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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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What strange riggings are seen in pic?

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Arlyn Stewart
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Initially Posted - 04/10/2006 : 08:19:28

Arlyn C-250 W/B #224

N/E Texas and Great Lakes
Arlyn's Sailing Site

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sweetcraft
Admiral

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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 08:36:16

Isn't that a Barber Hauler? The shock cord looks like it is helping keep the whisker pole steady. Must be smooth seas and gentle breezes.

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dlucier
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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 09:02:04

The small lines from the stanchions are to prevent the jib sheets from snagging during a tack or gybe.

The other rigging on the jib sheet itself is like Jim said, a Barber hauler or runnning sheet.

[url="http://www.sailnet.com/collections/learningtosail/index.cfm?articleID=woodto005&coll_cat=Firstsail&Coll_name=Your%20First%20Sail"]Reading Flow and Making Adjustments [/url]

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John G-
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 09:02:05

Arlyn,
Check out this page on the [url="http://www.j24class.org/usa/faqs/thej24cont.html"] J 24 Spinnaker barber hauler.[/url]

Underlined words are a HOT link.

Go ahead click on the bird.

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Champipple
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 09:37:48

Looks like a fairly clean setup. Shock cord keeps the jib sheets from getting tangled in the other stuff.

Inner Jib Tracks for a smaller headsail with a barberhaul on it. Similar to Tweaker lines for a kite.

Looks like the halyards have a cam cleat at the mast….not sure I like that but it looks to be clean.

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Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 11:22:39

What's with the cable on the Boom Vang?

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dlucier
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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 11:50:35

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Russ.Johnson
 What's with the cable on the Boom Vang?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

This cable doubles the purchase of his 4:1 vang making it 8:1. I did the same thing but I used regular line.

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Champipple
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 12:26:34

Cable is what Don said. You normally find the cable with a rigid vang, however it would be just as effective on that setup.

dw

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johnsonp
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 13:37:00

The mast step wing nut should be on the port side.
A lot of slack in the port side stays.
Not sure where the small line on the boom vang goes.
The lines stowed on the mast are?
Anything else I would need to get my glasses on.

paulj C250 WK # 719

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Champipple
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 18:38:59

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by johnsonp
 The mast step wing nut should be on the port side.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> I hope you are saying this facetiously, unless there is something funny about that bolt making it for left handed people only.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">A lot of slack in the port side stays.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">starboard tack, they should be loose

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">sure where the small line on the boom vang goes.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">It would have to terminate at the boom or the entire vang would be ineffective

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The lines stowed on the mast are?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">they'd have to be halyards, not everyone leads them aft 

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Anything else I would need to get my glasses on.

paulj C250 WK # 719
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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Arlyn Stewart
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 19:09:41

Didn't take Y'all long to sort that out. Yes, the bungee leading from the whisker pole eye to the stanchion is as pointed out, an anti foul line for the jib sheets.

What was called barber haulers seem however to be called twings or as Don's link points out, running sheets when they are used to deflect the sheets to adjust the bisecting angle. A barber hauler is used to bring a sheet inboard and tighten the slot. The reason I'm running them is that earlier 250s were produced with tracks a little short to twist of the jib off well and these save changing the tracks out and dealing with new holes. Plus, they make adjusting the jib sheet angle a piece of cake.

To run them however, as pointed out in Don's link, there must be a another block to make the sheet fair to the winch. In my case, as the tracks are too short, I've aborted the winches on the cabin top and gone to coaming winches so I've a block on the midship stanchion to make the sheet fair to the winch and use a rub strake where the sheet turns over the cabin slightly.

Edited by - Arlyn Stewart on 04/10/2006 19:21:10

johnsonp
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 19:11:30

Well old sailors tail portside wingnut.
Well there must be a heavy brezze.
Well I agree.
Well no deck organizers maybe that's why the lines are on the mast.

Now that I'm awake....I cannot believe there isn't any place to attach blocks to the mast step or tabernacle but, Arlyn has a WB not a WK.

paulj C250 WK #719

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Arlyn Stewart
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 19:40:02

Paul, The wingnut is on the starboard side for the reason that the mast crutch is offset on an extra set of gudgeons, which have the effect of lining up the port hole easily and then straining the mast slightly to push the step bolt through the starboard hole... going the other way is a pain.

As to lines led aft... I'm a trailer sailor. I've never minded doing sail management from the cabin top. There will always be the occassional need to go forward... might as well stay proficient at it. I do have every line I need to reef at one location on the starboard side of the forward end of the boom and mast. When I go there, there is a short 30 inch tether attached to the mast that gets clipped to the harness.

The halyard, topping lift, all four reefing lines and vang if it was left hardened are within hand reach. I'm not any opponent of lines to the cokcpit however... I've just never sensed a personal need and I've some time cruising on a C30 that had everything run to the cockpit. Perhaps it comes from a life long career of walking the plate line in the construction industry and a great many of them were on two story houses.

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johnsonp
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 19:59:57

What are these called?

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ClamBeach
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 20:09:58

"What are these called?"

You're talking about the jib sheet led around a block that's been tied off to the rail?

I'd call it..."not having enough jib track".

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johnsonp
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 20:20:09

Arlyn
Thanks for the reply.
I was making lite of wing nut...see if any one would bite.
Oh,on the serious side those port stays look loose.
I like to run everything aft,getting old I guess,that's why I have grandkids.

paulj C250 WK #719

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tmhansen
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 21:30:25

Arlyn, it looks like you have a quick release pin on the vang with a long lanyard on the pin. Why?

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Champipple
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 21:33:59

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Arlyn Stewart
 

What was called barber haulers seem however to be called twings or as Don's link points out....<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> I referred to them as tweekers, that is synonmous with Twings in local circles when referencing spinnaker twings or tweekers. Same concept here.

