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What to Look for at a Boat Show

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Sea Wolf
1st Mate

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27 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/30/2004 : 14:43:42

I'm going to the boat show at Jack London Square in the Bay Area in 2 weeks to get a feel for what different size boats are like aboard among other things.

Any special tips or warnings?

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 15:41:44

just go, look at every boat you can, go onboard, consider the head, living accomodations, where to store your garbage, how to carry a dinghy, where to put the anchors. Make sure there is enough access room to service the motor or change the freshwater pumps. Does the boat have adequate tankage (water, fuel and holding). Check the quality of everything. Are the cushions just vinyl stapled to plywood? Fittings made of stainless or aluminum?

Have a hot dog, then come home and buy a used boat.

New boat warranties mean nothing. You lose 1/2 your money in the first year. You'll have a 20 year loan on a boat you are not likely to own more than 3 and will pay through the nose when you sell it (called being "underwater" in the loan).

Did I say buy a used boat ? Let someone else pay for all the extra stuff you actually need to make a new boat workable.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 16:24:45

Jim is really right on this one! Possibly the ideal is to buy a used Catalina from a seller who's moving up to a bigger Catalina. It's a sign of satisfaction, which in turn suggests s/he's selling a good boat. But all of the "stuff" that's been added essentially comes for free--the market just doesn't recognize the value of "stuff" on a used boat, even though the new buyer probably spent an extra 30-50% on all the stuff.

Take your digital camera, and leave your checkbook at home.

Edited by - on

atgep
Master Marine Consultant

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1009 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 17:48:11

Unless you find an 88+ wing!

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 18:07:02

Stop talking about me! Actually, you don't lose half with a Catalina, because they do hold their value. But yes, buying a used one is definitely less depreciation. It''s also a lot more trips to the store.....and work. So there's cro's and pons to both approaches, and having done both I can say that I did better financially with the used ones, but spent a lot more time on them.......The only thing you really don't want to do (like I did) is buy a new one and decide it's the wrong size after two years. If, you are going to buy a new one, it helps if you hold on to it for a long time.

As far as what to do at a boat show, this is where they have great deals on magazine subscriptions, so for pennies on the $ you sign up for a slew of mags to read about what you want to buy......

Oscar
C42 # 76 "Lady Kay"
C250 # 618 Good survey, awaiting closing.
http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/C250WB

Edited by - on

Grego5
1st Mate

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USA
73 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 19:31:28

Wolf,

They are all right. Buying a new boat is EXPENSIVE. But the Catalina's do hold their value. My passenger thought we needed a boat but wanted a new one. I came across someone with a similar story to Oscar's. He held my boat from Jan 2003 until I bought her in Nov 2003 (he moved up to a bigger boat).

The advantage to a used boat is that it is dressed out for you. The new boat will not have the safety equipment (Life Jackets, Flares, Fire Extinguisher, Anchor, VHF Radio etc) or convenience items (Stereo/CD, Grill, Kitchen/eating Gear), Navigation Items (Charts, GPS, Know Meter, Fish Finder, Temp Gage etc) or an engine unless your order them at an extra cost. Aside from the P.O. eating depreciation he may leave many of these goodies behind which can be several hundred BU's. If the P.O. was handy like our Oscar he may even leave behind some great crafts (Seat Cushions, Bimini, Dodger etc)

What ever you get you will have fun. Sailing my 250 has been a blast.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5909 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 19:53:02

As Oscar says, buy new if you're going to keep the boat for a long time. I bought mine new in 1981, and enjoyed almost repairless use of the boat for many years. (Even new boats require some routine maintenance, such as new bottom paint, refinishing teak, etc.) Because I knew I would keep the boat for a long time, I also bought all the optional niceties that would make the boat more enjoyable to use. Amortized over so many years, they added little to the cost.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 22:11:17

Onto the soapbox...

Oscar offers a good lesson: When you're getting started (not that he really was with his 250), you simply don't know what boat is going to be right for you. You don't really know how you're going to use it, how your family is going to take to it, whether it suits your style of sailing, and whether you can justify the costs based on all of the above.

Starting on the small side, and used, gives you flexibility to figure those things out. Then, when you go to boat shows, you can look at the options from the perspective of knowing what isn't quite right with your current boat.

I've known some marriages that cracked because the skipper jumped in big, and the Admiral never bought into the jump. Neither really knew what they wanted in a boat, but what they got was big enough that it got little use and yet the bills were continuous and BIG.

