends that exist on our soles, particularly MDO/MDF. How flexible is your plywood?

EDL
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Earl - I've sat on many a crappy day in the cabin looking at things to fix and improve and am fairly certain it would be flat enough. (I have the dinette interior) The area of the sole from the compression post aft to the ladder is flat enough as is the area under the table. The main areas of concern would be the head, including the area under the forward berth and the galley. I think the dip in the sole around the galley can be removed (I don’t know how yet any suggestions would be helpful.) and I do not plan on doing the area around the head.

I’ll have to think about the rest. As for slipperyness – probably no slicker than the fiberglass.

dw

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 14:44:57

Why don't you do something nice with the interior walls with you T&H? I have noticed a lot of boats with planks on their walls, I could see the V-Berth area looking very nice with T&H walls.

Edited by - on

Sea Trac
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Vanuatu
1357 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 14:47:57

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Duane Wolff
 I think the dip in the sole around the galley can be removed (I don’t know how yet any suggestions would be helpful.)<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Duane -- How about a gallon of epoxy? You could lay down a coating of petroleum jelly to facilitate removal later, and roast marshmallows while it cures.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 14:53:16

Duane,

If again my memory serves me, there is a slope in the floor from the ladder to the stove front that might create a void that 1/4" plywood might not stand up to, particularly with a well placed heavy heel.

Like you I also pondered those things that I could do to spice up the interior and a year or two ago I came pretty close to buying a pile of teek veneer on ebay with the intention of covering all of the exposed fiberglass in the main cabin.

Edited by - on

OJ
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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 15:41:03

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by fhopper@mac.com
 Why don't you do something nice with the interior walls with you T&H? I have noticed a lot of boats with planks on their walls, I could see the V-Berth area looking very nice with T&H walls.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

We have a C25 in our marina where the owner applied teak on the interior, on top of the coamings and a few other places. The boat sits so low in the water that you can't see the boot stripe

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Leon Sisson
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1893 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 17:30:17

Duane,

I've thought about doing something similar to my 1979 C-25 w/dinette.
I wouldn't permanently fasten down (i.e. glue) the new floor. What I've done so far is to fit, chamfer, and epoxy seal two pieces of 1/4" marine plywood underlayment for the dinette footwell and flat portion of the corridor. My next step will be to make two more 1/4" marine plywood pieces for under the stairs and the small sloped spot to stbd of the aft dinette settee. For underlayment in the galley, I plan to lay down wax paper as a mold release, and then laminate a few layers of fiberglass roving with epoxy resin. Once all those pieces have been trimmed to fit nicely, they can serve as removable backing for whatever comes next.

I'm considering hand fitted parquet bonded to the underlayment and sealed with clear epoxy. (Do I sound like Martha Stewart yet?

) That would solve the problem of the strangely curved galley sole while sacrificing only the minimum amount of headroom there.

I plan to attach the finished floor panels to the fiberglass sole with ovalhead screws, either countersunk or with trim washers. I have already provided for access hatches on both sides of the swing keel trunk near the pivot area. I think it's really important to allow for easy future access to the bilges, possibly under less than ideal conditions.

If I ever get around to doing anything in the head compartment, I'd make a similar curved fiberglass underlayment, and glue on those 1960's 1" ceramic bathroom tiles with white flexible adhesive like polysulfide or polyurithane.

-- Leon Sisson

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 18:14:55

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Leon Sisson
 ...That would solve the problem of the strangely curved galley sole while sacrificing only the minimum amount of headroom there...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Do you think that the slope/curve in the galley floor is to improve footing when heeled underway?

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Leon Sisson
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Response Posted - 02/12/2004 : 21:57:13

Don,<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Do you think that the slope/curve in the galley floor is to improve footing when heeled underway?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I hesitate to guess what they were thinking. Obviously the swing keel trunk was a big factor in determining the shape of most of the cabin sole. Sudden "steps", like at the entrance to the head compartment, are potential tripping hazards. Maybe a combination of maximizing standing head room for the cook (an important member of the average crew, with a powerful vote in the purchase decision), while avoiding a sharp step, and the heel angle thing.

-- Leon Sisson

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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 02/13/2004 : 07:51:57

I would have guessed headroom maximization

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djnajewicz
Deckhand

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USA
3 Posts

Response Posted - 02/15/2004 : 16:57:57

I have also been thinking of the teak and holly - I was considering cutting out a template of the area just at the bottom of the companion way ladder and the rest of the passageway forward. Using the template to cut out 1/4" teak and holly piece - Sealing the teak and holly cut out with clear expoy and then using some west system epoxy to basically glue it down to the fiberglass sole. Clearly due to the curvature in the galley and ladder area it would need some weights or some struts from the cabin roof wedged to make it confrom to the curvature of the sole. I was then planning to use some teak quarter round to finish the edges where it meets the vertical walls.... any comments - I need to see if quater inch plywood will conform to the curves I was going to try this out with a piece of inexpensive plywood to get the template just right before I mess up my teak and holly.

As an alternative I have prices some 1.5' X 1/4" stips of teak and was consider just "strip planking" the sole.

Any thoughts on either approach

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 02/15/2004 : 17:27:04

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by djnajewicz
 I have also been thinking of the teak and holly...I need to see if quarter inch plywood will conform to the curves I was going to try this out with a piece of inexpensive plywood to get the template just right before I mess up my teak and holly...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

For the curved portions, you might try making parallel kerf cuts on the backside of the test plywood to see if it will make the curve at the galley.

Edited by - dlucier on 02/15/2004 17:28:49

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 02/15/2004 : 22:08:30

Given that the Mk IV floor is flat, I'd have to deduce that the earlier curves were attempts (with a single mold for swing and fin keels) to maximize headroom while accommodating the swing keel trunk, which the Mk IV doesn't have.

I like carpeting--a nice Persian pattern spruces things up some...

Edited by - on

deastburn
Captain

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USA
334 Posts

Response Posted - 02/16/2004 : 21:22:56

I'm with Dave..carpeting. Indoor/outdoor, cut to fit, attached at all corners with snap studs to the floor. It is nonskid, hides the dirt and sand, and makes it enough of a hassle to check the bilges that you tend not to bother (good rationale for finally getting around to installing that auto bilge pump).

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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 02/16/2004 : 22:03:45

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by deastburn
 ...carpeting....makes it enough of a hassle to check the bilges that you tend not to bother...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I access my bilge easily through the aft dinette seat. But I still need to rebuild the pump.

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Raskal
Navigator

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USA
162 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2004 : 18:19:17

No one has mentioned it yet--but the solution here may be Tek Dek:

http://www.tek-dek-international.com/

They don't really have a network of installers in the US yet, but you can get the stuff to do it yourself. The British web sites might give some idea of price ($1=1.8 pounds or thereabouts)

Rich Kokoska

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2004 : 14:49:29

Not sure I like the look of that stuff

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