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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Mast Begot!

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Billyboy
1st Mate

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USA
30 Posts

Initially Posted - 04/01/2004 : 21:42:06

Hello Mates,
Ah, spring does lift the heart, but I need your wisdom on mast be- down, and then, up again.
Did all of the reading, great contributions, text and visuals. But here is the question...Can I lower and raise the mast, safely while at the dock slip? Ok, ok...you experienced folks are now throwing old phone books at the monitor...I get it. But, I have not done it yet, so talk me through it.
Forward to the bow, or back to stern? Anybody done it both ways?
I have the steps and the gear, but I just want to do it, get the job done, and not dink someone's other boat.
Hope spring eternal.

thanks,
Capt'n Billy
C-25 SK,Snd

Edited by - on

Waterboy
Navigator

Members Avatar

USA
204 Posts

Response Posted - 04/01/2004 : 22:53:30

'first time I dropped a mast I happened to do so literally. 'twas on an old C22, in the boat yard ... kinda bounced off the neighbor's O'Day (no scratches even) and destroyed my windicator. Fortunately, only my brother-in-law witnessed my foolery, and he'll not make a peep lest I tell our patriarch how he almost put 5 tons of gravel in a 1 ton truck. Anyway ....

It was with some trepidation that I approached the same task on a larger boat. I've now raised and lowered the mast several times incident free. Yay. Here's what I've learned, and since (I think) the C25 mast is a bit heavier than the C250, it'll be especially important for you.

Lower the mast towards the stern. Have some sort of mast support ready to hold the mast well above the stern of the boat (not to 'catch' the mast on it's descent!). Mine attaches to the rudder gudgeons an extends to about 8 feet above the top gudgeon.

I use a 'gin pole', about 8 feet long, which joins the mast towards the bow perpendicularly near the mast's base. It has a small trailer winch and about 25' of line attached. I use the jib halyard as a backup line while I attach the forestay to the line on the winch. Once the stay is attached to the winch line and tensioned, I undo the halyard and begin to slowly lower the mast. S l o w l y ... nice thing about the winch that way. You can even stop if some of the stay turnbuckles begin to bind, but keep in mind the leverage on the system increases the more the mast is lowered.

The C250 has 'baby stays' augmenting the side stays and these do much to keep the mast from swinging to one side or another as the mast is lowered. I don't know about the C25 in this regard.

I've always done this on a trailer with light or no wind. I don't know why it wouldn't work in the slip, tho' a passing wake could conceivably muck things up considerably. Any real wind or chop to move the boat around would make me nervous.

I helper would be, er, a great help (I've always done it alone with no one watching). I'd have them correct any sideways motion the mast tended towards first, then make sure the top of the mast stopped in it's stern support.

If your worried about it, wear a helmet and pile a bunch of old lifejackets about the stern ... an old matress would be even better.

JUST KIDDING !!! You'll be fine, take your time and work it all out beforehand. Shoot some video of the whole thing ... either way, we'll all learn something.

Greg ... gettin' punchy on the hard ...

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 04/01/2004 : 22:54:10

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Billyboy
 Hello Mates,
Can I lower and raise the mast, safely while at the dock slip? Capt'n Billy
C-25 SK,Snd

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

With the three keel boats I have owned and the dozen years I owned them with at least one in and out a year and sometimes several when campaigning, I have never raised my mast anywhere but in the driveway and in the slip. We use a hoist to put in and take out and while a boat with aft and forward lowers can do fine at the hoist with the back stay off, (a must to clear the crane) it is always easier to just get the bottom wet and take our time over at the slip. I angle the boat so I can go out on one of the opposing fingers while I haul on the halyard (it makes for a smaller angle and easier hauling) and the other two or three people handle raising the mast. I have never heard of a "mast" incident at our club. We all take it seriously but mostly we all just help when someone needs it and pop them up. This subject once again speaks to how different we all are. Some require self sufficiency and others can count on all the help they need in a familiar setting. I am the latter. If I were trailering to a strange ramp on the gulf I would be hella self sufficient.

Edited by - on

Mark Maxwell
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
329 Posts

Response Posted - 04/02/2004 : 02:58:37

Well, I've been told before that I "march to the beat of a different drum" so why should mast raising be any different

I've done both but prefer to raise and lower forward, by hand, at the slip. I usually have a helper (makes it easier if shrouds or lines get fouled) but I have done both by myself. Going aft would be impossible (by hand) without a crutch to craddle the mast while you step from cabin to cockpit or visa-versa. That step, lack of a crutch and because I mostly back in to slip are the reasons why I go forward. If you have a crutch and are unsure about the weight I would go aft just as described above. As far as on land or at the slip, there are pro's and con's to both. Some of those are:

On land if you drop something you can usually get it back. Not so on the water. More stable platform, especially for your first time. Also you can park away from others for piece of mind.

On water less distance to fall if you slip overboard. Can be cooler (no heat comming from the ground). More room to work from at mast level (using the docks)

Both locations can have several people willing to help. I would suggest to find someone who has done it before to help you. It can be very daunting the first time.

If you would like I can take pic's of the steps as I lift and lower.

Hope that helps

Edited by - on

osmepneo
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
1420 Posts

Response Posted - 04/02/2004 : 06:25:48

I have my marina operator do it, and does it in the water. But, I have friends with 25's that raise the mast by hand, and I have helped them in the past. And, not terribly difficult if you have some extra hands to help.

