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Tiller Handle Question

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pmcarman
1st Mate

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USA
30 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/13/2005 : 11:50:32

Greetings all! While taking the boat out this Sunday, I found out that the tiller handle had split - gaps between the layers - yeep! That said, I figure getting a new tiller handle is the way to go, although I could temporarily go the glue, clamp, and screw route. Two questions:

1) For the temp fix, is this even practical, or should I just suck it up and get the new tiller handle?

2) Granted, the tiller handle is original, but I've been lashing the tiller to the stern pulpit, and I'm wondering if the stress of that led to its early demise. Thoughts?

Thanks for your input! As always, much appreciated!

Paul MacGyver Carman
'86 FK/SR #5195 "Althea"
Eau Gallie, FL

Edited by - on

John P
Captain

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USA
324 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2005 : 12:27:08

Mine was rotted where the mounting hardware was bolted through, so I just cut off the last 6" of it, sanded the entire thing, put on several coats of spar varnish and away I went. I did not notice a big difference in a short tiller, and in fact, it makes the cockpit a tad less cluttered. I do plan to get an extension, but that was in the plan anway.

When I am not using my boat, the tiller is lashed between the port and starboard stantions with a bungee cord. I have seen some folks simple remove the tiller/rudder when not in use.

Edited by - on

Leon Sisson
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1893 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2005 : 12:45:23

Re: 1) For the temp fix, is this (glue, clamp, & screw) even practical...?

Yes. This could work very well if you are able to get the epoxy all the way into the gaps. Various techniques include:

a.) Preheating the work piece, so that as it cools, and the air in the wood contracts, it sucks the still liquid epoxy deeper into the cracks and grain. The heat also temporarily reduces the viscosity of the epoxy, helping it flow deeper into small gaps.

b.) Twisting and flexing the work piece so that works the still liquid epoxy down into the cracks.

c.) With the work piece flexed in such a way as to open the cracks as wide as practical, apply the epoxy and then use compressed air to blow it deeper into the cracks.

d.) Similar to c.) above, use a toothpick or needle to push the epoxy deeper into the cracks.

If you are able to get all the nooks and crannies filled with epoxy, screws probably won't be needed. If you want to add a few long thin screws perpendicular to the fracture plane with epoxy, that might add some peace of mind. Just remember, while every screw adds strength in one direction, every screw hole weakens the wood in another direction.

Re: 2) Granted, the tiller handle is original, but I've been lashing the tiller to the stern pulpit, and I'm wondering if the stress of that led to its early demise. Thoughts?

Maybe. If you put the tiller in a situation where passing waves/wakes would force the rudder to 'candy-cane' twist the (raised & tied off) tiller, that could be a problem, depending of course on the amount of force applied.

-- Leon Sisson

Edited by - on

atgep
Master Marine Consultant

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1009 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2005 : 14:35:38

I repaired mine a few times with less than great results. I just purchased a new one and it is a beauty. Pretty cheap from CD.

Tom.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5902 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2005 : 17:18:15

Lashing the tiller probably didn't cause the tiller to delaminate. In fact, when you leave the boat, you should always lash the tiller. If you don't, the rudder is free to turn back and forth as the boat rocks in its slip, and the constant movement wears out the pintles and gudgeons. The tiller probably delaminated because the varnish or other sealant wore away and moisture deteriorated the glue between the laminations. You can re-glue it, as Leon described, and then protect it with 3-4 coats of varnish or polyurethane. To prevent it from happening again, re-coat it as soon as the sealer starts to wear away. It also helps to keep a sunbrella cover on it when not in use.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2005 : 18:38:03

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by pmcarman
 ...While taking the boat out this Sunday, I found out that the tiller handle had split - gaps between the layers - yeep! That said, I figure getting a new tiller handle is the way to go...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Me too!

Although I love to refinish and bring things back to life myself, especially wood

, when my orginal tiller split/delaminated I opted to replace it with a replcement from BoatUS for $48.00.

Around the time I replaced my tiller, a topic on repairing them came up and Steve Milby mentioned how easily they can snap even though they still looked good. As a test, I stressed my old tiller to see what its breaking point was and I was surprised how little effort it took to make it snap like a dried out, very well seasoned piece of firewood.

Edited by - on

jwilliams
Captain

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USA
357 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2005 : 02:20:38

About three years ago I noticed that there was a developing gap in the aft end of the tiller, a precursor to more problems.

