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advetures in trailer a standard rig fin keel.

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bear_tm4
Navigator

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USA
143 Posts

Initially Posted - 07/16/2006 : 22:55:17

Well, I did it, put Surprise back on the trailer for the big haul from Kansas to Kentucky. The day started out your typical Kansas summer day, HOT! So, started by staging the trailer by the ramp then retriving the extension. I should have know the day was going to be a great one, when I arrive to find the extension buried in the weeds, not bad, just lift it up and hook up right, not right, this thing is made from what must have been a prop shaft on the Arizona, (well not quite)still this thing is no easy lift,took two of us, so got it hooked up(no jack, dont ask me not my toy), now off to the ramp to stage the whole train, first the trailer, then the extension, now to get the boat.
Ok this is not bad, something I can work with, she fires up, I retrieve all the bumpers, dock lines and we are off, motoring out. How I wish I could sail today a nice breeze is picking up, (just a sucker breeze the day would prove to be fairly dead and stiffling) but I resist the urge, and continue to the ramp, to find my partner in crime today backing my truck and train into the water, when I arrive the whole thing looks like a lazy stretched Z extending into the water, no problem take a pass find the trailer make sure I am straight and come around. I start my move and come in slow and carefull, and I am on, easy. I go forward to see how we are doing and my partner is telling me back off, I move out quicker and to my horror, find the bow of Surprise gently grinding way on the winch, oh no!, and to my pain this is when the power boaters decide that the all need to scream by at top speed. this increses the scraping, I cant budge her, so back to the motor, full speed astern...we are going no where, she has her keel firmly planted on the trailer. so back to the front, I instruct my partner to back us down some. This helps but the damage is done, lucky its only the gel coat, so not to bad. I was trying to get her as far forward on the trailer as possable, when I put her in 6 weeks ago she was tail heavy on the trailer no tounge weight. We get her set on the trialer finaly after expressing my best to a power boater that blasted up to the dock like he was the only boat on the lake. Any ways, Surprise is set on the trailer, now time to pull her out, slow and steady, we pull up the ramp. But still yet after all my work to get her further forwad on the trailer its not enough, I have moved her a good 6 inches but cant get her any more forward. I examin the situation carefully. cant do it, the trailer is not long enough...the trailer came with the boat when I bought her 8 weeks ago, and was just used to get the boat from water to store on trailer in winter. Guess I just screwed for now. Setting on dry land there is room to move forward but you factor in the angle of the ramp water and it dont work. I will make it the extra few inchs causer the trailer to balance so I will put some wieght on the front of the trailer and that should help.
Now we begin the process of building the step and crutch system to lower the mast. Its not been down in over two years, but no problem I have my rechargeable Craftsman set with me. I am good to go. so I think. I start with the pulpit, I am using a chunk of scrap 6x6 its perfect, I notch it with my trusty saw, chisel it out and mount it, but for some reason my batterys are dead, well must have been the material. Its hot we have worked hard, so we retreat for the camper AC and lunch.
After a long lunch we head back to finish the project. we move to the stern and find that my idea for building my crutch using the rudder mounts is not going to work, it has holes not pins, so my screw eyes are out, damn it, this day is not going well. But I am not be detered, we cut blocks to put on the 2x4 with screws to mount in the rudder mount points, this works, but now my batterys are dead again and no way to cut the wood to build the U shape to rest the mast in. I am fit to be tied, the first time my tools have failed me. Damn technology. I am guessing that the cutting and heat have combined to deal me the fatal blow.
I got the 2x4 put up and I am getting this mast down today one way or the other. Time is short I have to pull out by next Thursday. So its time to spring into action. I get my spring out and hook it to the winch on the trailer,(I use a 160lb garage door spring) then hook the other end to main halyard, insureing the other end is tied off secruely. Now using the winch we load the spring, and undo the forestay, the forward lower stays, and loosen two uppers, now we are ready to go. I have my partner take some of the tension off the main with the winch. Its not moving, so I grab the other halyard and give it a gental pull from the stern that breaks it loose, time to give her some more slack. she starts to come down nice and slow. moving back across the cabin top to the cockpit, wow that is a long step down to the cockpit holding a 28 foot stick, but she is holding steady so down I go, and give the call to take off some more slack, that does it the mast is resting on the 2x4. Now its time to get my partner up here to get this thing off the end of that little 2x4. Only hitch here is getting the pin out of the base of the step, but it comes and we get the mast layed nicely accros the top of Surprise. Now its just straping and tying the mess of lines and shrouds so they dont flog poor Surprise on her trip to Kentucky. This done I am tired, beat. time to head home and call it a night,
This should be the end of my ordeal, but could be only the begining. When I arrive back at the house I smell the tires, they are smoking hot, I attribute this to low air, so going to air them up and give her a test run before the big haul. I hope tires are not in my future, I already spent 500.00 in labor putting a new axel with an electric brake on, that hurt. They told me labor was 75.00 per hour. Ok I can deal with that its bad but shouldnt take a 2 hours to do the job. Ha, it took 3.5 hours with two guys doing the work, if you do math the way they do it took 6 hours. This is when they tell me its 75.00 per man hour working on your project. Yikes, if I had know that I would have found someone else to do the work....well I can hardly afford any more bad luck on this trip to Kentucky.
The one good thing is Surprise is a great saling boat, she needs some TLC, but every time we have been out she has always been great. I am begining to wonder if I should not have poured the Champagne over the trialer too. oh well. I will keep you all posted on my trip and let you know if it ends well or in hell.

