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Depth sounder wiring route

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dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/22/2008 : 07:59:22

I am installing a fish finder/depth sounder transducer in my 1984 C-25 under the v-berth close to the thru-hull. What is the best route to run the wiring back to the electrical panel and companionway where the display will be mounted?

DavidP
1975 C-22 SK #5459 "Shadowfax" Fleet 52
PO of 1984 C-25 SK/TR #4142 "Recess"
Percy Priest Yacht Club, Hamilton Creek Marina, Nashville, TN

Edited by - dmpilc on 05/22/2008 08:01:00

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
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Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 08:05:42

I installed the transducer using a glob of a toilet bowl wax ring. then ran the wiring along the port side of the hull, where the old wiring for the old transducer was located. Then kept running it behind the bulkheads and then behind the cabinet drawers to the panel. I attached some plastic wire supports where there was none or a broken one to support the wire behind the seats. I have not heard any wire noise, etc so it seems fine the way it was installed and it is out of the way.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 09:08:23

Mine is aft of the stairs, epoxied, wiring a snap from there.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 12:29:59

OLarryR, how did you run the wiring behind the head area? Did you take it high at the end of the v-berth and go along or above the shelf behind the port settee, or try to go low and under the settee? Looking at your pics, it appears that you went high.

Edited by - on

OLarryR
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USA
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Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 13:17:38

I forget how I wired it behind the porta potti area. But I will be on the boat after work today, so i will take a look and report back later tonight.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 18:11:17

Just to try it out, I moved the "transducer/glob of wax" to a spot just aft and to starboard of the keel cable and connected it to a spare battery. Got same reading, but garbled ground information. Not worried about that since I'm only interested in the depth reading. May motor around a bit with it like that before I return it to the area under the v-berth. The wiring would be much easier with it placed aft, but I still think that the best placement is forward of the keel. I suppose that I will need to rig up some kind of "snake" to bring the wiring aft from the v-berth area.

Edited by - on

Luisdecr
Deckhand

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Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 18:38:06

I recently installed a fish finder using the "transducer/blob of toilet ring bowl wax", and just wanted to share my experience with the transducer/wax/hull interface.

Initially, the set up with the blob of wax kind of worked, with sporadic readings. So to improve the readings, I took the blob of wax and kneaded to make it into a tighter blob, but the readings stopped completely and there was not data no matter how I position the xducer and how many times I molded the blob of wax.

So, I bought more toilet wax rings, but this time I melted the wax and poured into a round mold about an inch tall and 4" diameter, and let it cool, took the patty wax to the boat and with a small torch melted one side of the patty wax, embedded the xducer at slight downward angle. Then heated the other side and pressed into the hull (just forward of the keel).

The fish finder works really well with steady readings all the time, and it even shows the fish and their corresponding depths, in addition to the bottom profile.

I guess by kneading the ball of wax I introduced air bubbles, which does not allow the xducer to get accurate readings.

Just my 2 cents.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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4593 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 18:56:22

Hi Liusdecr, How did you run the cable to the battery and to the display unit?
Where did you mount the display unit? Mine is an Eagle 168.

Edited by - on

Luisdecr
Deckhand

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6 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 19:37:43

I added the power cable to an unused fuse panel switch (I think to the deck light, an option which I do not have), connected one side to the bus and the other to one side of the switch.

I have not mounted the display unit yet as I have been sailing every change I get, and place the display on the seat, but I am planning on installing it in the inside of the transom just below where the tiller is, so I can hear the alarm in case I get into 10 feet of water. I also read somewhere that the xducer cable can be cut and extended if needed up to 15 ft. The cable will be routed from the front of the keel to the bilge area and to the the hole where the bilge pump hose comes into the storage under the cockpit seat ( can not remember the actual name for this area), and it goes all the way back to the transom. I have a fin keel so there is plenty of space around the bilge area for the transducer/wax/cable.

Edited by - on

GaryB
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USA
4316 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 19:43:48

One of the things I've read in the past is that you should try not to mess with the wax anymore than necessary. When I mounted mine I just cut out a piece, stuck it to the hull and pressed the transducer into it until it almost touched the glass.

It worked the first time and I was getting the same reading as I did when I hung the transducer over the side of the boat.

I ran my wiring along the starboard side up under the lip where the deck and hull join. It was easy to get the wiring behind the lavatory sink. I also could have run it under the starboard settee.

