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spencerwait
Deckhand

Member Avatar

USA
15 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/30/2004 : 23:06:00

Well I guess i got a little too excited and didn't do much research on the 25' Catalina I just bought 6 hours ago. What should be my primary concerns as far as the upkeep of the boat. It is a swing keel, supposedly a new cable a year ago, standard rig, original sails. What do I need to do in order to keep the swing keel from becoming a problem. I did not get the boat inspected by a professional, a mistake? I hope not. Any comments for a new owner?
Thanks
Spence

Edited by - on

Doug
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
457 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 00:26:36

You impulse purchased a 25 foot sailboat?
First area of concern: Have you told you wife (Admiral/ SWMBO)?
Second (assuming #1 goes OK): Arrange lawn care. You'll be sailing too much to keep up silly things like landscaping.
Three: Call Catalina Direct tomorrow and order the little black parts book.
Four: Check in here often.
Welcome aboard Spence. Tell us more about the boat.

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

3072 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 00:32:07

Welcome... A couple quick questions... What year is your boat? Sail number ?

IMHO... Your first purchase after your boat should be... the Catalina 25 Owners Handbook from Catalina Direct. This is full of information, upgrade parts (& etc.) for your C25. It explains most of the items on the following check list in some detail and offers repair & upgrade parts.

Second purchase... Association Membership ! This forum, the members and archives are chock full of information about your boat. The search functions will help you find it.

List of Swing Keel Maintenance Items..

1) Keel Cable - Replace cable or end fitting annually if in saltwater. Otherwise inspect.
2) Keel Pipe - Remove, Inspect and replace if cracked or brittle. Put new clamps on.
3) Keel cable turning Ball - Remove, Inspect, Lubricate pin or replace ball & pin as needed.
4) Winch - inspect for rust or corrosion. Overhaul or replace as needed.
5) Keel cable fitting - Upgrade to new style fitting if not done already. Otherwise inspect.
6) Keel hinge fittings - Inspect, replace if worn or 'egged out'.
7) Keel pin - Inspect, replace if worn.
8) Fit of Keel pin to keel - If egged out or sloppy, overhaul keel.
9) General Keel hinge area - inspect for cracks or other damage. Repair as necessary.
10) Fit of keel to keel trunk - Inspect fit, add shims if necessary.

This looks like a big list... but most of the items are easily replaced and not very expensive. Biggest thing to deal with would be a worn fit between the keel pin and the keel itself. The forum has several threads dealing with overhauling it.

Edited by - on

Lightnup
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1016 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 01:04:09

Welcome Spence.

Please, please order a Catalina 25 Owner's Handbook from Catalina Direct. Perhaps if they get a few more orders, they will actually produce and ship them. I ordered mine on June 5th. Their Customer Service people told me Monday that "they're being worked on" and it might be another few weeks. I guess my enthusiasm about being a new owner of a used C25 has made me a bit impatient to get my hands on what many folks on this forum have indicated is a must-have handbook.

By the way, I'm convinced you'll be impressed with the depth of knowledge and willingness to help by so many of the members here. It has sure been helpful to me as a newbie sailor.

Good luck,

Steve

Edited by - on

MattL
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 01:40:37

Hi Guys,
Steve, I'm supprized about the delays. I haven't ordered anything from CD in a while but when I have they have always been fast and full of great advice. I don't work for them, but I do live in CA which could help.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 08:30:53

Congratulations and welcome aboard, Spence!

As far as not getting your boat professionally inspected, if you are comfortable doing a self survey, like I did, and you are happy with the results, then I don't think you have anything to worry about.

Again, welcome to the fleet!

Edited by - on

Bill Holcomb
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
769 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 08:58:34

Hi Spence,

Welcome aboard. Even though an impulse, you probably have bought a great boat. Take a look at the Brochures section of the website. While not full of tips like the Catalina Direct parts book, it has lots of info. http://www.catalina25-250.org/manbro/partscat.html

Also, spend some time on the Tips section. There you will fine lots of tips for modificatons - with photos - that will help you get some ideas.
http://www.catalina25-250.org/tech/tech.html

Bill Holcomb - C25 Snickerdoodle #4839

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 09:12:25

Welcome, Spence...