I have always believed that a boat should not own you--you should own the boat. When the costs have you convinced that you must use it instead of visiting your family, it owns you. When you dismiss seeing Italy, or Yosemite, because of the costs of slipping and storing your boat, it owns you. Finding the happy medium where you use the boat enough to be happy about the costs, and don't feel that it prevents you from doing other important things, takes some time and usually a few iterations. You learn what you need by trying one, deciding what's not quite right, and then trying another.

Then, after you find the "perfect boat", a funny thing happens... Your needs and wants change--based on your family, your age, and other things in your life. Barb and I decided to buy our first small cruiser AFTER the kids had flown from the nest, when we could take the time by ourselves. Before that, our family activities didn't revolve around a boat--our day sailer was peripheral to our lives, although it got all of us out on the water often (for about as long as the girls really wanted). Now, things have changed for me again...

"Every boat is a compromise..." You give up room for money, performance for room, room for trailerability, seaworthiness for performance, money and trailerability,... and on and on. Rarely does anyone get it right the first time, and when they do, it likely won't be right twenty years later. But if you don't get into the game because you're afraid you won't get it right, you really lose. Any sailboat--even a Venture--is better than no sailboat!

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 08/30/2004 22:17:28

Lightnup
Master Marine Consultant

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1016 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 22:12:19

What to Look for at a Boat Show?

The exit.

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 22:24:21

And if you do buy the wrong size, too small is better than too big. (Imagine buying a new 40something and then discovering you're only day sailing once a month....

) Good news in my case is that I got a very good deal on the new, (used) bigger one. In fact it is more than offsetting the slightly elevated cost per day of the 250. Still, we had a ball with it, and have a lot of really cool pictures from the trips we made with it. And that is pricelsess...for everything else there's visa.

Oscar
C42 # 76 "Lady Kay"
C250 # 618 Good Survey, awaiting closing.
http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/C250WB

Edited by - Oscar on 08/30/2004 22:29:04

Bruce Baker
Captain

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USA
402 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 11:11:55

Over the years, these are the things I've bought at the Annapolis Boat Show(s):

1. Full set of foul weather gear (best purchase I ever made--$99 for jacket and pants).
2. Soft-sided cooler (never used on the boat, but used in carrying chili meat by plane to Terlingua, TX and Las Vegas).
3. Sailing gloves (2 pairs).
4. "Ultimate" hat (I like it better than Tilley hat).
5. Subscription to Sailing World (with free mug!)
6. Web belt (2) with New England sailboats and tropical fish.
7. Re-usable ice packets
8. Volvo round the world race stuff: shirt, hat, gym bag
9. Reefing lines
10. Gill foul-weather boots
11. Harken boat "sneakers"
12. Harken shoelaces
13. Cookbook for sailors (2)
14. Sheath for Dexter boning knife
15. Sailing gear bag from "Rags to Bags" (made of Kevlar sail material).

Note that all these things are significantly cheaper than a boat!!

Edited by - on

Lightnup
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1016 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 12:44:54

Bruce opined: <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Over the years, these are the things I've bought at the Annapolis Boat Show(s):
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I don't remember what all I bought at BoatUS last week much less every item I've purchased at a boat show over the years. But I do remember my wife buying a jar of Super-Duper Space Age Jewelry Cleaner at the Racine, Wis. boat show a few years back after getting hooked by the pitchman's "amazing" demonstration. Sigh.

Steve

Edited by - on

pwhallon
Admiral

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USA
694 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 16:02:30

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">What to Look for at a Boat Show<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I would look for the credit card that Donald trump lost on the TV comercial. When found, I would slap a new Cat-470

on it and split for the islands.

Criminal mind.

Edited by - on

At Ease
Admiral

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672 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 19:51:36

When doing anything relating to "looking" at a boat show, the key and most important word is look.

Edited by - on

nate
Navigator

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240 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 21:13:24

Just remember to wear clean socks!

Edited by - on

Lightnup
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1016 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 21:22:22

Yes, clean socks and, if you're fast, you can leave with a nicer pair of shoes than you were wearing when you came in.

Edited by - on

JJM
Navigator

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USA
170 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 16:46:02

How about a little Boat Show story? I went to the LA Boat Show at the downtown Convention Center this past January. There were scant few sailboats there - mostly power, but my wife and I did wander numerous times onto this Catalina 250 that was on display. The dealer basically left us alone, and as we came back to it for the 'nth' time, the dealer approached us and said, "Hey, maybe I should get your number if you are interested in this boat".

