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Catalina 25 (swing keel) advice?!?!

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Buzz
Deckhand

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14 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/16/2002 : 21:13:20

Howdy,
A few years back I changed professions, I now teach math and science…..so I have the summers off! Ever since I can remember I’ve been interested in sailing and now have the time to learn. I’m looking to buy a sailboat, possibly a Catalina 25 swing keel. After you read the following maybe I could get some advice.

Sailing exp:
I am a new sailor. I have a Hobie 16…. I’ve been sailing it for 4 years on Higgins Lake, MI. I taught myself to sail the Hobie, via books, and can handle it in windy conditions by myself w/ trap line. Then last year I got interested in costal cruising and took a basic/costal cruising sailing class in Traverse City, MI.

Questions:
With my limited sailing experience do you think this is a good boat for a beginner?

Is it hard to put in/out of water at a typical boat launch and how deep does the water need to be for this?

I live in the Detroit area (Milford), and grand parents have a cottage on Higgins. If any one would like to show me their boat (maybe even take her out for a short sail) that lives in one of these areas, I would greatly appreciate it.

Anthony Rowley

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2002 : 22:17:36

Welcome, Anthony... We hope we get you as a regular. I'm not in Michigan and don't have a swing keel, but depending on your budget, you might want to keep your eyes open for a wing keel as well. For launching and retrieving, they draw only a couple of inches more than the fully-raised swing, but eliminate some annoyances (clunking and humming) and maintenace issues (which are less significant your in fresh water).

Another observation: The C-25 is "trailerable", but is a handful to step and unstep on a regular basis, and at around 7000 lbs gross, requires a serious tow vehicle. If you can keep it in the water somewhere but want the option of storing it at home on the trailer over the winter, the C-25 is ideal. But if you really want to trailer-sail, you should participate in the rigging process before you decide on any boat over about 22 feet. The newer (and more expensive) C-250 Water Ballast model offers some advantages for trailering--in weight and in the rigging process. Arlyn Stewart, a regular on the C-250 forum, has cruised Lake Superior on one.

Can you sail a C-25? Sure--just keep in mind that around a dock or approaching a ramp, it has a lot more momentum than that Hobie! Whether under power or under sail, go EASY in close quarters.

Have fun in your quest, and keep us informed!

Dave Bristle - 1985 C-25 #5032 SR-FK-Dinette-Honda "Passage" in SW CT

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 08/16/2002 22:25:39

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Buzz
Deckhand

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14 Posts

Response Posted - 08/16/2002 : 22:26:36

Thanks Dave!

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1768 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2002 : 11:05:35

Welcome Anthony,

I'm glad you don't go by "Buzz" ... I saw your post this morning and thought I'd been on a bender or something and left a post I didn't remember <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>.

I agree with Dave ... I looked for a wing keel, but they are both rare and expensive. I'm happy to have a swinger though ... the extra maintenance isn't really a big deal ... all the OTHER regular maintenance on a sailboat is the big deal 'seems to me (and we've all got that).

If you can find someone in your area to take you out sailing on a Catalina 25 or 250, I'll bet you a beer you'll make up your mind to get one right then and there. Yes, the 25 is heavy, so you'll need a good tow vehicle. Yes, stepping the mast is a pretty good job, but it can be done by yourself (there are a couple of mast-raising gizmos you can build ... more on that later if you decide to buy the boat).

Good luck in your search ... keep us posted!

Buzz Maring, C-25 SK/SR #68, "Freya"

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1768 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2002 : 11:46:48

Hey Anthony,

I was just cruising eBay and found this listing for a Catalina 25 in your neck of the woods ... it looks to be very well-maintained:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem& item=1852126887

I looked in our Catalina 25 owners' listings for the boat, but I couldn't find it ... 'could be the owner isn't a member of the Association.

Anyway, good luck!

Buzz Maring, C-25 SK/SR #68, "Freya"

Edited by - on

Sailynn
Navigator

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USA
178 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2002 : 13:40:57

I have owned a wing 89 a fixed 85 and currently a 82 swing. Loved them all but the best was the wing 89 though pricey. I sold it four years ago with trailer, motor, roller furling, dodger, & autopilot for $20,000. and had a list of buyers. The plus to the wing is the salon floor is flat, there is more headroom with the pop top down, and less keel maintenance/noise. Drawback to the wing was that the newer model anchor well protruds to low in the v-berth bunk and leaves little room (height) for two peoples toes. I'm, 5'9". The settees in the main salon can be made into a king size bed with a few modifications. Frequently trailer sail and have bought a 3/4 ton diesel for pulling. Don't let the mast raising stories scare you as you can make a a-frame or use guy wires to allow you to do it single handed for trailer sailing. Be sure to check the bulkheads for water damage as I just saw one that was pretty bad. If water depth is an issue where you will be sailing, you should probably go with a swing or wing keel model.

Edited by - on

luckystar
Navigator

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USA
236 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2002 : 13:51:09

Anthony, the listing that Buzz just sent you for ebay looks great to me too! That was real nice of you Buzz to do that. It's another great reason to buy a C25 and join this Association!!

For $8000 with a trailer, WOW! I paid a little under $5000 for my 82 swing without a trailer and it pretty poor shape at that. Plus My motor was bad, no instruments and all the elec. had to be rewired. This one looks great! If you can get it (and I would say that the Buy it now is right on!) you'll be sailing right away!!