Always on the prowl to disagree with an expert like Don, and since you call yourself a "newbie", I'll offer the opinion that you shouldn't give up on the idea of a survey. It would've been an even better idea before you closed the deal, but assuming you got a "good deal" and don't feel you gambled your mortgage, you just want to know how best to move on. A pro can tell you a lot for a few "boat units" (the bills with two zeros on them), such as whether there is moisture in the deck core that indicates leaks you need to attend to (by re-bedding hardware and such) or even rot that needs attention. He can also take an educated look at your rig, swing keel, the trunk around the keel, chainplates, gudgeons, and wiring--all key safety items. Attend the inspection with a clipboard and ask lots of questions. $300 or so may seem like a significant expense, but you'll learn a lot, get a prioritized list of purchases and projects, and end up with some peace of mind that's worth the price--IMHO.

Then browse these forums to death--especially the C-25 Forum--and use the Search feature to look up words like "swing", "rudder", and anything else that comes to mind. There are lots of great threads from years past that are timeless in terms of information and opinions. I assume that you know the C-250 is a completely different boat--the most common interests between the two groups of owners are in the areas of outboards, sail trim, anchoring, venues, recipes, boat naming, radio shows, 17-foot-itis attacks, and the like--all in this General Forum. Technical issues on each boat (C-25 and C-250) are found on the two respective forums.

Ask away, and have a great time--you found what should be a great boat!

Edited by - on

pwhallon
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
694 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 10:26:30

Welcome aboard,

There are people who will disagree but:

IMHO, when the boat is in the water (including at her slip), leave the keel down. Don't let it hang on the cable. The cable is for OCCASIONALLY going over a shoal area and getting the boat on a trailer.

Enjoy.

I can't wait to get back in the saddle.

PW

Edited by - on

spencerwait
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
15 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 11:41:42

Thanks for all the great advice. This is a great site. I bought a 84 standard rig, swing keel, 8 hp suzuki, original main sail

, roller furling jib, and a ferw extras. I did check the bildge and every other nook and crany I could see, dry, dry, dry. I was told the cable was replaced last year some time and had a new bottom paint job done. The sail number is 3999. I first started sailing at age 6 on a old wooden sailfish, from then on it was a Lightning (11154) which I still have today. My Grandfather gave me the boat on his 90th birthday. He just couldn't sail by himself any longer. I now have a family of my own and wanted a bigger boat to go overnight on, not have to worry so much about heavy air and capsizing, etc. So that's that. So here comes some more questions while I'm thinking about it. With the roller furling jib, can I raise anohter jib with the jib halyard and leave the roller furling on or is the forstay used up by the furler? I didn't take a close look to see. The other problem is getting the boat to Jasksonville Fl from Titusville Fl, no trailer. Thanks again for all the advice
Spence

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 12:36:09

Welcome Spence! If you join the National Association, you get to help support this forum (my wife is the web master), you get to read the TellTale newsletters (I am the editor), you get a subscription to the Catalina magazine Mainsheet, you get a big discount at the Ships Store (how about a C25 Tee Shirt?) and for a little extra you can buy the National Association Burgee and proudly fly it!

Otherwise I am sure you got a great boat, go sailing, and when something needs to be fixed show up here and ask your questions!

There is a great article on self-surveying your C25 on the tech tips section.

Hey, check out http://www.indiscipline.org/cat25/indyIII.html to see all the cool things we (and the other Fleet 7 members) been doing on our C25s!

Edited by - on

lcharlot
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Antigua and Barbuda
1301 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 13:04:55

Spencer -
A couple of items on your boat to take note of:
1. Spreader sockets. If your boat has the old style cast-aluminukm spreader sockets, there is a retrofit kit available from Catalina to replace these with stainless steel welded sockets. the mast will have to be down to do the job. There have been a few failures of the aluminum sockets, probably due to corrosion and metal fatigue.
2. Masthead casting. This too is cast aluminum, and is subjected to very high loading. It should be inspected the next time the mast is down, and replaced if there is any uncertainty as to it's condition.
3. OEM pressureized alcohol stove. Known affectionately to all Catalina 25 owners as "The Factory Curtain Burner". These stoves have a nasty tendency to suddenly flare up and shoot blasts of 3' high flames if the the burner heads are not pre-heated enough. Also, you can't use this stove on a low-power setting (simmer) for more than a minute or two, as low flame settings will not keep the burner hot enough to prevent a flare-up. Flare-ups happen when the burner is not hot enough to vaporize the alcohol completely, allowing liquid alcohol to spurt out, where it ignites into a big curtain-scorching geyser of flames.
4. Swing keel cable hose. In choppy conditions, water will spurt up this hose and splash onto the quarterberth cushions and into the cable winch (undesirable especially in salt water). If your boat does this, try stuffing a wad of foam, like an old car-washing sponge or a piece of old foam mattress, into the top of the cable hose.

