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Daren
1st Mate

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USA
81 Posts
Initially Posted - 06/20/2007 :  14:22:58  Show Profile  Visit Daren's Homepage
When I tack my boat the clew of the headsail always gets caught on my stays. My sheets are attached to the clew with a simple loop knot. Not sure if this because of some error on my part or something else. Maybe my cars are too far aft? Maybe I am keeping too much tension on the sheets? I cannot be the loop know on the clew since it presents such a low profile. The lighter the wind the worse the clew catches on the stays.

Suggestions?
S/V Prima Donna
1986, 15 HP Universal Inboard Diesel, Fixed keel, Hull # 5362
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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts
Response Posted - 06/20/2007 :  15:29:17  Show Profile
If by "simple loop knot" you mean the cow hitch, which can be made with a single continuous sheet by folding the sheet in half, pushing the fold through the grommet, and then pulling both tails through the loop... well, that's the simplest method, but that knot does make a pretty good hanger-upper. It's what I used, and I had a few rare hang-ups.

Are you backwinding the jib before you release it, or pulling it across instead of letting it luff over? If so, releasing earlier and/or not trying to pull it across might help. Let it clear the shrouds before you start trimming. Some people put tubular plastic shroud rollers on the forward lowers to prevent the problem...
Edited by - Dave Bristle on 06/20/2007 15:30:12
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Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1181 Posts
Response Posted - 06/20/2007 :  17:00:10  Show Profile
Here you go:

http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/tech/tech25/nyshdrol.asp
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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts
Response Posted - 06/20/2007 :  20:13:12  Show Profile
Make a set of shroud protectors as detailed in the article... works like a charm. One of the best things you can do to your boat for $10.
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jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts
Response Posted - 06/21/2007 :  13:05:02  Show Profile
One of the best things the PO did for me....a few notes: No need to glue the caps, they snug fit just fine. Plus, not glued allows for ease of removal when unstepping and storing the mast in the off season. Also, I've got 8' ers on the lower forward shrouds and 6' ers on the upper shrouds.
Edited by - jerlim on 06/21/2007 13:05:41
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Ed Cassidy
Captain

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USA
365 Posts
Response Posted - 06/21/2007 :  14:11:04  Show Profile
I may be doing things wrong (probably) but I tend to place a good deal of emphasis on remaining on board by hanging onto the shrouds when moving about the deck. Won't this mod make for a much less secure handhold as I move about? BTW, I haven't reached the point in my sailing career where I actually put up a headsail!
Thanks,
Ed
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dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts
Response Posted - 06/21/2007 :  15:01:56  Show Profile
Go to Lowes or Home Depot and get a 10' length of 1 1/4" plastic pipe (I use 1" on my C-22, went to 1 1/4" on the C-25 figuring the turnbuckles were a bit larger). Cut it in half, or cut 2 sections 4' each, your preference, undo your forward lower turnbuckles and put them on your shrouds. They will roll on the shrouds helping your sail get around the rigging. If you trailer your boat, you may want to saw an opening down the length of the pipe so they snap on and off - using tape top and bottom to secure them on - this makes adjusting the turnbuckles a lot easier - you can tune the rig first and then snap the rollers on.
David
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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts
Response Posted - 06/21/2007 :  15:37:08  Show Profile  Visit Champipple's Homepage
If your knot is getting caught you are releasing the jib way too early. I don't think you need to go through the trouble of adding the plastic. I'm sure they work, and they are rather inexpensive, but if it were really that good everyone would have it. Try going with two sheets and using a bowline for your knots. Whatever line setup you use make sure all the knots are as snug to the sail as possible.

In light wind you're going to hang up regardless, so first make sure that wasn't your issue.

When you do tack, do not release the leeward sheet until your headsail is fully backwinded. Once you have cleanly released, then quickly sheet in on the new tack. Also make sure you break cleanly off the winch by lifting straight up with the line. Don't try to unwrap it and definitely don't try to feed it out with the line still on the can. Also make sure that the line is running freely through your jib car and any turning blocks you have.

If you are not singlehanding, the person on the lazy side at the start of the maneuver needs to take up all the slack before you throw the helm down and then wait for the person releasing to indicate that they have done so.

You may also be trying to point to high coming out of the tack.

If these things doesn't fix the problem 95 percent of the time then I'd go grab the plastic.



and Ed - you'll still be able to hold on. Your emphasis is also correct. One had for you, one for the boat.
Edited by - Champipple on 06/21/2007 15:38:08
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jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts
Response Posted - 06/22/2007 :  22:49:48  Show Profile
1/2" PVC is plenty big, it sits atop the turn buckles - and hanging on is no problem either.
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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts
Response Posted - 06/23/2007 :  15:09:55  Show Profile
>"1/2" PVC is plenty big, it sits atop the turn buckles - and hanging on is no problem either."

Indeed... get (1) 10 foot section, cut it in half. (4) end-caps and use a hacksaw to cut a slot in them so they fit over the shrouds without taking things apart. Use some rigging tape to secure the caps.

I also put some wraps of rigging tape around the shrouds 'up inside' the pipe so the PVC doesn't rattle against the wire... otherwise it was bloody annoying. I suppose a couple plugs fashioned out of some packing foam would have worked as well.
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britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts
Response Posted - 06/23/2007 :  17:17:10  Show Profile  Visit britinusa's Homepage
Is the clew catching on the initial leeward shroud?

Let's assume you are on a tack with the stbd sheet (lee sheet) tight.
When you tack, if the stbd sheet stays tight and the port sheet is used to pull the clew over to the other side, then the clew will tangle with the shrouds.
We only have a 100% jib, so it's really not a problem, but with something larger it's easy for the clew to catch on the leeward shroud. Don't tighten the new leeward sheet until the clew is pushed across (backed) during the tack, and let the old leeward sheet fly. At least, that's what we do.

Paul
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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts
Response Posted - 06/23/2007 :  17:29:10  Show Profile
So, Daren, now you've gotten two diametrically opposed opinions from several people... I guess the message is: Whichever thing you were doing, try the other. And if that fails, make some shroud rollers (without the glue).

BTW, I have a diverging opinion on sheet knots, too: The "cow hitch" on a single continuous sheet does have a tendency to hang on a shroud... Two sheets with bowlines is worth trying, but I'd tie them so there's 6"-or-so loop away from the clew--not tight to it. That way, as the clew passes by the shroud, the sheet can "give" a little to let the knot flip past.

So, is that enough choices for you?
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Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.