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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

Halyard Wrap

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Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3754 Posts

Initially Posted - 01/23/2011 : 20:17:39

There was a discussion about a halyard wrapping on the forestay when roller reefing. I posted that I led the main halyard through a block attached to the furler head fitting and kept the main halyard under tension whether the sail main was up or down, and somebody asked for a photo of my setup. I remembered that when I was about to load the genoa (a year late, but still a miracle), and here it is. It is now low and forward, but will, of course, be close to the mast at full hoist.

Dave B. aboard Pearl
1982 TR/SK/Trad. #3399
Lake Erie/Florida Panhandle

Edited by - on

skybird
Navigator

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USA
135 Posts

Response Posted - 01/23/2011 : 22:39:54

Dave--is the main halyard internal? Picture looks like the furler on my boat (recently purchased and not tried yet). I don't understand the purpose and it seems like it would put the halyard on the wrong side of the mast. Please clarify for a newbie. Thanks, Richard T

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OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3370 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2011 : 04:21:59

I'm a little bit confused as well. I know that some furling rigs utilize the jib halyard but for my setup, both my halyards run inside the mast and my jib halyard is not used for the furling rig. So, my jib halyard is basically always shackled to the hole in one of the post-side mid-stay deck fittings and the line cleated at the winch located on the port-side cabin top near the cockpit. My main is also cleated near it's winch on the starboard-side cabin top near the cockpit and the shackle I usually have attached to the bottom of the starboard-side stanchion at it's base. I keep it there so that I get no halyard slap from anything adjacent to the main halyard.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2011 : 06:55:29

Dave is using the block on the main halyard in lieu of a restrainer attached near the top of the mast. Visualize this upper swivel hoisted up the mast with the main halyard set tight. It would set the jib halyard at a better angle to prevent halyard wrap.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9017 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2011 : 07:15:26

The halyards were external on Dave's vintage. The more conventional rig is as Don describes, which requires attaching a small block to the front of the mast, such that at full hoist of the furler swivel, the halyard is held at about a 45-degree lead angle angle to the swivel. This makes the halyard more effective at preventing rotation of the stationary part of the swivel, thus preventing the halyard itself from wrapping around the forestay, which can damage the stay. Here's a block made for the purpose:

The jib halyard comes down to the block, and then angles out to the swivel. (I don't know whether any of this applies to a CDI furler.)

Dave's setup will restrain the swivel as long as the main halyard is tensioned. Sailing on genny alone, with the main halyard "relaxed" could raise an issue. (?)

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 01/24/2011 07:22:21

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3754 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2011 : 17:55:30

All correct. I have external halyards, so the blue line is the tail of the main halyard. I have my main h. tied off when the main is down, but it isn't under a lot of tension - a very small force or small angle change is all that is necessary. The block shown above is an excellent product, but I already had this shackle and block.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2011 : 09:41:52

Halyard wrap can be aggravated/induced if the upper swivel is not high enough on the foil. Using a pennant, either at the foot or head of the sail, might get the swivel high enough to prevent halyard wrap.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9017 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2011 : 11:41:25

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 Halyard wrap can be aggravated/induced if the upper swivel is not high enough on the foil. Using a pennant, either at the foot or head of the sail, might get the swivel high enough to prevent halyard wrap.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Higher is probably better, but a restrainer still helps to keep the stationary part of the swivel from turning, which causes the wrap. My PO apparently either didn't have one (initially) or didn't run the halyard through it--consequently, I found that the forestay was bent and untwisted at the top. He did have a pennant on the head of the genoa.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2011 : 13:04:21

The halyard lead angle should be between 7-10 degrees. If you have adequate lead angle and your upper swivel is at the top of the foil, then look for other causes such as proper forestay and jib halyard tension. On my Harken furler, a little too loose jib halyard will cause halyard wrap. If the lead angle is less than 7 degrees and you experience halyard wrap, then a restrainer might be needed, but keep in mind that you must still maintain a 7-10 degree lead angle after installation of the restrainer.

Edited by - dlucier on 01/25/2011 13:07:14

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2011 : 14:33:19

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Stinkpotter
 The more conventional rig is as Don describes, which requires attaching a small block to the front of the mast, such that at full hoist of the furler swivel, the halyard is held at about a 45-degree lead angle angle to the swivel. This makes the halyard more effective at preventing rotation of the stationary part of the swivel, thus preventing the halyard itself from wrapping around the forestay, which can damage the stay.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Dave,

A 45 degree lead angle will indeed prevent the upper part of the swivel from rotating, but is way too much lead angle (must be less than 10 degrees).

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Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3754 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2011 : 19:49:15

My little block doesn't change the lead angle, mine is within range, it doesn't actually do anything unless the halyard starts to wrap, and then it restrains it.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9017 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2011 : 22:10:50

Don, I'll accept your parameters, although 10 degrees from the forestay would seem to be over 30 degrees from the mast, which is the angle I was envisioning. (10 degrees from the mast would be less than the angle without the restrainer.) The point is the restrainer induces an angle that stabilizes the swivel.

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