Enjoy your boat and welcome to the Forum!

Edited by - on

RichardG
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 14:34:25

Re: original stove (aka curtain burner)

Don't automatically feel like you have to go out and spend a bunch of BU's to get a new stove. While there are many C25 owners who won't go near it it, there are many others who feel otherwise and are quite comfortable using it properly, without any big flare-ups. Experience with gas backpacking stoves seems to help greatly in this regard. Also, mine works on "low" just fine for long periods, as long as it is preheated correctly (for simmering or toasting bread, begals, waffles, et al).

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 16:18:26

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Experience with gas backpacking stoves seems to help greatly in this regard. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Not necessarily. In fact, if you treat the pressurized alcohol stove as you would a white gas, propane, or butane stove, you WILL burn the curtains. You absolutely must preheat the burner before trying to use it. As is the case with so many things in life, if you follow the directions, it will work as designed.

Brooke

Edited by - on

osmepneo
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
1420 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 16:51:31

Welcome Spence!

Everyone has given you good advise, so I won't be redundant.

You could still get a "professional" marine inspection, obviously not to effect your purchase decision, but to prioritize you projects. If you are comfortable with your own self-inspection, as Don L. was, then you will develop your own prioroties.

There are number c25/c250's in the J'ville area and they are starting to get together. You might want to look through the past recent past) for some contact information. Or, maybe one of them will get in touch with you.

Edited by - on

RichardG
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 18:21:37

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">if you treat the pressurized alcohol stove as you would a white gas, propane, or butane stove, you WILL burn the curtains. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I'm not familiar with propane and butane backpacking stoves, but the gas ones I've used (Optimus, MSR, etc.) all are primed/preheated exactly like the curtain burner -- they all have a little cup beneath the burner which accepts the liquid fuel for priming (although some use acetone in winter/high altitudes because it burns hotter and cleaner).

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">if you follow the directions, it will work as designed<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
As with many older, used things, it may have not been maintained well, in which case following the directions won't help. Hopefully, yours is in good condition.

Good luck with everything!

Edited by - on

ddlyle
Captain

Members Avatar

302 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 22:15:12

Since you mentioned Jacksonville (I'm just up the coast in Hilton Head SC), you will definitely want to have some zincs installed on your swing keel. That is if you plan to keep it in salt water. There are many who have had swingers in salt water for years with no problems.
Zincs are great. (They corrode instead of the cast iron).

Learn how to reef so you don't freak out your family when she heels over 25 degrees.
Keep in touch.

Edited by - on

frog0911
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1349 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 22:32:22

Welcome Spence to the best group of sailors anywhere. I don't know the exact movement costs from Titusville, but I would figure 3-4 hundred dollars. That is unless you can find someone to lone you a trailer. There are some trailer sailors in the area and maybe they would know about finding a trailer.
Did you get the boat from a dealer or PO? If from a PO there is a Catalina dealer in Coco, that I know, who might be able to rent you a trailer. Let me know and I can give you the info.
The advice you have received so far has been the finest as you will come to find out as you learn more about your boat, but most of all understand that there are no dumb questions and yes, we will every now and then take pot shots at each other all in jest so laugh along, become a member and enjoy your new C25 yacht.

Edited by - on

triley
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
251 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 05:16:16

Welcome, Spence.

The keel cable is the big problem. Seems to me that they break at the swage end which gets corroded in salt water faster than in fresh. I have to keep my keel up in port due to depth concerns, but Clambeach is right about it. Do a search for "keel cable" on the site for the archive of all the woes people have had.

I have had one break only once and it fell in the mud at my slip so I didn't have the damage that can sometimes happen if it occurs in deep water. It was relatively easy to get it up and the new cable put on in the water, but i may have been lucky. At any rate, you can use a line from both winches and under the bottom to crank up the keel to getr it out of the water. Keep that in mind just in case.

Edited by - on

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