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A handful of VHF questions

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John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 01/23/2008 : 18:13:14

When kids and powerboaters start talking over the day's catch on 16, the CG usually come on with the announcement: "Channel 16 is the international HAILING and DISTRESS frequency, take your idle chatter to etc., etc...."

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 01/23/2008 : 18:52:29

On our local lake this is all much easier. No one is monitoring VHF at all. We use cell phones to call 911 if there is an emergency.

Edited by - Nautiduck on 01/23/2008 18:53:02

JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 01/23/2008 : 19:41:09

I think there are just some little differences between common practice on East and West coast. VHF 9 is not routinely used here for hailing. I rarely have my radio on and when it is, it is usually on 71 for Fleet 7 traffic or 69 as we are required to monitor 69 in major races like Newport - Ensenada.

If I am coming in or out of San Diego Bay with major traffic I do put it on 16 to keep getting run over by a departing cruise ship.

By the way, once out of the US all this changes. People hail on 16 and then use whatever channel they darn well please.

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 01/23/2008 : 20:20:59

Love the west coast.... 16 is the channel. Period. Internationally accepted. If you are not on 16, why is your radio even on? Want me to guess what channel you are on? I hate boats that don't respond on 16. You know what I do? I hail the Coasties and give them the vessels name and direction and the fact that I can't hail them for some reason and let the Coasties hail them. Hope they keep a d-base of dumb-a-sses.

Sorry, but "that's the way it is" as Walter would say - and he is a sailor.

sten

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/23/2008 : 20:32:29

You luddites can't monitor more than one channel at a time??

And you're DSC-enabled?? What radio is that??

Edited by - on

glivs
Admiral

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USA
836 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 06:09:53

Prospector,
Just curious what your course suggests for giving positions. As per a recent thread here, does the CG prefer DD,MM,SS, DD,MM.MMMM or? BTW, thanks for starting this thread.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 07:53:12

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking
 If you are not on 16, why is your radio even on?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

To find out where the fish are hittin', you need to constantly monitor the chatter on the upper channels.

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Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 08:57:56

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by glivs
 Prospector,
Just curious what your course suggests for giving positions. As per a recent thread here, does the CG prefer DD,MM,SS, DD,MM.MMMM or? BTW, thanks for starting this thread.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Ours is the Canadian course - not sure if Canada Coast Guard has different preferences to USCG - we were told to give Lat-long coordinates with a visual of local landmark or distance to a known landmark, with direction of travel.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> This is Iris at position of LAT/LONG, approximately one mile south of cabot head heading southwest <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 09:00:06

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by JimB517
 By the way, once out of the US all this changes. People hail on 16 and then use whatever channel they darn well please.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

This is how it works onour lake with a few exceptions - 68 is reserved for marinas, 06 is for securite's and safety info, there are a few others.

In reading this thread I have a lot of respect for you guys sailing out of busy ports. I think you would be very bored on our lake, and I would be a nervous wreck out where you are.

Edited by - on

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 09:14:13

Wow, I'm totally ignorant in this area, barely know how to open a bascule bridge and have gotten some great links and advise. Thanks!

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redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 09:54:55

Quote: As per a recent thread here, does the CG prefer DD,MM,SS, DD,MM.MMMM or?

Degrees, minutes, seconds is what we hear the Coasties using when they issue a PanPan. There is a logic to it. Degrees doesn't sound like seconds, ditto for minutes when it's blowing snot. Funny how this thread made me remember how just a couple of years ago on a long passage - It was a C25, a day can seem like a long passage

- my wife and I used to drill radio calls for fun. The goal of course is to sound competent and not embarrass yourself. We would play underway with a single bottle of beer and if you did whatever scenario correctly, you got a swig. The first time we played, I got most of the beer.

By the third or fourth time we played, my wife had it mastered and we were sharing evenly. nothing beats practice, even if it's in your own head.

