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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Mast Raising failure

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John P
Captain

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USA
324 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/04/2005 : 21:00:13

well my first attempt did not work.

Tried to prop mast up about 8' above the cockpit, secure at step, connect hailyard to bock at the bow, back to winch on cabin top. My thought was to get tension on it, then with my girlfriend winching, I would lift and walk forward. NOPE. too much slippage on the winch, mast too heavy to do solo (I'm a weakling these days). So, tomorrow when I launch it I will use the marinas jib crane. I just learned today that they have one.

Definately going to build the a-frame in the off season.

Live and learn.

'84, C-25, SR/FK, #4663, "ILLUSIONS", Chazy, NY (Lake Champlain)
http://www.sailblogs.com/member/illusions

Edited by - on

georgiaboater
1st Mate

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USA
72 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2005 : 21:48:14

John

When you are ready to build A-frame let me know......have a new angle on the concept which you will find very useful.

Edited by - on

John P
Captain

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USA
324 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2005 : 21:49:47

ready now, have the process/design in my head. What's your new spin on it?

Edited by - on

cat78
1st Mate

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34 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2005 : 04:23:12

tried to lift the mast that way also with a crane . I found the best way to raise the mast was by using the boom as a fulcrum and the main sheet as a block and tackle. you also have to place two lines on either side of the boom to keep it from falling. the mast drops forward over the bow rail. I belive there is a picture in the tech tips. I have a standard rig and I can raise the mast single handed fom the cock pit while another person does nothing more than steady it from the bow. while going through the shinnacock canal on LI I saw a guy with a thirty footer raise an lower the mast with a little help from his wife. Another sailor with him with a much larger mast than mine did it by himslef using this method while struggled with a dockside wench.

Edited by - on

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2005 : 07:45:39

Ah, you have to be careful with those Dockside Wench's

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John P
Captain

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USA
324 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2005 : 07:49:35

Well, I admit I surprise when I brought my boat to the marina and saw all the boats on land with the mast down and they were going in the water. The day before I put mine in I realize they had a gin pole that they used for raising masts. Basically a 30' pole with a hand winch. A quick loop of rope around the mast under the spreaders and 5 minutes later, I was all set. BUT, I do not like the idea of taking up time occupying the haul/out area, so I will raise mine on land in the future, that way I can do a "pre-tune" of the rig BEFORE I get in the water.

I am intrigued by the boom method described above though. it sounds easy enough and will not require you to keep an A-frame on board. I wonder though if the reason most here use the A-frame is because the mast is brought down to the stern, thus more mast is supported by the boat, as opposed to the Boom method where the mast is lowered forward and a great deal hangs over the bow. When I did my mast last week (and failed at raising), I left it secured in the step and lashed to a crutch off the stern pulpit. Basically almost 2/3 of the mast was supported on the boat. I do not see that if the mast is dropped forward.

Edited by - on

PamC
Navigator

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171 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2005 : 11:07:25

Dave & I are also on our first season with our Cat 25. We practiced mast raising a few different ways while we still had the boat at home so it would go smoothly when we launched. HA! That's another story... Dave found a method to use the trailer winch that has been pretty slick. He built a bracket that he attaches to the bow pulpit to which he attached a plastic roller. We attach the winch cable from the trailer to the forestay and winch the mast up after securing it to the step. All stays except the forestay & two forward shrouds are attached and aid with side to side stability.The forestay/trailer winch cable travel over the roller on the bow bracket. The other person keeps lines & stays from catching on stuff and follows the mast up to keep it centered. We've done it with and without the A frame. He found the idea in the book "Cruising World's Workbench" on page 74. We've also used the forward-shrouds-to-A-frame-to-block & tackle-to-bow-running-the-line-back-to-a-winch-in-the-cockpit method so we have a means of dropping the mast on the water too. I think the boat gods require that sailors mess up the first time around though to keep us humble. Despite all of our practice we still screwed up when we went to raise the mast to launch this spring. We chose to use the A frame/block & tackle method. We ran the line from the block & tackle through a clutch on the cabin top (good idea) directly to a winch in the cockpit. That's too steep an angle for the line and since I was watching the mast go up while I cranked the winch I didn't notice the line fouling on the winch until it was really a mess. Very glad we had it going through a clutch at this point. So now we know the line has to pass around a cleat to bring it to the winch at a workable angle.

Edited by - on

Gary B.
Admiral

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USA
969 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2005 : 14:03:18

A homemade 8'-10' gin pole (electrical conduit with a U shaped foot) that attaches to the mast is all I use, plus either the mainsheet or vang with long line for purchase from the stem to the gin pole; use the jib sheet from the top of the mast, obviously. Works great with just 2 people; best when the crutch is used at the stern to get it up. All lines stay attached except the forward lowers and forestay, of course. Give them just a little slack and watch for "kinks" in hardware at the deck.....

