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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Cracked tiller, any advice?

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DanM
Captain

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USA
256 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/14/2006 : 14:06:29

On our first shakedown sail of the year I put some downward pressure on the tiller and heard a "crack". Returned to the marina without incident and took the tiller home for inspection. There is dark deteriorated wood through the centerline of the three bolt holes. Beyond the forwardmost hole, a crack extends 2 inches on a downward diagonal.
I remember a post advising to clean it out and load it up with epoxy, but I did a search without finding it. Will that work? Is it safe? Should I bother? If so, low long could I expect it to last and/or should I order a new one?

DanM _/)
'85 C25 4870
Buffalo, NY-Pt.Abino, ON
www.buffalocanoeclub.com

Edited by - DanM on 06/15/2006 06:28:55

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2006 : 14:18:30

They are cheap and look beautiful when new and freshly varnished, get a new one and the whole boat will look nicer.

Edited by - on

djn
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1561 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2006 : 16:55:03

Hi Dan, I had the same thing happen but could not afford the new tiller at this point so I brought it home and cleaned out the crack and filled it full of west system epoxy. Before I did that I sanded the whole thing down to bare clean wood and epoxied the whole thing. It looks like new. Cheers. p.s., don't lean on it LOL

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2006 : 19:49:36

With rot and a break back at the mounting holes I strongly advise replacing the entire tiller.

Loss of steerage at a bad moment can put your boat and the occupants at risk.

Edited by - on

ajski1000
1st Mate

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USA
52 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2006 : 22:01:08

Replace it, IMHO its a waste of time and money jerry rigging something to vital as a tiller!

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2006 : 22:03:51

I had a tiller with what sounded like similar damage - so I drilled out the rotted parts & filled the holes with epoxy, drilled new bolt holes in the epoxy, wrapped about 40ft of wire tightly around the end, then epoxied the wire to the tiller. And generally cleaned up the tiller with new varnish.

The first time I used my 'repaired' tiller it failed in spectacular fashion.

I'm too embarrased to tell you what I used as an emergency tiller.
I bought a new one from CD, they're inexpensive and they do look good. West Marine also has them at comparable prices.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2006 : 22:09:06

Tillers are cheap...buy a new one.

Edited by - on

DanM
Captain

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USA
256 Posts

Response Posted - 06/15/2006 : 06:25:39

Thanks! I'll respect the wisdom of the consensus. It's only $59 (or $89 for the deluxe) from CD.
I have probably worked at least that much to clean out, epoxy and clamp the old one, so that we can enjoy a (light) sail while waiting for shipment. I plan to cut down 1 inch or so to offset new holes. BTW, while working on it, I noticed a 3/8 hole running thru the centerline from the point where the handle curves, to about the point of the first bracket hole, 8+ inches. What's that for?

Edited by - on

tinob
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1883 Posts

Response Posted - 06/15/2006 : 08:09:54

Smart move Dan, I nursed an old tiller for years putting more varnish, sandpaper,and time into the project than the cost of a new one..."too soon dumb, too late smart"

Val on Calista # 3936, Patchogue, N.Y.

Edited by - on

PZell
Admiral

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USA
548 Posts

Response Posted - 06/15/2006 : 12:17:20

Dan:
That sounds like a hole for the SS fitting to accept the end of a hiking stick (tiller extender..i.e. forespar).

Edited by - on

tinob
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1883 Posts

Response Posted - 06/15/2006 : 16:32:47

Dan your discription of the location of the 3/8" hole could be a tiller extender connection point as Sparky suggests. On my tiller the extender connection point is 2" back from the forward end of the stick.

There is a posibility that your PO had an Autohelmn. The connection point for that unit is 18" forward of the pintle.

I'm not sure what your 3/8" hole is for.

Val on Calista # 3936, Patchogue, N.Y.

Edited by - on

Gloss
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1916 Posts

Response Posted - 06/15/2006 : 20:41:11

when the Catalina factory sent me a free tiller they also included the stainless brackets which connect it to the rudder. They were a lot heavier than the old one. I think that CD sells these heavy duty brackets, you may want to see what they cost

I connected my ST2000 tiller pilot 16" forward of the pintle centerline for faster response time

Good luck, and good move in getting a new tiller. Keep the old one as a spare when you are refinishing the new one in a couple of years.