One of the stereotypes of the C25 owner and Catalina owners in general was and is that they don't know what they are doing. I HATED THAT! SO, I decided that because I already had experience on bigger boats and was somewhat embarrassed by my boat choice, that I would beef up my anchoring system, blow up the name of the vessel like the big boys so I could be hailed from afar, and basically act and play with the big boys like they do. We were always the smallest boat in the Anchorage in Newport, or Martha's Vineyard, or wherever. Yet because we obviously knew something and you could tell just by looking at our boat and how we handled it and ourselves well, we were befriended by many a real "cruiser" and fortunately one of them introduced us to our current vessel and the lifestyle for real.

Sten

DPO Zephyr - '82 C25, FK, SR
SV Lysistrata - C&C 39 - St. Augustine, FL

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 10:28:09

Good topic!

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 11:52:17

My new handheld will scan. My fixed will not. I almost never use my fixed unless I can't reach the fleet 7 guys on the handheld. I have used the fixed several times to drop out of important races :(

There is very little vessel traffic out of Mission Bay, really no reason to have the VHF on 16 daysailing. One mile out and I won't see a boat all day unless it is a Fleet 7 day. I have 2 exceptions : coming in and out of San Diego Bay (US Navy and commericial traffic), and when I am on a long cruise, then I monitor 16.

If I want company I go to 72, that is the local fishing channel. That is why we use 71 although so does Mission Bay race committee.

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 12:22:48

Quote: There is very little vessel traffic out of Mission Bay, really no reason to have the VHF on 16 daysailing.

Then you won't hear your fellow sailor with a badly leaking stuffing box issue a MayDay. And they won't hear you when your rudder splits in half and you are out of control. Nope, you'll all be looking at the boat on the horizon and wishing that they had their radio on 16. Why is this hard? Really, you are a sailor. The law of the sea mandates that you "keep a sharp lookout, assist if possible, and report all sightings to the US Coast Guard." How will you hear about the pending storm, the guy next to you that is out of Grey Poupon, or that the navy is firing projectiles 1/4 mile from you and that you might be entering a restricted zone?

Love you guys, but you gotta get over this part of sailing. It's for your own good and the good of all around you.

Sten

DPO Zephyr - '82 C25, FK, SR
SV Lysistrata - C&C 39 - St. Augustine, FL

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 12:48:46

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by JimB517
 ...really no reason to have the VHF on 16 daysailing...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">...except for a law that says you have to. Then there's what Sten mentioned--our duty as mariners. If you care about neither,.......

I was daysailing with you, Jim, when smoke was pouring out of your cabin and there was one other boat a mile or so away... Isn't it nice he got our call.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 01/24/2008 12:52:41

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 12:54:15

Why is this even a discussion?

Standard operating proceedure. You wanna make sure the Coasties board your ass, don't answer on 16. I love when people dig their heels in a fight for what they believe, but wow! If any insurance guy is on this list the premiums for Catalina 25's just went up - and rightfully so.

Sten

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 13:14:52

US, Canada, NATO, international Aviation formally adopted the same phonetic alphabet in the 1950's. I think the Brits have some variations - however, when they are on maneuvers here, they use NATO conventions.
I've heard radio chatter from US boats where they use Able Baker Charlie Dog Easy...but that seems to be rare these days.

My message remains the same - be capable of calling for help in an effective manner. If you don't know all the protocols, just listen to your radio.
VHF licence is an excellent course to master.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5902 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 13:32:03

In the Coast Guard Auxiliary publication on Boating Skills & Seamanship, it says:

"You do not have to have your [VHF radio] set turned on. However, when it is on, and not being used for messages, and if it is not a scanner, stay tuned to channel 16."

That having been said, I generally have both my fixed VHF and my handheld operating while underway, because my aging ears can't hear the fixed radio very well from the cockpit, and because it contributes to my safety, as well as the safety of others. Most of the sailors that I know keep their radios on and tuned to channel 16 for all the reasons that Sten gave. But, it's a rule that allows considerable latitude for discretion. For example, while racing, skippers often tune their radios to a channel, other than channel 16, that is assigned by the race committee for racing-related communications. During the race, if any participant calls for assistance, that's the station where they'll most likely make the call, and, if the race committee shortens the course or makes any other announcement, that's the station where you'll hear it.

