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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

How to fix the "Smile"

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Jan Briede
Navigator

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USA
162 Posts

Initially Posted - 07/29/2010 : 12:44:02

Just figure I run this by the experts. I opened up the famous "Smile" and found a white compound between the boat (woo stub) and the cast iron keel. There is a small crack in the steel keel just under the white compound. I assume that the white compound is 5200, and that it is so strong that it is actually pulling apart the slightly corroded top of the keel.

As remedy, I was thinking to grind some of the white compound and the cast iron out and fill it with a new bead of 5200. Let it dry and then cover it with a layer of fiber glass. I am also going to sister in a few extra keel bolts.

Is there anything wrong with this approach? The wood stub is in good shape and the "smile" is not very long (about 1/2 of the length of the keel). Also, how much of the 5200 would you try to grind out to get some good extra adhesion?

Thanks everyone.

Jan

Jan Briede
Beagle
1979 TR #1242 FK
L-Dinette
Yorktown, VA
Blog -- http://vanomad.blogspot.com/

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2010 : 15:33:16

I thought the boatyard said your keel was loose? Is this related or has that been corrected?

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bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1739 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2010 : 18:11:36

After understanding that the "smile" was superficial, I have used 3M 5200 and have been more careful with winter storage, which combined has worked.

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Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2010 : 21:13:14

The ONLY place that 5200 belongs on a boat is the hull to deck joint. Sometime in the future one may have to drop the keel, no?

Why not do a Google search on "Catalina Smile?" Just about every Catalina class boat has the same issue and there are many solutions out there, just waiting for you to find them.

Just don't believe the ones that use 5200.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9017 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2010 : 21:37:44

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Stu Jackson C34
 Sometime in the future one may have to drop the keel, no?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I don't think I've heard of anyone dropping a C-25 fin keel... This might be the only other application for 5200 (and probably was). I'd do it before sistering in the new bolts, which can help compress the seam a little. Marine Tex or a similar epoxy could fill the smile, but would not do as well adhering and flexing (however slightly) under the stresses that cause the smile.

If you do it, when you're done, throw away the rest of the 5200.

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Jan Briede
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USA
162 Posts

Response Posted - 07/30/2010 : 04:51:11

Thanks guys ... I'll keep Googling!
OJ no it is not loose, the boatyard thought there was some flexing that was more then it should be, which can be explained by the "smile" and the need for new keel bolts. I've done some extensive investigating and things look structurally sound.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 07/30/2010 : 05:07:06

Good that the keel was not loose. You have added/replaced keel bolts? Sounds like you are making good progress.

Good luck!

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Tomas Kruska
Admiral

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Czech Republic
522 Posts

Response Posted - 01/20/2011 : 06:10:07

Do anybody knows the recommended torque for tightening the bolts for iron cast fixed keel?
Also do you think that the keel bilge on my 1978 has that plywood core as Cat27?
I don't have the smile yet, but my bolts are very rusted.
I was thinking of removing the old nuts and puting the new ones, but the rod will be corroded too I suppose, will see.
Any previous success story hints are welcome (except bolts sistering)

Edited by - Tomas Kruska on 01/20/2011 06:19:13

Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1181 Posts

Response Posted - 01/21/2011 : 08:51:06

Tomas,
As a fellow owner of a 78 C25 with a cast iron keel I doubt you will be able to tighten or loosen the nuts. I know mine were entirely frozen and you will probably do damage to either the bolts themselves or to their grip in the keel if you try to tighten or loosen them. I remember Jim Baumgart saying the person who added his new bolts told him to tighten them annually as tight as he could. The keel is attached to a 1" thick wooden sole. I do not know if it is plywood. When I sistered mine I put one at eacj end and one in the middle.

Edited by - Sloop Smitten on 01/21/2011 08:54:45

Tomas Kruska
Admiral

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Czech Republic
522 Posts

Response Posted - 01/23/2011 : 12:24:09

Simple nut sistering idea:

what about to place big washer with the inner diameter a little bigger than the original keel nut with washer, then on the top of it a piece of spacing pipe with the inner diameter bigger and higher than the original nut, then on top of it some big washer(s) and then tight with new nut.

Of course if the threads on the screw rod are still ok.

Doing this, you dont have to remove the old nuts and still be able to tight the keel.

PS: maybe the original washer can still be reused.

Edited by - Tomas Kruska on 01/23/2011 12:26:23

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