Well, we did not buy at the Boat Show, but it was my wife's birthday in mid-April and I was almost ready to purchase. I called the dealer up in mid-March, and he did have the exact 'show' boat still available. He told me that this boat had some travel miles on it, since it was trailered to the boat show and was used 2x for photographing as a prize on The Price is Right gameshow. So,I worked with him to get what I considered to be a good deal on it, and surprised my wife with the boat for her birthday! Talk about surprise on her part anxiousness on mine!!!!

So, while I didn't buy at the Boat Show, we ended up with the exact boat that my wife and I had sat in at it - where we had both looked at each other and agreed 'this would work'...'this would work'.

Well, now that we have it, we are both thrilled with it and have enjoyed it many times since. As a matter of fact we can't wait to get on it this Labor Day weekend and sail off into the Pacific.

I almost called the boat 'The Price is Right', but thought that to be too tacky, so I used the name that my wife and I had discussed numerous times while dreaming of a boat of our own - Enchanted Becuma. Becuma is Celtic, and means Goddess of the Magic Boat.
And magic it is.

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1772 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 17:29:10

How about a little Boat Show story? ... - John

COOL story, and neat name!

Welcome to the group, John!

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 20:41:37

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nate
 Just remember to wear clean socks!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Clean what?

Edited by - on

DougA
1st Mate

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USA
73 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 20:57:23

What day are you going? I may be going early in the week, I have to be in Seattle by the end of the week. You may find that there are very few sailboats at the Oakland show.

Edited by - on

HGraham
Deckhand

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USA
21 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 21:14:58

Hey;
I bought our 250 at a boatshow. No regrets

Edited by - on

Sea Wolf
1st Mate

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27 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 22:29:35

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by DougA
 What day are you going?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I'll be there on the weekend.

My main purpose is to get a chance to board a bunch of boats. Catalina is on their list of merchants. The last time I was at the waterfront in Oakland it sure looked like a sailboat kind of place. Hopefully there will be a something there to see. I never mind spending a weekend in San Francisco anyway. German ham on a sourdough roll and draught Anchor Steam on tap at Tommy's Joynt beckons. Thanks for the headsups on what to expect at the show.

Edited by - on

RichardG
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 09/02/2004 : 11:29:19

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">we can't wait to get on it this Labor Day weekend and sail off into the Pacific. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Nice story, John. Have a great weekend on your new boat!

While it's probably a bit of a haul down to Catalina, if you are up to it, I'll be anchored in Cat Harbor starting tomorrow.

Also, consider marking your calender for the weekend following July 4 next summer for the West Coast Catalina Rendezvous at Two Harbors -- 100+ Catalina boats show up for a really great event sponsored by the company. Rumor also has it that several members of this association are planning an extended cruise around the Rendezvous event.

Edited by - on

JJM
Navigator

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USA
170 Posts

Response Posted - 09/02/2004 : 19:34:48

Richard,

Agreed - Catalina Island is a bit of a haul for us, but my wife and I intend to tackle that eventually. The one thing that scares me about Avalon Harbor is that the moorings are on a first come first served basis, and since I would be coming from quite a distance, I would probably be a 'last in' boat and no moorings would be left. Since I really am still very new to all of this, I would probably not sleep too well on an anchoring. Is there a secret to ensuring that a mooring is available should you arrive there later in the day?

Edited by - on

MattL
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2004 : 04:45:29

Going to the boat show at Jack London Square a few years ago, the April - sail boat show- is what got my wife intersted in the bigger Cat 25. We had a Santana21 that she hardly ever went on. She loves the cat. All because of a boat show.

Edited by - on

lcharlot
Master Marine Consultant

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Antigua and Barbuda
1301 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2004 : 08:30:54

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Sea Wolf
 I'm going to the boat show at Jack London Square in the Bay Area in 2 weeks to get a feel for what different size boats are like aboard among other things.

Any special tips or warnings?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

The September show at Jack London Square is primarily a powerboat show, although I suppose there will be a few sailboats there. The all-sailboat show is in April. This used to be called "Pacific Sail Expo", but I have heard that the name is changing to something else for the April 2005 show. If you want to see as large a selection of currently manufactured trailerable sailboats, you need to go to the April show. The September show will probably have few, if any, trailerable sailboats. Maybe Arena Yachts will have a MacGregor 26X there, and there might be a Catalina 250, if the local Bay Area Catalina dealership is even participating, but when I have gone to the September show in past years, it has been almost all powerboats, and of course vendors selling everything nautical from A to Z (and a lot of other stuff that is only vaguely boating related, like sunglasses and clothing).

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