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I forgot to attach the jib halyard!

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Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/22/2008 : 22:35:24

Last weekend was going so well. Took my time and effortlessly raised the mast, hooked on the boom and rigged Vida Nova for the season. Now with the boat in its slip and me in my office it dawned on me that I only pinned the furler at the top and at the bottom. In other words I am not holding the jib with the jib halyard, nor did I attach the bottom of the jib to the roller furler (well not the jib but the plastic part that slides up and down).

Now taking care of the bottom part is easy, but what about the top! Last year I believe I attached the jib halyard to to the top part and tightened it. Did I just line myself up for a trip to the top of the mast or is there some other trick to it? Can anyone supply pictures to how I should attach the top part?

To better illustrate my point the Red lines show what I forgot:

Steve Blackburn, Calgary, AB
C250WB - 1999 - Hull 396

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/23/2008 00:08:57

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 23:00:57

I'm a little confused. Are you saying that you had the sail on the furler before you raised the mast? I guess you must have otherwise you would have the halyard attached.

2 options as I see it. Go up the mast in a bosun's chair or, bring down the mast. No, you can't sail with the mast detached from the halyard. The luff tape would likely hold it up in light winds but shape would be a problem. In heavier weather, I can't imagine the result.

Good luck.

Edited by - on

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2008 : 23:05:20

John, yes my foresail (jib) was on the furler when I raised the mast. So the jib top is not attached to the jib halyard, in fact nothing really holds the jib up there. The forestay is secured correctly with the top and bottom pins. Yeah I guess I'll visit my mast top next Wednesday, I'm not taking it down on the water.

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/22/2008 23:07:26

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 05:38:47

Steve, last year we launched JD and motored over to the other side of the bay, that evening I realized the furler halyard messenger was not attached to the halyard so the end that attaches to the head of the sail was at the top of the furler extrusion! (fortunately I had a figure of 8 in the end of the line so that it did not disappear down inside the furler extrusion.)

My solution was to use the spare Jib Halyard to retrieve the furler line. I joined the ends of the jib halyard with a reef knot, then secured a piece of wire coat hanger to the jib halyard by just twisting the wire around the line. Bent the top end of the wire into a V hook. Then I raised the halyard and wire multiple times till I snagged the furler line. Bingo! Took about 15 mins of playing around and a small crowd of kids on the doc kept asking 'Whatcha doing Mr!'

We now secure the messenger to the furler halyard before raising the mast!

Paul

Edited by - on

zebra50
Captain

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USA
408 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 11:33:29

I am also confused. If you are using the furler, then the jib halyard is not used, it is raised and held up by the internal line in the furler, and secured at the bottom with another line run through the sail and the top of the drum. The sail can be raised and lowered after the furler and the mast are raised up.

Edited by - on

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 12:52:01

Right but the jib will slide up and down the slot right? Then what is holding up the jib at the top of the furler?

"secured at the bottom with another line run through the sail and the top of the drum" - Yes this one is easy and I will do that. But what about my jib top, I would've thought I need to attach the jib halyard to it?

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/23/2008 12:53:37

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 12:58:41

The "real" (out of the mast) jib halyard is not used.

You need to lower the mast or climb up there and attach the CDI furler halyard to the sail tack. The CDI furler has its OWN built-in halyard.

When you lower the jib at the end of the season attach a sturdy messenger line to the other end of the furler halyard (that other non-red line in your drawing that is at the fore end of the furler drum) so that it can be pulled down next spring which pulls up the jib.

My advice is in the future to mount the jib AFTER you raise the mast and furler system. Ditto take the jib down BEFORE you lower the mast for the season. That will prevent this from happening again. But, you must attach that messenger line to the furler halyard when you remove the jib for the season.

Personally, I would lower the mast before climbing up the mast. If you do go up the mast make sure that the drum-end of that furler halyard is untied so that you have slack to tie onto the gib tack. When you do that attach the messanger line just to be safe.

Here is the CDI furler manual. It describes all of this.

[url="http://www.sailcdi.com/sailpdf/FF2%20manual%207_06.pdf"]CDI Furler[/url]

Edited by - Nautiduck on 05/23/2008 13:07:27

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 13:11:39

OK now I understand!

I was unaware of the existence of the internal jib halyard (J). All along I thought you guys were talking about the standard jib halyard and I was also confused! Sorry about all of this confusion, now I see the light! I will follow Pauls explaination on how to fish out the internal jib halyard from the furler. However if I cannot see it I might reserve this for a winter project since for the moment I think just attaching the standard jib halyard to the top of the jib might do.

Finally found the picture. Here is how I attached the top of my furler with the jib halyard. I guess I never attached the top of the jib!

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/23/2008 13:18:08

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 13:26:15

If the furler halyard has disappeared into the furler extraction then you will need to lower the mast and get it all sorted out. You cannot use the "real" halyard as it will wrap around the extrusion when you furl and unfurl.