This method works when the boat is IN the water as well as on the trailer, for those lifts that require the mast be down....

This is NOT rocket science, nor all that hard. I am injured right now but did the job (with a roller furler) on a friend's boat with only the 1 1/2 of us last Sat. BTW: the furler sure complicates this process. I am staying "hank on".

Gary B.
s/v Encore! SK/SR

Edited by - on

John P
Captain

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USA
324 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2005 : 14:34:31

I agree the furler complicates it, but the furler sure is nice for sailing.

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monty
Deckhand

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USA
5 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2005 : 17:53:19

Since I keep my Cat in the water I have never had to rase the mast and since it's an 84 I don't know when the last time it was down, but I do need to work on the windex. Has anyone climbed the mast on a Cat 25 TR?. How did you do it?

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stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 01:19:20

You can rig a bosun's chair quite easily, and haul up with either halyard. BUT . As discussed in many former threads, its quite simple to raise and lower these masts. Having done it about 6 times since I bought my boat 10 months ago - and never having attempted mast raising before - I found out that if you keep the lines and rigging from fouling you up, that raising and lowering is easily done. Read past threads, there is wealth of first hand info, complete with drawings and photos.
I've found that raising and lowering my mast with an A-frame was better than using my Marina's Gin pole and that raising the mast without A-frame and simply walking the mast up was perhaps the best method of all.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 08:40:56

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by stampeder
 and simply walking the mast up was perhaps the best method of all.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

yep

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John P
Captain

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USA
324 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 08:47:35

I may try the mast walking again someday, but only when I am rested. Also thinking it would be much easier if walking aft as opposed to forward from the cockpit.

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PamC
Navigator

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171 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 11:10:23

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by fhopper@mac.com
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by stampeder
 and simply walking the mast up was perhaps the best method of all.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

yep
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Oh man, that takes all the fun out of it!

I haven't been at this long and am facinated with the never-ending variety of mast raising methods I've encountered already. It reminds me of that kid's game "Mouse Trap". All kinds of contraptions to perform the same simple task. But being a 5'3" woman with limited upper body strength, mechanical advantage is my friend. And it often means the difference between being able to perform a task or not. The PO had a problem with one of his shoulders and devised many items on our boat that work great for me. Like a small block & tackle on the stern pulpit to raise & lower the outboard so we don't have to do it while bent under the rail. I can see that walking the mast up would be so much simpler, but if it's not practical for your body there a lot of options that aren't that much more work. Besides, whatever enables us to get out under sail is worth it right?

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3321 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 12:32:43

Monty - I wouldn't dream of lowering the mast (especially on a TR)just to work on something at the masthead - it is so much easier to use a bosun's chair (aka a butt bucket) - just use the usual safety precautions.
(As I've said before, if Ellen McArthur can climb her mast 4 times (on her own!)in the Southern Ocean, it can't be that difficult to do it in our slip.)!
Derek!

Edited by - on

monty
Deckhand

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USA
5 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 13:59:27

Since this is my first sail boat I was wondering if any one had any suggestions on how. I've seen the bosun's chair and also a ladder that goes in the mainsail track. Heights are not a problem (just spelling). Everyone I ask say that the mast is stronger enough to hold a person, but....it seems like once you got that high the center of gravity would be high and if the mast didn't give out, would you tip over? WOW, I love this stuff. I'm in the Melbourne FL area and keep her at the Patrick AFB marina. Anyone out there wanna go for a sail this weekend? I can use all the lessons I can get The Basic Keelboat class was fun, but I feel it's just like when I got my PPL, it's just a lcense to learn. It has the fixed keel.

Thanks

Edited by - on

Bill Sloane
1st Mate

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USA
91 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 15:57:50

I built a gin pole of Gary B.'s design that I copied from him. It is basically a piece of 1" electrical conduit (heavy duty gauge)x ~ 8' long, one end flattened out with a 3/8" hole drilled in it for a shackle and a 'U' shaped multi-ply plywood saddle that fits onto the other end of the conduit and the saddle fits around the mast. I wonder if Gary has posted the particulars.

Bill.
SK/SR C-25 No. 496

P.S. Gary, Shoes is up in the Hood Canal this summer, enjoying a new body of water. Trip up was fantastic, even with my little 5 HP Honda. Half sailing / half motoring - made 8 nautical miles per hour plus through the Narrows running in the middle of the channel with a serious out going tide under motor. Hope your injury heals up.

Bill.

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3321 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 18:37:43

Monty - no, the boat won't tip over with you at the top of the mast, and the mast won't break either!

Derek

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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2005 : 18:48:40

If your trying to go at it solo, my best advice is for you to start at the bow and go aft. Its a lot easier going down hill. We are lucky to have a crane/coffing lift gizmo for raising masts at the club (which by the way everyone can use at nationals) but before that Harvey and I found it easier to step the mast starting at the bow.

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