1. Mast over the transom, butt forward, upper shrouds attached, aft shrouds attached back stay attached.

2. Connect the butt of the mast to the tabernackle (sp)

3. Have one pair of hands ready with the forestay and jib halyard (making sure that these are not tangled with anything else), as the tallest in your crew raises the aft portion of the mast and walks forward toward the cabin.

4. Either extra hands, or stepping up onto the cabin top with the mast on your shoulder, continue raising the mast. Until the shrouds and backstay stop it from going any further.

5. Fasten Jib halyard onto the pulpit - to keep the mast from falling backwards.

6. Fasten the forestay.

7. Pat yourself on the back.

Hope this helps.

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 04/02/2004 : 07:35:30

Like Mark, I find it easier to lower the mast forward, using the boom as the gin pole and the main sheet as the block and tackle. Whichever way you do it, tape your shroud turnbuckles so they'll stand upright as the mast comes down -- you can bend the "t" fairly easily. Also have them taped when you raise the mast.

I've also always done the raising/lowering with the boat in the water.

Brooke

Edited by - Brooke Willson on 04/02/2004 13:14:20

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 04/02/2004 : 08:13:48

To keep the turnbuckles at the right orientation, before raising the mast tie the shrouds off to the lifelines using rubber bands. As the mast goes up the rubberbands will pop keeping your turnbuckles and toggles tangle free.

(Hint courtesy of Steve Milby)

Edited by - on

lcharlot
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Antigua and Barbuda
1301 Posts

Response Posted - 04/02/2004 : 08:39:01

I have always done mast raising evolutions on the trailer - never with the boat in the water. My mast raising system uses a Gin pole with baby stays, and the upper shrouds have been converted to the "Huntington Rig" to support the mast against side sway while it is going up or down.

Edited by - on

cshaw
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
460 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2004 : 18:57:41

I agree with the mast forward with the boom as a gin pole. Goes easier with two people, one on the main sheet and one keeping the mast from swaying side to side (can mess up the tabernacle if it sways tooooo far). ESPECIALLY better to use two people when raising the mast!!! Make sure you have enough mainsheet available to get the mast all the way down though!! (otherwise might have to un-reeve a run to get it out all the way)

Good advice from folks on techniques on keeping the shroud toggles straightened out! I tape mine upright AND rubberband the shrouds to the lifelines (but I am a belt AND suspenders kind of guy)

Probably 8 of 10 times I do this in the slip.

Chuck

Edited by - on

Billyboy
1st Mate

Members Avatar

USA
30 Posts

Response Posted - 04/05/2004 : 23:47:58

Thanks Waterboy for the reply. Your first tale about dropping mast was just like mine...only I paid a marine shop for the effort. Mast just hit the parking lot at the boat ramp...hey, they were power boaters. The lead guy pulled the pivot bolt from the mast in the vertical position. I was stupid then, not so(as)much now.
Hey, from your web page pics, looks like south Florida.
Thanks again,

billyboy (Bill Bilbrey)

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Waterboy
 'first time I dropped a mast I happened to do so literally. 'twas on an old C22, in the boat yard ... kinda bounced off the neighbor's O'Day (no scratches even) and destroyed my windicator. Fortunately, only my brother-in-law witnessed my foolery, and he'll not make a peep lest I tell our patriarch how he almost put 5 tons of gravel in a 1 ton truck. Anyway ....

It was with some trepidation that I approached the same task on a larger boat. I've now raised and lowered the mast several times incident free. Yay. Here's what I've learned, and since (I think) the C25 mast is a bit heavier than the C250, it'll be especially important for you.

Lower the mast towards the stern. Have some sort of mast support ready to hold the mast well above the stern of the boat (not to 'catch' the mast on it's descent!). Mine attaches to the rudder gudgeons an extends to about 8 feet above the top gudgeon.

I use a 'gin pole', about 8 feet long, which joins the mast towards the bow perpendicularly near the mast's base. It has a small trailer winch and about 25' of line attached. I use the jib halyard as a backup line while I attach the forestay to the line on the winch. Once the stay is attached to the winch line and tensioned, I undo the halyard and begin to slowly lower the mast. S l o w l y ... nice thing about the winch that way. You can even stop if some of the stay turnbuckles begin to bind, but keep in mind the leverage on the system increases the more the mast is lowered.

The C250 has 'baby stays' augmenting the side stays and these do much to keep the mast from swinging to one side or another as the mast is lowered. I don't know about the C25 in this regard.

I've always done this on a trailer with light or no wind. I don't know why it wouldn't work in the slip, tho' a passing wake could conceivably muck things up considerably. Any real wind or chop to move the boat around would make me nervous.

I helper would be, er, a great help (I've always done it alone with no one watching). I'd have them correct any sideways motion the mast tended towards first, then make sure the top of the mast stopped in it's stern support.

If your worried about it, wear a helmet and pile a bunch of old lifejackets about the stern ... an old matress would be even better.

JUST KIDDING !!! You'll be fine, take your time and work it all out beforehand. Shoot some video of the whole thing ... either way, we'll all learn something.

Greg ... gettin' punchy on the hard ...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Edited by - on

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The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.