I love my swing keel, I do just as much maintenance on it, as Buzz said, as I do on the rest of the boat (if not more on everything else). I'm in fresh water and replace the cable and inspect about every two years. Mine sits in her berth year round with the keel 16 cranks up to help with cockpit drainage. I've gotten over the scare that some folks will try to put you under about them. With maintenance and fresh water, you should have ZERO problems. I have a friend with a fin keel that's having more problems than I've ever had. His is rusting, separating and the bolts in the bilge are leaking. It's been out of the water most of the season to repair. He's been sailing with me on mine!! HE HE!

Good luck, hope you see you around the list after you get her!

Patrick Burnett, Little Rock, AR
S/V Lucky Star #2707 1982 SK/SR

Edited by - on

Buzz
Deckhand

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14 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2002 : 15:23:32

What a great association! You guys are so helpful....thanks! Buzz, I can't believe you found a cat 25 right by my house...I'm presently trying to contact the seller so I can take a look.

Anthony

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2002 : 21:36:18

Anthony,
This may have been a minor oversight by the seller - but I'd be curious about the hull number. My boat is a 1981 also and the hull # is 2428 - just as a point of reference.

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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/18/2002 : 17:44:05

One more thing from me, Anthony... For $8000, I'd consider spending an additional couple of boat units on a marine surveyor, who will check out the things that are harder for us amateurs to see. Examples are: the keel trunk (looking for damage from an uncontrolled drop of the keel), deck coring (checking for moisture), the hull (for blisters, damage, and repairs), thru-hulls (or the infamous to-hulls, as the case may be), chainplates and other rigging components. You'll get a written report that will teach you a lot about your boat and point out some priority maintenance items.

Dave Bristle - 1985 C-25 #5032 SR-FK-Dinette-Honda "Passage" in SW CT

PS: The sale can, and probably should, be contingent on the survey--just as when you buy a house.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 08/19/2002 21:56:57

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jellyfish
Navigator

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USA
171 Posts

Response Posted - 08/19/2002 : 18:04:35

Anthony, welcome aboard! if you have been sailing a Hobie for 4 yrs I think your being quite modest about your sailing skills. you should be able to handle a C25 easy enough. as posted earlier though just remember it takes alot longer to stop! there are alot things to enjoy on a coastal cruiser that you cant have on a beach cat. shop around, ask lots of questions. the main thing to look for in a C25 is the same things you would look for in a good used beach cat: the hull, the rigging, the sails, the big difference is the motor and at around $1500 the motor isnt much of a consideration relative to the whole purchase. I wont advise you as to swing v-wing v-fixed, that is a matter of opinion and you will find alot of those here. All in all you will find the C25 to be the most bang for your buck in a boat this size. here again talk to alot of people before making up your mind! fair winds and following sea!

Edited by - on

Tim~OR-IDA
Deckhand

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17 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2002 : 00:39:57

Look until you find the one for you. I found mine here on the swap meet forum: 1984 swing, traditional, standard rig. With trailer, new Yamaha 4-stroke 9.9, new North sails, autopilot, roller furling, new West Marine dingy and Merc. 2.2, plus lots of other things.

Gave $4500 <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle> <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Good deals still are out there.

PS Just got back from 2 weeks in the San Juans. What a great boat!!!

Tim

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Don Hood
1st Mate

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30 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2002 : 21:20:02

Hey, welcome to the forum! I found mine in the back of a boatyard. They were going to throw her away! How sad, but good for us. She is a Cat 25 sk born in April of 1980, tall rig. She needed sails, motor and such. The port bulkhead was rotted through (watch those chainplate leaks!)and she could not sail until I did some work.
But she was only $500 with an easyloadr trailer. She weighs 6000# and she has been our "sanity clause" for two seasons now.

If you are willing to do some work and the hull is sound, you can find some good deals out there. We are getting into the season to start some serious searching in the backlots.

Good luck!
Don on Namaste' 1980 sk #1929

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John V.
Admiral

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USA
559 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2002 : 23:30:56

Hi Buzz, Welcome to the forum. You could check the Sail Place in Cedar Springs, MI. about 2 hrs from the Detroit area. They usually have a few C25s either on the lot or among their listings. you can visit them at www.sailplace.com (I think) if that doesn't work just do a google search on the sail place name, it should pop up. I am a lifelong sailor and sailed a C22 for some time. I bought my C25 from them a year ago and was very happy with the purchase. I also am a teacher and find that those 10 months of 60 hour weeks really require at least 5 weeks of recovery on a sailboat. My favorite sailing ground is the North Channel where I have a summer home on an Island. since you are in Michigan and can trailer a boat to many wonderful cruising spots the swing keel is the right choice.

John V. Nin Bimash II
77 C25 sk/sr #153

Edited by - John V. on 08/24/2002 01:14:46

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Buzz
Deckhand

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14 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2002 : 20:37:10

Thanks for everyone's input and advice, it was really helpful! As a result of Buzz Maring's suggestion to check out a c25 on ebay....I looked at it and bought it. The owner was extremely nice and went through the boat several times with me.....while his wife cooked us saugage. He's now retired and is moving back to his hometown in Europe....you could really tell he loved his boat and I’m excited to be the new owner.

Sincerely,
Anthony Rowley

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2002 : 20:45:24

Congratulations Anthony, and welcome to the fraternity!

Tell us a little about your new boat.

Don Lucier, North Star
C25 SR/FK

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Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1768 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2002 : 20:55:37

<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle> COOL! <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

That boat sure did look super to me ... I hope you have a great time with her!

'Glad you're one of our group now!

Buzz Maring, C-25 SK/SR #68, "Freya"

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