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3478 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 22:59:04

Dave,

You asked how I routed it into the porta potti area and then back to the switch panel:

From the transducer location, I ran the wire along the port side of the hull thru a bottom opening in the bulkhead separating the VBerth from the Porta Potti area. The trick is then where do you go with the wire. First of all, on my '89 it is a bit easier because in the shelf behind the porta potti there is a Beckson screwed down access cover. That allows you to view the hull and vicinity behind the Porta Potti area. A slot is noticeable at the port side bottom of the main cabin bulkhead that separates the Porta Potti area from the main cabin. The new wire is passed along the port side of the hull from the VBerth area thru the bottom slot in the first bulkhead and then using a wire or a snake passed forward from the port side seat access cover thru the main cabin slot close to the port side hull, I can attach the new transdcer wire to the snake via the Beckson screwed down access cover. But you can also fish around with the snake and get it to pass thru the VBerth area bulkhead and then attach to the new transducer wire. Then the new wire is pullled thru the VBerth area bulkhead and again thru the main cabin bulkhead. Then it passes behind the cabinets to the panel.

Edited by - OLarryR on 05/22/2008 22:59:45

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 08:22:12

In order to get the wire around behind the porta-pottie area on my 84 boat, it looks like I'll have to drill a hole in both sides and use a small rod as a snake, going all the way through to the v-berth side, tape the wire to it, and pull it through. Holes will need to be at least 1/2" due to the plug on the end of the wire.
The hard parts will be drilling on the v-berth side, as access is very limited, and drilling through the bulkhead behind the galley where the electrical panel is.
For now, I mounted the display to a small block of wood attached to a double wide right-angle bracket. I then mounted a short straight bracket to the inside of the companionway step offset with double washers, creating a slot that the angled bracket slides right in to. This puts the display just inside the companionway in the bottom left corner, and it doesn't interfere with the crib boards. Trick will be not hitting it with a foot when things get exciting.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 08:55:47

David, you should find a path if you look under the v-berth at the head bulkhead over by the waterline.

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
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Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 11:18:58

For a future project, if you improve your mounting, you may want to go with a RAM swing arm or something similar. I have more photos on my website:

Edited by - on

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 15:45:31

I've thought about the RAM arm, and I like the way you ran the wiring, but it costs more than my fish finder! I'm hoping this less expensive route will work. One of my C-22 buddies uses a RAM arm, with a platform to hold the fish finder, GPS, and handheld.

Edited by - on

GaryB
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Response Posted - 05/24/2008 : 21:49:07

I screwed the mounting bracket for my depth finder to the backside of my lower crib board. When I go out I just turn the crib board around backwards snap in the depth finder and I'm ready to go.

The cable is long enough that if I need to access the cabin area quickly I can just lift out the crib board and lay it on the seat or step up and over it into the cabin.

Edited by - GaryB on 05/24/2008 21:49:26

knightwind
Navigator

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Canada
114 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2008 : 15:05:10

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OLarryR
 For a future project, if you improve your mounting, you may want to go with a RAM swing arm or something similar. I have more photos on my website:

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 06/06/2008 : 17:38:55

West Marine recently had some inexpensive fishfinders (from about $89 and up) for sale but I checked their website and right now and they do not list anything less than a Garmin for $129 and a Humminbird 565 for $199. The Garmin has a transom mount but the Humminbird 565 write-up on the website indicates it has an inside hull transducer.

I have to go right now and so could not check out other websites for less expensive fishfinders but believe there will be some that will be closer to $100 rather than $200, then it is just a question as to what transducer comes standard with it. You sometimes can get a different transducer supplied by the mfr direct but then you probably would not get a discount price on the fishfinder ordering it from the mfr and the change in transducers from what they normally furnish may raise the cost a tad.

I would start by checking out www.defender.com since they sometimes have good prices on many items.

