Association Forum - Tall rig Pros and Cons

Assn Members Area · Join

Home.

Association Forum

Ships Store

Cruising

Racing

Technical Tips

Photo Gallery - New

Boat Search - Updated

Manuals & Brochures

Swap Meet

Links

Officer Flag Line & Staff

Bylaws & Constitution

Members Area

Join the Association

Notice:
The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.

Association Forum

Username:	Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

All Forums

Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Tall rig Pros and Cons

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Author

Topic

rabaroni
Deckhand

Member Avatar

USA
3 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/20/2007 : 22:22:00

I am looking at purchasing a C 25, Tall Rig. What are the pros and cons of a tall rig, espescially for a new sailor? Thank you.

Edited by - on

sweetcraft
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
816 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 05:16:58

Tall has lower boom which is hazard for new sailors. The mast is more difficult to raise than standard. Better light wind sailing but is more tender in strong wind. Price is what it's all about.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5932 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 06:14:19

Jim hit it very concisely, but I never thought of the low boom as a hazard. I sailed mine for about 22 years, am over 6 feet tall, and the boom height is just something you get accustomed to. Whenever you're on any sailboat, you take note of the boom height and don't put your head in that zone. The tall rig is faster than the standard rig in all but very strong winds, and is a pleasure to sail.

While it is more difficult to raise the mast on a tall rig, it usually doesn't make much of a difference as a practical matter. If you want to raise the mast by yourself, you need a gin pole or similar system to do it with either rig. The main difference is if you're going to raise it by having a friend or two walk it up, then two good men can raise the standard rig, and it takes three to raise the tall rig.

If I were looking to buy one, I'd much prefer the tall rig, but be happy with either rig. The most important considerations would be to find the boat that was in the best condition, with the best equipment, for a fair price.

Edited by - on

Justin
Admiral

Members Avatar

502 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 06:53:28

Another big consideration between the two is if you want a bimini. You can easily fit a bimini under a standard rig and have plenty of headroom. I have some friends with tall rigs and they want to install a bimini, but their options are a lot more limited. They have come on my boat and really enjoyed the higher boom height. Installing a bimini on a tall rig has been done, but going on deck from the cockpit is more difficult and you have quite a bit less headroom. A bimini makes such a difference on those hot and humid summer days.

Edited by - on

ilnadi
Captain

Members Avatar

452 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 08:42:00

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Justin4192
 Another big consideration between the two is if you want a bimini. You can easily fit a bimini under a standard rig and have plenty of headroom. I have some friends with tall rigs and they want to install a bimini, but their options are a lot more limited. They have come on my boat and really enjoyed the higher boom height. Installing a bimini on a tall rig has been done, but going on deck from the cockpit is more difficult and you have quite a bit less headroom. A bimini makes such a difference on those hot and humid summer days.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">We have a TR with a bimini. Headroom is a consideration. Compare Justi's bimini (http://justin4192.zoto.com/img/640x480x0/b0d74cc8b6cbdcd4c8c214cdc8457f29-.jpg) to ours (http://mattcj.dyndns.org/~ilnadi/gallery/v/Sailing/album07/IMG_0007.jpg.html) {sorry, too lazy to post picts}

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 09:04:03

Another consideration is how and where you sail. If you want to race, the tall rig is obviously faster in light-to-moderate wind. The first reef on a TR makes it essentially the SR. That suggests that if you normally sail in stiff breezes and want a comfortable ride, you might prefer the SR (sometimes reefed).

PHRF supposedly makes all boats equal, but it's discouraging to be passed by every boat in the race even if you correct out over half of them... The TR gives you more options, but the SR is the "friendlier" rig for cockpit headroom and casual sailing, and is competitive in heavier air. For my purposes, I liked my SR better than a friend's TR. (I think he did too.)

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 02/21/2007 09:05:48

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5932 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 09:05:18

Nadi's photos show the difference between the two rigs well. The boom on the tall rig is 1' lower than the boom on the standard rig. Nadi's Bimini is installed with the boom at it's normal height for a tall rig. If you want more room under the Bimini, you can have your sailmaker install extra reef points for a short reef, 1' high. That should not be an expensive alteration. When you want to use your Bimini, you tuck in the short reef, and raise the sail to the top of the mast, which will raise the boom 1' higher. That will make your Bimini the same height as the Bimini on a standard rig boat.

When you tuck in a 1' reef, your mainsail will have about the same area as a standard rig boat, but your genoa, which is the sail that gives your boat the most drive, will still have the much larger sail area of the tall rig. The good thing about this is that, when you want to sail your tall rig under the Bimini, you can have the same amount of overhead clearance as if it was a standard rig boat, but, if you want to race the boat in light air, you can lower the Bimini, shake out the reef, and your tall rig will still have it's maximum sail area.

Edited by - on

rabaroni
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
3 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 09:09:04

Thanks for the comments. The boat is a 1986 model, with a good trailer with brakes, newer Honda engine 10 HP, Main, Jib Genoa 150, Tri Rad Cruising Spinaker, 80% Strom Jib, self tailing winches, autopilot, new bottom, knot/depth meter. Asking $12,000. I do think having limited room with a binimi would be an issue, but I'm new at all this. Thanks again for comments.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 09:13:27

Two things about the Steve's reef-and-hoist idea:

(1)You need to be sure the gooseneck isn't going to be right at or very close to the mast gate (where it's inserted and the slugs feed in and out). I wouldn't consider mast gate plates to be sufficient to hold the gooseneck slider in place.

(2)I think some later models have fixed goosenecks, which would nix that idea.

Edited by - on

rabaroni
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
3 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 09:32:12

I meant to ask what folks thought about the price of $12,000? Thanks again.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 09:43:13

Swing or fin? To me that is absolutely top dollar and would only be appropriate if it was a truly turn-key boat with no scheduled expenses within 3-5 years. I would hold out for an 89 with all the advantages of a flat floor, more headroom, redesigned deck, better spars, etc. at that price.

Edited by - Frank Hopper on 02/21/2007 09:46:37

ilnadi
Captain

Members Avatar

452 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 11:00:32

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Dave Bristle
 Two things about the Steve's reef-and-hoist idea:
2)I think some later models have fixed goosenecks, which would nix that idea.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">We have a fixed gooseneck. So all you can do is reef the leech, so to speak, and have the boom not parallel to the deck, kinda sounds kloogy. I thought about it but the truth is we don't race (probably never will), use the bimini all the time so any solution better be permanent. Now trying to decide whether to leave good enough alone and let the next owner have a stock boat or make changes.

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 11:45:06

No one has mentioned the tall rig mast is heavier.

My buddy Gary has a TR 1989 Wing, I have a Standard 1978 fin.

Under 5 knots of air he can sail away from me.

5 to 15 we are equal - I just fly a bigger headsail.

15 to 20 I start to gain an advantage but I have more headsails and can go to my 135.

Over 20 I say goodbye, especially upwind.

This being a light wind area, most days I wish I had the TR. When I'm double reefed under 110 jib and blasting through 5 foot waves at 6 knots (and loving it) I am very satisfied with the SR.

All in all not too much real difference. If he flys a 110 and I a 135 we are dead even on most days.

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2007 : 15:31:20

Seems like a mighty high price. Look at this one in the swap meet. He's been trying to sell for a while. Might be willing to talk. It's on a trailer at Lake Mead. Might be worth the drive for $5000.

http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=13476

Edited by - on

Topic

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Jump To:

Association Forum

Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.