I found some large bronze woodscrews that would penetrate almost all the way through when I countersunk them on the bottom side (to hide the screwhead). Think I used three: at the far aft, then one between the lateral bolts and one afore.

Carefully sizing the drill hole diameter and length first, I then put as much epoxy in the split as a whittled down toothpick would allow. Clamped the aft end to close the split and drilled the holes. Epoxyed the screws and put them in. Epoxyed over the countersunk heads.

When hard, I sanded the bottom side and refinished.

You cannot see the screw heads and the split is gone.

Jim Williams
Hey Jude C25fk 2958
SF BAy

Edited by - on

MattL
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2005 : 16:16:39

Like Jim I noticed delamination in my tiller about 3 years ago too. I pre drilled for some through SS bolts, with wood screw heads. Got it all glued up with epoxy, a trick to get into the tight split is to use some paper. slid it through the slit in the wood and an excess glob of glue. This will pull the glue into the deepest recesses with ease. bolted it together and cleaned up the excess glue. Haven't had any problems with it, but I am planning on building a new one anyway. The one I have doesn't appear to be the original and doesn't have the up sweep on the original ones I've seen. It's a real knee knocker.

Edited by - on

oldsalt
Admiral

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USA
578 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2005 : 10:25:31

Water intrusion into the area between laminates is likely to be the cause rather than your practice of lashing the tiller. The laminated tillers are extremely strong and usually fail only when water gets into the hole for the bolt that connect it to the rudder, or is trapped behind the two stainless steel plates, causing delamination and possible catastrophic failure.

I discovered that I needed to replace mine when I installed a balanced rudder a few years ago. The tiller looked perfectly fine until I unbolted it from the old rudder and removed the stainless steel plates. I was surprised that the previously covered section looked like mush and was an accident waiting to happen.

I got an exact replacement from Catalina Direct for about 50 bucks.

I wouldn't chance making repairs and since the old tiller lasted almost 20 years and only cost $50 to replace, I don't believe it owed me any money.

Edited by - oldsalt on 12/18/2005 11:37:38

tinob
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1883 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2005 : 11:56:28

Paul,
For years I nursed a tiller handle that kept trying to tell me "HELP" I can't take it any more and then I baught a new tiller, WOW @ $60 what on earth was I struggling for. At the first sign of delamination I'll not hesitate and spring for a new one. I'm sure I spent as much money trying to revive the old one as I did buying the new one not to mention the labor repairing the origional.

Val on ther hard DAGNABIT # 3936

Edited by - on

pmcarman
1st Mate

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USA
30 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2005 : 12:38:12

Val,

After doing all the research, hearing the opinions of the group, and then deciding I wanted to be doing more sailing than sanding, I went the route you suggested. Catalina Direct had a new tiller out to me in 2 days, and it looks a million times better (and in a heck of a lot better shape). Already had a tiller cover, so that'll help keep things in fine shape.

Now if this rain in Florida would just go away! Ha!

Thanks for your advice!

-Paul

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2005 : 13:16:34

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by oldsalt
 ...The rudder looked perfectly fine until I unbolted it from the old rudder and removed the stainless steel plates. I was surprised that the previously covered section looked like mush and was an accident waiting to happen...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

It was quite evident that my old tiller failed due to water intrusion through the bolt holes on the plates. When I installed my new tiller, I placed thin neoprene washers between the plates and the tiller to prevent water from getting inside the holes.

Edited by - on

oldsalt
Admiral

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USA
578 Posts

Response Posted - 12/18/2005 : 11:40:39

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by oldsalt
 ...The tiller looked perfectly fine until I unbolted it from the old rudder and removed the stainless steel plates. I was surprised that the previously covered section looked like mush and was an accident waiting to happen...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

It was quite evident that my old tiller failed due to water intrusion through the bolt holes on the plates. When I installed my new tiller, I placed thin neoprene washers between the plates and the tiller to prevent water from getting inside the holes.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Now why didn't I think of doing that........ the easiest spring project ever.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 12/18/2005 : 21:21:37

We had the same problem, we glued clamped and screwed it back together and keep it below as an emergency tiller.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 12/19/2005 : 13:16:33

I suspect the most common cause of cracking is pushing down on the tiller, as happened when a friend lost his balance and sat on mine... When I took it apart, it appeared that it had been weakened by water that intruded into the bolt holes. When I installed my new CD tiller, I countersunk the holes and put some polysulfide caulk around each of them before bolting everything together. I'm hoping that keeps water from intruding into the holes either from around the plates or from the bolts themselves.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 12/19/2005 13:17:30

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