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 installing Catalina's keel bolt kit
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Garboard
Deckhand

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USA
13 Posts

Initially Posted - 04/20/2018 :  20:50:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi again...I've begun drilling to install additional keel "bolts" on my C25...I've talked about this on previous postings...I decided to go with the technique intended to be used with Catalina's kit...I've bought new black oxide and cobalt bits but the cast iron is highly resistant to drilling...I've spent several sessions trying to bore into the keel and measured repeatedly to see how much progress I'm making...BUT have only managed to drill in about 1/4"!
I'm a life-long tradesman (carpenter, machinist and mechanic) but am BAFFLED by this...
Has anyone actually installed one of these kits? INTO CAST IRON??? and could you tell me how you managed, and any technique(s) you used??
Thank you in advance!

JLR

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
7943 Posts

Response Posted - 04/21/2018 :  10:10:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Have you tried the pilot-hole and progressive enlarging that was discussed on your other thread? BTW, the installations so far have most likely only been in cast iron, since the later lead keels had stainless studs, nuts and washers. The rusting was only seen with the cast iron keels and the mild steel fasteners used on them. People have definitely done those installations. (I'm not one of them.)

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic, CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage
Now on Eastern 27 Sarge (but still sailing when I can).

Passage, Mystic, and Sarge--click to enlarge.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 04/21/2018 10:13:30
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Garboard
Deckhand

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USA
13 Posts

Response Posted - 04/21/2018 :  20:20:28  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes I have but with no success...I'll figure it out...eventually...
quote:
Originally posted by Stinkpotter

Have you tried the pilot-hole and progressive enlarging that was discussed on your other thread? BTW, the installations so far have most likely only been in cast iron, since the later lead keels had stainless studs, nuts and washers. The rusting was only seen with the cast iron keels and the mild steel fasteners used on them. People have definitely done those installations. (I'm not one of them.)


JLR
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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
7943 Posts

Response Posted - 04/21/2018 :  20:49:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Maybe you have the illusive experimental cast carbon steel prototype keel.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic, CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage
Now on Eastern 27 Sarge (but still sailing when I can).

Passage, Mystic, and Sarge--click to enlarge.
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bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1330 Posts

Response Posted - 04/22/2018 :  05:04:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I would get on the phone with someone at Catalina and separately find a boat yard that has experience replacing keel bolts -- and discuss with both. Either or both may have some suggestions and/or share techniques to best drill, as well as the rest of the various processes involved.

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
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Erik Cornelison
Navigator

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USA
113 Posts

Response Posted - 04/22/2018 :  06:52:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cast Iron doesn't work harden, so it's got to be the bit or your not pushing hard enough.

Ask this forum http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/cnc-machining/


Erik Cornelison
6th Generation Professional Sailor, First Gen Submarine Sailor.
1986 Standard Rig SW. #5234
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VictorS
1st Mate

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Mexico
27 Posts

Response Posted - 04/28/2018 :  17:55:45  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Please share progress pictures, thanks

Victor Salcedo
1978 C25. #453. FK. SR. L.
CTYK0453M78C
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SKS
1st Mate

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USA
99 Posts

Response Posted - 04/30/2018 :  09:33:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think we talked about this before.
Catalina wasn't too particular about the quality of the cast iron used since the keel is for weight only.
You may, in fact, be trying to drill through slag instead of good metal. The slag might even be rock. Have you considered a hammer drill ?
Just a thought.

"Lady E" 1986 Catalina 25: Fin Keel, Standard Rig, Inboard M12 Diesel, Sail No. 5339
Sailing out of Norwalk Cove Marina, Connecticut
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HerdOfTurtles
1st Mate

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USA
45 Posts

Response Posted - 05/10/2018 :  08:03:10  Show Profile  Visit HerdOfTurtles's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I would look into buying a slab of steel to lay down on the cabin sole and rent a magnetic drill press to put on that steel($100/day or less). Use some shims to keep it level, stand on it, have a cutting oil pump in hand and go to town.

1978 Standard Rig
Fin Keel
L-Dinette
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Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4094 Posts

Response Posted - 05/16/2018 :  14:55:55  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I donít know whether Catalina ever did this but a number of early 80s boats used ferro-cement as keels and rudders. It would be easy enough to tell. Do you get metal shavings or crappy brown sand when you drill. The stuff apparently was bulletproof!

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain Stratford & Milford, CT
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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
7943 Posts

Response Posted - 05/16/2018 :  21:27:41  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Voyager

I donít know whether Catalina ever did this but a number of early 80s boats used ferro-cement as keels and rudders...

Ferrocement was used to build hulls (and possibly rudders) as a precursor and, for a while, a poor alternative to fiberglass. It would not have provided the density to reproduce the ballast of the C-25 fin keel in the same shape and size. And I'd place a modest wager that Catalina never used it for anything. But it's an amusing theory... (Com-Pac made fat shoal keels filled with concrete.)

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic, CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage
Now on Eastern 27 Sarge (but still sailing when I can).

Passage, Mystic, and Sarge--click to enlarge.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 05/17/2018 07:00:15
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