What about the Halyards Arlyn - Interesting cleating concept....and was that guy serious abou the mast bolt?

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Champipple
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 21:41:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by johnsonp
 Arlyn
Oh,on the serious side those port stays look loose.

paulj C250 WK #719
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I would say that the required tension here depends on the actual weather conditions and if the tip of his mast is falling off or not. In some really light air have had almost no tension on the leeward side shrouds while going upwind. Since Arlyn Trailers it is very possible that he rigs his tension for the weather at hand.

And yes, I partially bit on the wingnut thing....I did use the word facetious, throw in a smiley face and refer to left handed nuts......oh well

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britinusa
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 22:09:27

Hmmmm let's sea (pun intended)

Lots of halyards, extra lines, shock cords... and isn't that a jib just visible out on the port side?
My conclusion is that the boat is afloat, under sail, with the wind behind it.

The shadows are pretty low, about 40degrees (ish) and the sun is almost astern.

So it's late in the afternoon (too early in the morning to have put all that together and had the thought to take the pic) Thee boat is pointing pretty close to east / east south east.

But I'm guessing it's not Aryln's boat.. unless he was getting distracted as his lines would be much neater.

And lastly, Am I the only one that noticed the electrical connectors are disconnected.

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Champipple
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Response Posted - 04/10/2006 : 22:14:08

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by britinusa
 Hmmmm let's sea (pun intended)

And lastly, Am I the only one that noticed the electrical connectors are disconnected.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I noticed that, but Arlyn specifically mentioned rigging.

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Arlyn Stewart
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Response Posted - 04/11/2006 : 08:15:00

Duane, sorry... I had noticed you called them tweekers and forgot to mention, in fact I like the name tweeker better than twings because it's descriptive. The sheeting angle can be adjusted (tweaked) very simply while under load while having to release the jib sheet and move a car is something that usually is avoided and an out of trim jib is often lived with.

The electrical connector is not connected as it was a day sail on the local lake... it might have gotten connected befere evening as almost always I spend a night or two.

I run a loose rig which is unusual for a 250 as it is basically a one tune rig (tight). The way I get away with it is that I've both a backstay tensioner and running baby stay.

I may be going out on a limb here but I think the water ballast may handle powering the sails a bit more than the wing as the board can be raked aft and it can handle more heel before the helm goes to pot.

Hardening the rig with the backstay and baby stay tensioner instantly kills 5-15 degrees of heel. Duane is a racer and perceptive and if there were no backstay and baby stay tensioner, I'd adjust the rig daily for the conditions if I were racing, just as we used to do on beach cats. The one tune design of the 250 is one of its shortcomings.

The halyard blocks and cams are stock equipment on a water ballast and jamming the coil of line rather than hanging it seems to be what works best as the blocks are very low and the cleats above are used for reefing and wanted unencumbered.

Yes, there is a snap shackle with lanyard on the vang so that the line portion of the vang can be relesed from the wire portion and taken to a stanchion eye for use as a preventer.
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> But I'm guessing it's not Aryln's boat.. unless he was getting distracted as his lines would be much neater. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

lol... arlyn likes order, but is no sailing prude... personally what works for me in life is enjoyment rather than any call to perfection. I enjoyed winning a race but if I didn't, there was little fret.

Edited by - Arlyn Stewart on 04/11/2006 08:58:22

britinusa
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Response Posted - 04/11/2006 : 21:31:56

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The halyard blocks and cams are stock equipment on a water ballast and jamming the coil of line rather than hanging it seems to be what works best as the blocks are very low and the cleats above are used for reefing and wanted unencumbered<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Arlyn, you mention 'stock' equipment, but I'm not sure what you are referring to, our 2005 has one halyard block (at least a block on the side of the mast below the boom) but no cams at all (on the mast) Could you clarify.
I put 'baggies' around the mast and put the slack lines in them. The main goes to a spinlock on the stbd side.

Paul

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Arlyn Stewart
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Response Posted - 04/11/2006 : 22:02:55

Paul, Evidently Catalina has changed its rigging up somewhere along the way. From the inception of the wing keel, it was fitted with halyards led to the cockpit but the water ballast up until some point used for both halyards a swiveling block and cam cleat arangement. I'll try to get a pic.

I like them but rigging an anti fouling line is a must as the sheets will foul on them, hence maybe why Catalina discontinued there use. Using an anti foul line, I've never had a sheet foul. It is very easy to firm the halyard well with them without a winch... simply haul and cleat, grab the halyard and pull it from the mast and then take up slack at the cleat... another reason I've never been interested in lines aft... I can feel the halyard hardening the luff and do it very quickly... compared to no feel with a winch and possibility of popped slugs.

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tmhansen
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Response Posted - 04/12/2006 : 00:51:27

I thought maybe a preventer but then I thought that when the boom was eased out like that was when you would want to apply the vang? I have the parts to rig a vang but have not gotten time to do it yet other things have been more important. When you have it set up as a preventer is it also pulling the boom down like the vang so the effect is the same with the added benefit of no accendental gybe?

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Arlyn Stewart
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Response Posted - 04/12/2006 : 02:22:57

Todd, yes... one of the eyes used are actually in the picture on the stanchion abreast of the mast. They are there as part of the mast raising system but work very well for a preventer/vang, stow point for one end of the whisker pole, eye for sister clip for anti foul line for jib and lashing eye for the inflatable when its on the foredeck.

I'd suggest em on boats that don't have a mast raising system... they are very handy.

Keep in mind, that I don't use a preventer in a strong breese... doing so might overload the stanchion. As well, preventers in a strong breese can be dangerous.

Edited by - Arlyn Stewart on 04/12/2006 02:26:42

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