I frequently hear fishermen on the Bay carrying on lengthy radio chats, and, while some might not consider it the best use of the radio, it's allowed.

The fact that you can't contact another boat on channel 16 doesn't mean he's in violation of any rules or regs. He might be using his radio to send and receive messages on another channel.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 13:58:44

Steve is right.

From the USCG Boating website...

Radio Listening Watch
Vessels not required to carry a radio (e.g. recreational vessels less than 65.6 feet/20 meters in length), but which voluntarily carry a radio, must maintain a watch on channel 16 (156.800 MHz) whenever the radio is operating and not being used to communicate. Such vessels may alternatively maintain a watch on VHF channel 9 (156.450 MHz), the boater calling channel.

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Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 16:53:09

After reading all of this I think I will create a couple of laminated cards that I'll attach to the VHF. The cards will provide easy instructions for turning the VHF on, getting channel 16, calling for the CG or using the DSC, etc. May not get all the formalities correct but give inexperienced crew or guests the ability to call for help if needed.

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OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3467 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 17:28:28

Okay Okay I feel sufficiently chastised. Why my VHF radio is not on...I don't know...maybe habit from years sailing small boats...maybe ignorance...maybe a dumbass...
I think part of it is ease of use issue. Same goes with life preservers. Never wanted to wear one. Then got a self-inflatable one and now I wear one all the time.

The VHF radio...it is not conveniently located. It's under the steps. Even if on...don't believe I would hear it clearly from the cockpit. Even when wanting to use it, for say, alerting a marina coming in for a transient stay...the mic is not on a long cord and so really need to have another onboard to work the tiller/motor and the other work the VHF. Perhaps the answer is a VHF modernization - Go for a new base unit with one of those muti-use wired remotes to the cockpit area. Then that solves the ease of use issue and ...paves the way for forming good habits and being a responsible sailor.

Edited by - OLarryR on 01/24/2008 17:31:10

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 17:39:46

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Nautiduck
 After reading all of this I think I will create a couple of laminated cards that I'll attach to the VHF. The cards will provide easy instructions for turning the VHF on, getting channel 16, calling for the CG or using the DSC, etc. May not get all the formalities correct but give inexperienced crew or guests the ability to call for help if needed.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I stopped at the US Power Squadron booth at the boat show a couple of weeks ago. They had a sticker/card like you descibe. You might check with a local chapter. They also had a sticker that listed common nav aids. Pretty cool quick reference.

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Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 20:39:30

Found this online:

VHF CHANNELS

Channel 16: for hailing, safety and emergency use only.

Channel 9: pleasure-boat hailing channel.

Channels 68, 69, 71, 72 and 78A: recreational working channels.

Channels 1, 7A, 8, 10, 11, 18A, 19A, 63, 77, 79A, 80A and 88A: commercial channels (pleasure boaters are supposed to stay off them).

Channel 13: for requesting bridge openings, although in some areas it's channel 67.

Channels 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 84, 85, 86 and 87: used by marine operators.

Channel 22: Coast Guard working channel, the one where safety broadcasts are made after they alert you on channel 16 and ask you to switch over.

Channel 6: for intership safety communications.

Channels 1, 5, 12, 14, 20, 63, 65A, 66A, 73, 74 and 77: for port operations. (Many of these are used by recreational boats in areas where no port operations exist.)

Channel 70: a dedicated Digital Selective Calling (DSC) channel. DSC is an automated distress system that will also allow us to make digital phone calls through our VHFs sometime in the near future.

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3467 Posts

Response Posted - 01/24/2008 : 22:22:58

Thanks for the channel summary !!

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DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 01/25/2008 : 07:29:59

I'm going to get myself a handheld, brush up on basic radio lingo and start monitoring channel 16. Thanks for the education!

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