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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Silly question about backing up...

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smythyll
Deckhand

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USA
21 Posts

Initially Posted - 09/19/2005 : 17:12:00

If I'm backing up the boat, and have either an inboard or a fixed mount outboard, and I want to bring the stern of the boat to port (i.e. also pointing the bow to starboard), do I push the tiller all the way to starboard or port?

This is really a silly question, but my wife and I are in disagreement, and I'd like to settle it before we take the boat out and get pulled over by the sailboat police!!

Thanks!!

Edited by - on

Auburn80
1st Mate

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60 Posts

Response Posted - 09/19/2005 : 17:57:33

Push the tiller to starboard. Water will deflect to starboard off the rudder creating a force that pushes the rudder and the stern to port.

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 09/19/2005 : 18:10:23

There's an easy way to remember.....

Picture yourself going forward and putting the tiller hard over in either direction.....the boat will go in a circle.....hold the tiller right where it is and it will do the same circle backwards....

Edited by - on

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 09/19/2005 : 18:30:07

The boat will turn in the direction of the back of the rudder.
ie. Going astern. Point the back of the rudder to port to go to astern to port
ie. Going fwd: Point the back of the rudder to port to go forwards to port

Therefore, the opposite is true of a tiller
ie. Going fwd with the tiller to port the boat will turn its bow to Stbd
ie. Going astern with the tiller to port, the boat will turn its sterm tp Stbd.

Or, (appropriately today)
Don ye push yer tiller to port me'lad unless ye wanna put the bow to stbd.
An if ye get it wrong, better be wearing some good trollies, cause Davy will be welcoming you pretty darn soon! Oh Arrrrr.

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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 09/19/2005 : 21:10:08

A couple pointers from recent threads:

Don't slam the tiller all the way over so the rudder's nearly flat against the transom... the boat steers better when the rudder is 'carving' a path through the water.

Unless you're steering the outboard, the boat won't turn unless it's moving.

Docking with steerable outboard makes a novice look like a pro.

At any rate, don't worry, you'll catch on to it in the first couple minutes.

Edited by - on

Bubba
Admiral

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USA
542 Posts

Response Posted - 09/19/2005 : 21:47:26

Avast, ye scallywags! Seems only Brit knows it's [url="http://www.talklikeapirate.com/piratehome.html"]Talk Like a Pirate Day![/url] Arrr!
-Mad Davey Flint

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Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 09/19/2005 : 23:02:44

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Bubba
 Avast, ye scallywags! Seems only Brit knows it's [url="http://www.talklikeapirate.com/piratehome.html"]Talk Like a Pirate Day![/url] Arrr!
-Mad Davey Flint

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I believe you missed a post of mine from early this morning.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 09/20/2005 : 08:52:14

Additionally, the faster you go in reverse, the more bite the rudder will have allowing you to make a tighter turn. This is important if you are in a tight slip with limited backing up room and you need to get the stern over quickly. When backing out of my slip, I generally give it about quarter throttle, as opposed to just idling out, so the rudder will bite sooner allowing me to get the stern to port quicker.

Edited by - on

smythyll
Deckhand

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USA
21 Posts

Response Posted - 09/20/2005 : 19:41:31

Thanks much for the input. Here's a big reason for my question: I currently back into the slip, and have done so like a pro each and every time -- regardless of who's watching!! Ironically, the problem is getting out of the slip!

When I pull out, I can't really turn the boat until the stern clears the end of the finger dock. Unfortunately, this means that the bow is uncomfortably close to the boats in the next dock over. So what I've been doing is this:

1) Try and stop the boat (or very, very slow) when the stern is abreast of the finger dock.
2) Give it a boost of forward throttle with the wheel hard over right.
3) Throttle back, pop it into reverse, then throttle a little to stop forward motion, leaving the wheel where it is.
4) Then, once the boat is not moving forward, or better if it's moving slightly backward, boost forward throttle once again, pushing the stern to port.
5) Repeat process as many times as necessary to ease the boat into the middle of the waterway so I can safely motor out to the main channel.

Sounds good on paper, but with the wind blowing, even a little, the bow can easily get blown to port, which creates a chaotic mess when trying to get out of the slip. I've done this about 8 times or so, and each time it's a pain and certainly a stress inducer!

Anyone have any bright ideas, other than the obvious answer of getting a different slip? Am I doing the right maneuvering?

By the way, it's an inboard diesel.

Thanks for any insights!!

Edited by - on

Bubba
Admiral

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USA
542 Posts

Response Posted - 09/20/2005 : 21:24:10

If the wind takes your bow in the wrong direction, why not just back out the fairway? Several boats used to do this at my last marina because the wind used to blow right down the fairway.
If it's really tight quarters consider having one of your crew use a bow line to pull the bow around as you ease out of the slip - or have someone go forward and push off the piling to get the bow started in the right direction.
It may not be eloquent, but it's effective.

Edited by - Bubba on 09/20/2005 21:24:58

tmhansen
Captain

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USA
397 Posts

Response Posted - 09/21/2005 : 02:01:26

Sounds like you are using the prop walk to turn the boat to starboard as you leave. If you have a finger of the dock on starboard I would suggest the same as Bubba, use a line to a cleat. This line should be just looped around the cleat on the dock then held my a crew through a cleat or around a winch on the boat. Once the boat is pulled by the line the crew then releases one end on the boat and quickly pulls is back aboard to make sure it does not foul the prop. I am not sure it a line from the bow or from amid ship would work better. I would have to see the situation and visualize what will happen. If you only have a finger on your port side I would think about Bubba's other suggestion of backing up the fairway.

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smythyll
Deckhand

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USA
21 Posts

Response Posted - 09/21/2005 : 07:29:16

Thanks much for the suggestions! I was considering the line around a bow cleat, then around the cleat on the starboard finger dock, then once the boat is straight and clear, simply releasing the line and grabbing it with a boat hook once the line is clear of the cleat.

Thanks!!

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 09/21/2005 : 09:06:44

I think the easiest solution to your problem is to pull into your slip bow first.

Edited by - on

smythyll
Deckhand

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USA
21 Posts

Response Posted - 09/21/2005 : 10:05:22

I would agree with the bow in first suggestion, but I have a Freedom 32 with a Gun Mount Spinnaker, and if I go bow in first, the spinnaker pole extends too far over the pier and someone will get "clocked" walking past. It's only a 30 foot slip, and a little overhang is allowed, but if I put the bow in first, my transom will stick out too far and they'll make me pay for a larger slip!

Thanks.

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Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1181 Posts

Response Posted - 09/22/2005 : 10:53:37

I received the October issue of "SAIL" magazine yesterday and their is a good article in it, including diagrams, that covers the effects of current, wind and prop wash when leaving the dock. By the way, "SAIL" has gone through a revision and seems to be a more useful magazine than it used to be, offering more articles to the average sailor now than the millionaire retiree. It might be worth a look if you are so inclined.

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