Edited by - on

GaryB
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Response Posted - 06/06/2008 : 21:03:40

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by knightwind
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OLarryR
 For a future project, if you improve your mounting, you may want to go with a RAM swing arm or something similar. I have more photos on my website:

Edited by - on

GaryB
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Response Posted - 06/06/2008 : 21:05:29

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by knightwind
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OLarryR
 For a future project, if you improve your mounting, you may want to go with a RAM swing arm or something similar. I have more photos on my website:

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I'm still having trouble locating a cheap depth/fish finder with the inside transducer. Can you please recommend model(s)?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I bought a Humminbird Piranha something for $89.00 a couple of months ago at Bass Pro Shop and they had them for the same price at West Marine. Mounted the transducer in toilet bowl wax inside the boat. I took a reading outside the boat before mounting inside and I got the same reading on the inside.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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GaryB
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USA
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Response Posted - 06/06/2008 : 21:08:45

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williamtbecker
Deckhand

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USA
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Response Posted - 06/06/2008 : 23:26:55

Here is the link to the Humminbird PiranhaMax 215 on West Marine's website. $89.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/producte/10001/-1/10001/270780/377%20710%201428/712/humminbird/Primary%20Search/mode%20matchallpartial/0/WMPrice|0?N=377%20710%201428&Ne=712&Ntt=humminbird&Ntk=Primary%20Search&Ntx=mode%20matchallpartial&Nao=0&Ns=WMPrice|0&keyword=humminbird&isLTokenURL=true&storeNum=3&subdeptNum=140&classNum=10879

You can mount the transducer it comes with in-hull with epoxy and lose the temperature transducer part (if you care), or you can get a different transducer from Humminbird and trade in yours for just a couple bucks that splits off and has a separate temperature transducer.

(I asked the same questions to Humminbird people earlier this year about this same transducer) :-)

-Will

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
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Response Posted - 06/07/2008 : 09:06:23

Excellent info from Gary & Will. I knew that West Marine sold the inexpensive fishfinders but I was in a rush yesterday and when I looked up the WM Website it only showed me the more expensive ones. So...glad youse guys posted the info. You certainly can't beat $89 !
Well...maybe it can be gotten for even less but that's sounds pretty good for what it does and w/in-hull transducer !

The WM website also has for each item a link to pull down the actual WM Catalog page. Below is the cut & paste from the catalog which provides addl details of the Humminbird Models. Show are the $89, $139 and $149 models. The $139 model has a slightly higher resolution. The $149 has a slightly higher resolution compared to the other models and has a slightly larger screen size. So...3 models to choose from and believe all have the details that indicate in print that the transducer is okay for in-hull mounting.

Edited by - on

knightwind
Navigator

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Canada
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Response Posted - 06/07/2008 : 10:21:01

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by williamtbecker
 Here is the link to the Humminbird PiranhaMax 215 on West Marine's website. $89.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/producte/10001/-1/10001/270780/377%20710%201428/712/humminbird/Primary%20Search/mode%20matchallpartial/0/WMPrice|0?N=377%20710%201428&Ne=712&Ntt=humminbird&Ntk=Primary%20Search&Ntx=mode%20matchallpartial&Nao=0&Ns=WMPrice|0&keyword=humminbird&isLTokenURL=true&storeNum=3&subdeptNum=140&classNum=10879

You can mount the transducer it comes with in-hull with epoxy and lose the temperature transducer part (if you care), or you can get a different transducer from Humminbird and trade in yours for just a couple bucks that splits off and has a separate temperature transducer.

(I asked the same questions to Humminbird people earlier this year about this same transducer) :-)

-Will
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Almost all of the online lit for this says it comes with a transom-mount transducer. Did yours come with a puck-style? I need a puck-style right? You can't mount a transom-ducer on your hull can you?

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 06/07/2008 : 12:47:42

The Humminbird instructions indeed indicate to use epoxy but the experience has been from many here including myself that a less permanent method works as well and allows easy removal of the transducer if there ever becomes a need to do so:

Use a glob of a toilet bowl wax ring and smoosh the transducer into it. Overlap some of the excess up the perimeter edges of the transducer and then you are done. No signal ? Then just move the transducer and try again.

Edited by - OLarryR on 06/07/2008 12:48:19

piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 06/08/2008 : 09:47:12

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by knightwind

Almost all of the online lit for this says it comes with a transom-mount transducer. Did yours come with a puck-style? I need a puck-style right? You can't mount a transom-ducer on your hull can you?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Peter, I called Humminbird and they will exchange transom for in hull transducer at no charge as long as you dont open it. I also wondered about transom for our boats as the transducer would not operate if it was out of the water(while heeling).One difference I see is you wont get temp with in hull mount vs transom. I would like others to comment about this.
Steve A

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