Be sure to epoxy all of your new screw and bolt holes too

Edited by - on

DanM
Captain

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USA
256 Posts

Response Posted - 06/15/2006 : 21:54:46

Thanks again, and also for your encouragement. Besides ordering the deluxe model from CD, the Admiral prompted me to order the tiller cover. Their's goes all the way back to cover the top of the rudder and keeps all the bolts out of the weather, not just the stick.

Val and Frank, A PO probably did have an Autohelm. I found wiring to a connector in the starboard coaming pocket when trying to figure out the clipped spaghetti behind the switch panel.

Dennis, I just read your story! (Missed it while in ABQ). I'm sorry you had such trouble and let me congratulate you for your positive attitude! My little trials seem insignificant compared to what you went through. You "actually had a good time"! Man!

Edited by - on

Heartbeat
Navigator

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USA
161 Posts

Response Posted - 06/22/2006 : 10:36:11

My tiller had a very similar failure mode a couple of years ago. I wrapped the tiller with an old dock line and it got us through the race and back to the dock.

I ordered another one for $80 or so, but it took 3 weeks to show up.

I took the old one home and epoxied (West/Gugeon) and glassed the piss out of it. (We were racing the boat 3 days a week and were not willing to miss the races. Yes, we took a flag that year.) The repair held up well and now the old tiller sits in the basement for when the new one breaks.

Definately go with the improved CD side plates.

While you are at it, replace the pintles and gudgeons with the improved CD ones. The plastic bearing makes for very smooth rudder action.

-Matt Q.

Edited by - on

DanM
Captain

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USA
256 Posts

Response Posted - 06/22/2006 : 18:26:02

Just an update. One week and waiting for shipment. Glad I epoxied it, we had a nice sail.

Maybe I sanded it too much because it was a very snug fit to the rudder. I drilled a 1/4" hole from the top down through, behind the middle hole and bolted it with 1" washers to strengthen the laminates.
Beside cutting it down and drilling new holes, I also drilled a pair of new offset holes in the plates (center hole)to emulate the improved model that CD offers. The plates are very heavy duty stainless. Glad I have a drillpress! When the new tiller arrives and we remove the old one again, my son will weldfill the unused holes to make it pretty.

Edited by - on

djn
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1561 Posts

Response Posted - 06/22/2006 : 19:07:05

Hi Matt, I replaced my Pinles and Grudgeons with the CD version with the plastic bushings and the rudder has slop in it. It is not a snug fit like I expected. Is this normal? Cheers.

Edited by - on

Heartbeat
Navigator

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USA
161 Posts

Response Posted - 06/23/2006 : 12:18:54

Dennis,

No slop on mine at all. Tighter than the originals. The helm feels unbelievably smooth.

Are you saying that the pintle to the the plastic bushing is loose? Mine is not a press-fit, but it certainly isn't loose.

I need to drag the camera down to the boat this weekend. I'll see if I can take a picture.

-Matt Q.

Edited by - on

djn
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1561 Posts

Response Posted - 06/24/2006 : 07:23:47

Hi Matt, yes, the pintles could be 1/64th larger, then they would be an exact fit into the plastic gromets. Cheers.

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oldsalt
Admiral

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USA
578 Posts

Response Posted - 06/24/2006 : 09:00:14

Ah yes, the "old hidden rot/delamination around the holes under the stainless steel plate syndome".

Many an otherwise fine looking rudder has failed due to this (plently of posts on this). Also plenty of posts regarding failed repairs as well.

A new rudder with new plates will dress up your vessel and get you out on the water safely.

I'ts a good investment.

Edited by - on

StSimon
Captain

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USA
298 Posts

Response Posted - 06/24/2006 : 10:19:38

Absolutely order a new one but don't throw out the old.

I did as someone else mentioned, West Systems to but it back together then glassed with matting over the whole thing. Don't put it in the garage waiting for the next failure though. Put it in the boat where it will be there when you need it !!!

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The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.