Capt.Bear, C42MKII "Surprise" #998 WK

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 07/16/2006 : 23:12:43

Hi Barry,

Wow ... Murphy was working against you today!

Take it slow & easy on your trip, and be safe ... good luck! Let us know how everything goes.

Edited by - on

tmhansen
Captain

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USA
397 Posts

Response Posted - 07/17/2006 : 03:03:08

Good luck on your trip. I had similar trailer issues that took a few times to figure out. A few inches makes a big difference at the hitch
and how well it tows. Move as much weight foward as you can and keep it slow.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 07/17/2006 : 06:58:53

What part of Kansas are you leaving? This will scare the who who out of you, but many people get the boat forward with a hard slam on the brakes. Check for adjustment in the bow stop arm.

Edited by - Frank Hopper on 07/17/2006 06:59:38

tmhansen
Captain

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USA
397 Posts

Response Posted - 07/17/2006 : 15:11:11

I was able to move mine forward by trailering it to the local boat hoist. He picked it up and we repositioned it on the trailer. I imagine that boat hoists are not frequent in Kansas but you might have another similar option.

Edited by - on

Scooter
Navigator

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USA
228 Posts

Response Posted - 07/17/2006 : 20:45:35

I had similar issues with tongue weight getting her out in time (or should I say rush) for Ophelia. I was just a little shy. I could pick up the tongue myself. I shifted the motor/gas/everything forward. I mean everything I could move forward I did until I was comfortable.

Everything you move forward subtracts from the stern and adds to the bow.

I now have my pads adjusted better when launching so it's not as big an issue.

I also had "fun" the first time. You never forget the first time.

Edited by - on

atgep
Master Marine Consultant

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1009 Posts

Response Posted - 07/17/2006 : 21:40:14

The simple weight x arm = Moment is how to figure it up . The balance point is between the axles.

Lets just say the tongue is 18 feet forward of the balance or reference point. The engine is 15 feet behind. removing the engine and placing it on the reference. 15x100lbs= -1500ft lbs. 1500 divided by the 18 forward = 83 additional pounds on the tongue. It is a pretty reliable way to figure out the results of moving things about.

Tom.

Edited by - on

atgep
Master Marine Consultant

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1009 Posts

Response Posted - 07/17/2006 : 21:45:26

And here is the NASA version for those with pocket protectors. :}

http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/WindTunnel/Activities/balance_of_forces.html

Edited by - on

sweetcraft
Admiral

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USA
816 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2006 : 01:05:06

I have moved FK 25 several times by finding a slope and using a come-a-long with a strap that is carpeted to protect keel. Wet the bunks and also use the trailer winch to add pull. This method is safer than the slam on the brakes method. Do you use a chain to hold the boat down at the bow on the trailer so we don't read about the boat climbing up on your tow vehicle after a panic stop? Tire pressure guage? Spare tire, tie downs, lights working, brakes working and grease the bearings but not too much are some of the pre trip list items. The cables should be tied so they can't saw the gelcoat from road vibration, duct tape the rig fittings and secure the turn buckles so you don't drop them on the highway. My list is from trailering experiences and of course learning the hard way. Good luck on the prep and road time.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2006 : 07:13:11

Here are a couple of other tidbits for you...

Get one of the debris shields for your keel if you have a fixed keel. It is a strong mesh fabric that stretches from the bottom of the keel to the forward bunk/stand etc. It will keep nice sized rocks from kicking up and nailing the snot out of your keel. I tried to find a pic for an example, but couldn’t. Most sail lofts will make them rather inexpensively.

We used carpet on the the rails were the tie-down straps touched. It will keep the straps from cutting or cutting through due to vibration.

Instead of tape, which can leave a mess, wrap your entire mast, shroud, stays, halyards and turnbuckles in saran wrap. You can get a couple hundred yards at Costco or Sams for about 12 bucks and it is enough to go about 4 or 5 times. This will keep stuff from falling off, getting full of highway residue and keep it from clanking around and possibly damaging the gel coat.

Going a long way? Picking bugs out of the bottom paint isn’t usually as easy as hitting it with a hose. If your racing those bugs are making your otherwise “smooth as a babies bottom” bottom and all the work you put into it useless. Get a regular bottle of dish soap and a cheap 2 dollar sponge mop. Mop the soap onto the bottom paint. Upon arrival, hose it off and the road grime and the bugs that went kamikaze into your hull will come off in a flash.

