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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

Blue water sailing

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SailormanCGA72
1st Mate

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77 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/11/2006 : 22:06:14

One of my marina neighbors is considering buying a C25 with the intention of sailing from Port Isabel Texas to Cancun Mexico. I discussed with him the upgrades I would make to the C25 to make it a blue water boat. It is my opinion that the C25 is not and was not designed as an ocean going boat. I would like to hear from some of you out there to get your opinion. Am I just too much of a "chicken of the sea"? In my Coast Guard career I saw way too many "floaters" who disregarded common sense and ended up paying with their lives. I think the C25 is a great coaster, but not a blue water boat.

Regards,

Steve

Steve S.
"Myot CynPat" 82 TRWK conversion Hull No. 3002

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2006 : 11:01:35

I've taken my C25 singlehanded on some coastal offshore voyages and I think its a great boat but there are some serious problems for going blue water offshore for an extended time period. I've been out for 3 weeks without touching land (anchoring frequently though). The biggest issue is it is just too small to store everything you need. You will be uncomfortable, both in motion and very cramped in space. Don't plan on ever motoring in truly rough conditions. XXL shaft outboard or not (unless you have an inboard).

Fuel - I carried 20 gallons.
Propane for cooking - I carried about 10 of those little bottles and used 2.
Lighting - I use candle lanterns and an oil lamp inside to conserve power.
Food and water - I used about 1 gallon of water per day. Also consumed many of those little juice boxes and bottled drinks. Go with food assuming no refidgeration or ice
Clothes - two or three soft bags.
Foulies - two sets, one light, one heavy.

Mods for extended crusining

Solar panels
propane barbeque
cockpit table
cockpit awning
I wish I had - dodger and bimini - must get out of the SUN.
kayak
dinghy (in quarterberth) and outboard (on stern rail)

Mods to make the boat safer

Dual batteries
electric bilge pump
2 manual pumps
keel bolts sistered (would not take a swinger)
all hatches dogged closed including anchor and cockpit
lower companionway board bolted in
I added limber holes to all internal compartments allowing drainage to bilge
boarding ladder
Tighten all internal bulkheads
doublecheck all rigging (standard and running)
double reefed main
headsails - 155, 135, 110, 60, spinnaker (poleless asym asym would be better for you)
4 bolts to hold down pop top
Lots of tools, wire, tape, sail repair, rope, fuses, digital VOM
3 anchors (2 for bow and 1 lighter stern anchor)

Electronics

fishfinder (or depthfinder is essential)
gps
autopilot
backup autopilot for true blue water

Now with all this on board the boat is about 2000 lbs heavier and there is just enough room for 2, one person is better.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2006 : 11:50:12

Hi Steve... I agree with your assessment of the C-25, and while Jim has explained how to make it safer, IMHO he's made it a safer coastal cruiser. If your friend sails along the Mexican coast to Cancun and pays attention to weather reports, he should be OK--it looks like he shouldn't have to be more than 25-30 miles from shelter or unable to get help most of the time. If he decides to cross the gulf straight to Cancun, he could be 300+ miles from shelter for some period. When Tropical Storm Zelda pops up and starts wandering around... well, you were a Coastie--you know better than I!

There have been several extended threads on this subject here--you can probably search for them using the word "coastal"... Opinions vary--some say it's only a matter of how adventuresome one is. I say that's fine as long as the adventurer doesn't put other lives in peril when he ends up needing help himself.

But I also am concerned that some people just don't understand what it's like to be out there, with nowhere to hide, when the ocean (or Gulf of Mexico) decides to humble them. Nor do they understand what defines a boat that is really designed to go over the horizon. The C-25, with its short, shallow keel, transom-hung rudder, wide, low companionway, pop-top, moderately-rigged deck-stepped mast, outboard auxiliary (on most), minimal scuppers, narrow side-decks, moderate ballast, and marginal capsize-ratio, is not one of those boats.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 06/12/2006 21:59:04

tinob
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1883 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2006 : 12:38:08

I agree with what Steve and Dave have said and would only consider the trip in a Cat 25 if used as designed, as a coastal cruiser, within a motored dash to a safe harbor in the event that things get ugly in the Gulf. Might be an interesting adventure planned properly.

Val on Calista # 3936, Patchogue, N.Y.

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stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2006 : 23:29:23

What would you think of sailing a C25 from Florida to the Bahamas?

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SailormanCGA72
1st Mate

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77 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2006 : 07:09:55

Sailing to the Bahamas has been done many times in far lesser boats. The key is to watch the weather. With a proper weather window, the sea conditions are much more benign and the potential for disaster reduced by the shorter distances between landfalls. If I'm not mistaken, I've seen some travel reports by folks taking their C25s from Miami to Freeport with no problem. I just takes planning.

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2006 : 09:34:24

There are several local MacGregor sailors who have made the trip from Florida to the Bahamas.
They've trailered their boats from here (western canada) down to Florida and made the passage to the Bahamas.
When I was researching boats prior to buying my C25, I briefly considered the MacGregor because of the accounts of one of them, a local teacher.(there are three MacG from here that I know of that have made this trip)
http://pstobo.popstogo.com/start.html

Edited by - on

Mark Loyacano
Navigator

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USA
247 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2006 : 10:05:25

This link will detail how a Catalina 27 was modified before going on a long ocean cruise.

http://cruisenews.net/cgi-bin/dockside/webbbs_config.pl/read/78

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5913 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2006 : 10:48:24

A friend of mine, now in his eighties, sailed his C25 to the Bahamas and back 7 times. It's a short trip that isn't particularly difficult or dangerous, but it does take planning. But a C25 isn't a bluewater boat, and isn't designed to withstand days or weeks of the kind of heavy weather that might be encountered on an open-sea passage.

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