Your photo shows that your installation is not correct. The "top" thing that you have the "real" halyard attached to should be at the very top of the extrusion. It should not need anything to keep it up there. It sits on top of the extrusion all by itself (look at the diagram from the manual) and the extrusion is held up by the drum.

I'm afraid you need to lower the mast and get this fixed up right.

Of course I assume this is a CDI furler. Is it??

Now I think you may have a Schaeffer furler - in which case your initial diagram is not appropriate. I have had a Schaeffer and it looks like what you have. On a Schaeffer ther is no special halyard and it DOES use the real halyard just like you have it. That item on the mast that your halyard goes through is a "hayard restrainer" which prevents halyard wrap. On a Schaeffer the tack of the jib is attached to the "top" item.

If you have a Schaeffer, and the tack is attached then you may be good-to-go!! If it is not attached then I think you can pull down the jib and release the real halyard which will allow the "top" thing to come down the extraction so you can attachh the tack to it. The just hoist it uo.

I'm getting a headache.

Edited by - Nautiduck on 05/23/2008 13:42:24

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 13:40:00

Now I'm thinking I'm going to to this in 2 steps.

1: Just attach the jib head to the jib Halyard, and the jib tack to the roller drum. This so I can get going on racing next Wednesday.
2: This summer temporarily attach a line from the mast top to the pullpit, then disconnect (unpin) the whole furler. Fix the furler as it should be then reconnect everything. No need to bring the mast down this way. Alternatively I could bring over my trailer and do bring the mast down.

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 13:43:33

Read my updated last post. Verify your furler brand.

[url="http://www.furling.com/snapfurl.html"]Schaeffer SnapFurl[/url]

Edited by - Nautiduck on 05/23/2008 13:48:08

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 13:44:43

Disregard my post of 13:40. I just read Randy's newest post and it does seem I need to lower my mast to get this fixed right (will do that on the trailer). I'm going to post a picture of my drum to try to identify it as a Schafer or CDI.

Edited by - on

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 13:50:44

Thanks for all of your patience. The picture above where you see the mast top is from not from my boat. Below are the picture from my boat, can you pleae help me identify which type of furler this is?

Edited by - on

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 13:59:46

Randy after looking at the Schaefer SnapFurl PDF you linked too I'm also 99% positive I have a Schaefer from the fact that my extrusion is indeed round and the my drum looks exactly like the Schafer not the CDI. I believe my jib was attached to the top part of the furler with a shackle then the furler attached to the real jib halyard as in this picture.

This is good news since going up to the mast will fix my problem. Again sorry for all the confusion and misrepresentations. I really appreciate your efforts in helping me figure this out.

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/23/2008 14:01:40

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
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Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 14:01:42

Looks like a Schaeffer Snapfurl. They have round extrusions. Check out the link I posted. You may be OK. If all you have to do is connect the gib tack to the "Top" gizmo then you just pull down the gib and release the halyard and the "top" will slide down the extrusion. Then attach the gib tack to the "top" and hoist. No need to climb the mast.

Snapfurls are excellent and are liked by racers because you can use the halyard to control the luff.

Edited by - Nautiduck on 05/23/2008 14:04:25

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 14:03:35

In case you missed my thank you note at the bottom of the picture (13:59), then here it is again: Thanks Randy!

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/23/2008 14:03:52

Nautiduck
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Response Posted - 05/23/2008 : 14:05:32

See my update. I do not think you need to climb the mast. Glad to help!

Edited by - on

Turk
Admiral

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USA
736 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 18:58:01

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Steve Blackburn
 . I believe my jib was attached to the top part of the furler with a shackle then the furler attached to the real jib halyard as in this picture.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Make sure you look at the PDF for the schaffer's manual to see how the pennant works. You seem to not have one in your picture. It stops the whole thing from turning at the top.

Edited by - on

frog0911
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1349 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 : 18:51:11

If in fact the picture you posted on 5/23 at 1350 is actually how your boat is now, you will have to drop the mast and reposition the forestay in the hole marked #2. Then take a good look at the furler manual for two items needed at the top of the furler for it to work properly and not get halyard wrap. The two components are: the head swivel and the halyard restraining bracket. In my manual how they are installed and function are on page five.
Here is a shot of the setup:

Staring at the top is the masthead forward pin with my drifter block and blue line drifter halyard.
Next is the forestay attached to the second pin with the furler installed.
Under that is the white jib halyard running through the restraining bracket then down to the head swivel.

Mast raised jib halyard through restraining bracket.

Jib raised showing head swivel with halyard attached at the top and jib head attached at the bottom of the swivel.

Edited by - frog0911 on 05/27/2008 19:22:36

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 : 19:33:56

Thanks Frog. That's exactly how I intended on rigging this. Yes I have my forestay to hole #2 (that was an old picture I used). I also have the head swivel and the restraining bracket. My jib halyard must be hanging below the restraining bracket. All I need to do is winch myself up the mast (someone will winch me up tomorrow afternoon) and connect the jib halyard to the swivel head. And yes I will read my furler manual this time.

Edited by - on

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