Being one that has either used a mast hoist, or sheer muscle and a lot of swearing I am having a hard time envisioning your garage spring setup. Do you have any pictures or drawings?

Duane

Edited by - on

MattL
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2006 : 12:16:51

I use the A frame set up described here at many locations. Works great for me. By myself I can get the mast up or down in about an hour of casual labor. If I push it I can get done a little faster.
My trip to Hungington lake for the High Sierra Regatta was an adventure too. Two week ends ago a friend and I took the boat up to the lake. A fellow came up to us after dropping the boat, he told us that in his entire week there watching big boats being launched he didn't see any go as smooth as ours. About 5 miles on the road home, this lake is at 7500 feet with a pass at 8000 feet we have to go over the truck broke down. In this area cell phones don't work. A passing truck stopped and gave us a tow to a snow park to drop of the tuck and trailer (boat is at the lake) and gave us a ride down the hill to a place we could wait for a ride to pick us up. I couldn't call my wife, she took the kids to see Captain Jack, my buddy couldn't get anyone in his family. We finally got another friend to come pick us up. Took close to 2 hours for him to get to us, then the ride home. The tow truck bill was $700 for a broken wire to be re soldered to the fuel pump.
Last week end the family and I went to the race. out of 6 boats we got a 4th and two 5ths. Sunday we pulled the boat out, another smooth operation, but as the trailer left the water we saw a flat tire on the right front. Took it to the parking lot and started to jack boat and trailer to get the tire off. Had to move the truck and it went clank, clank, clank. A guy passing by said that didn't sound good, he looked under the hood (he is a mechanic) and said it sounded like the tork converter. After taking the tire off the rest of the way, I jacked the truck up and he removed the dust cover and said the tork converter was OK, but the end of the starter motor case was busted off and that caused the clanking. Bolted everything back to gether and started the engin. Chris, the mechanic, said don't shut it off because it might not start again. Cool, how much gas do I have now. Got home with the flat tire in the back. Now I'm calling around for an estamate for a new starter and still need to get the tire fixed.

THE SAILING WAS GREAT.

Edited by - on

DaveC25
Navigator

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USA
152 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2006 : 06:32:39

While you guys are talking about trailering "incidents" I guess I'll add my two cents. A couple months ago I was trailering Pretty Penny, as always, to the boat ramp when while turning a corner onto the highway I noticed the front left trailer wheel was basically turned sideways and wobbling under the trailer. I pulled over and found that the bearing had disintegrated, which sheared the crown nut's cotter pin, and basically the hub and wheel just popped off. Luckily it stayed under the trailer rather than rolling out, possibly hitting someone's car or something. Well, I removed the bad wheel (it was already off, just stuck under the trailer) and limped back home with one wheel on that side. After inspection, I found that the axle had been damaged by the wheels motion after it came off (apparently was off for several miles) so I had to get a new axle. I ended up replacing all the hubs and leaf springs as well, but the process took over a month and a half since I was pretty busy with other things.

So this past weekend I was trailering her to the ramp for her first voyage since the trailer incident and as I'm turning onto the same highway, I look back and see all the trailer wheels are fine. But just then I hear a "pop" under the truck hood and see the temperature start to rise. Keep in mind this is a new F-350 dually, so the boat is nowhere near the 26000lb GVWR limit. Well, I pull over (luckily at a restaurant) along US-1 and pop the hood. Coolant is everywhere. I'm like, WTF?? So I remember back a few months ago when I had a warranty repair done to fix a leaky front seal. I examine the front seal and surrounding area and notice that the radiator hose is COMPLETELY off the water pump, and there is no clamp. Apparently the "mechanic" at the Ford dealer forgot to put the clamp back on and when I finally put some pressure on it by towing a trailer the thing finally popped off. Luckily I was parked outside a restaurant and there was a gas station down the street. So I walked down to the gas station and buy two hose clamps (to put together because they were smaller than the one for the hose) and was able to put the hose back on and clamp it (receiving several burns in the process from the hot engine, it was a surprisingly tight fit) and the restuarant was nice enough to let me have a few gallons of water to refill it. After that I got to the ramp and launched and everything went well after that......except for the grounding in front of Captain Hiram's with all the patrons watching...but that is another embarassing story... :)

It's funny, but in all the trouble I've had taking Pretty Penny sailing, two things are consistent:

1. She's never been the cause of any trouble, and always performs flawlessly.
2. I still enjoy sailing, much to the surprise of many of my friends that suggest regularly that I should get a power boat.

Most of the problems have been trailer/mechanical things or, more often, my own stupidity or lack of attention...which, thinking about it, might be the reason for the trailer/mechnical problems as well.

Cheers!

-DaveC25

Edited by - DaveC25 on 07/19/2006 06:35:27

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