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 Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums
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 Hot Water for Small Sailboats?
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MartinJW
Navigator

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USA
241 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/24/2008 :  14:45:57  Show Profile
Has anyone tried one of the Coleman hot-water-on-demand units in a C-250? Has anyone tried one of these in any application?

It's about $200 at REI:
http://www.rei.com/product/723274

I'm thinking that this might be a very nice thing to have onboard. There's a soft-sided storage bag available, so it could be conveniently stowed when daysailing and easily brought out on the countertop near the sink when overnighting.

Thoughts, suggestions, comments?

Thanks,
Martin


C25/250 Int'l Ass'n Member
2008 C-250 WK #973
"Bluebell"
Lake Tahoe, CA/NV

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Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/24/2008 :  14:58:21  Show Profile  Visit Steve Blackburn's Homepage
At 30000 BTU and propane fed, I would be concerned of using this unit inside the cabin due to carbon monoxide (CO) poisoning. This thing must output lots of CO. I guess you could run it outside and have a hose run from the unit to the countertop.

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/24/2008 14:58:44
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MartinJW
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241 Posts

Response Posted - 05/24/2008 :  15:17:41  Show Profile
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Steve Blackburn</i>
<br />At 30000 BTU and propane fed, I would be concerned of using this unit inside the cabin due to carbon monoxide (CO) poisoning. This thing must output lots of CO. I guess you could run it outside and have a hose run from the unit to the countertop.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Point well taken, Steve.

I was thinking that I would only use this in a well-ventilated cabin to make lukewarm water. I'm not very concerned about CO levels, since it essentially only runs on-demand (as near as I can tell). If I only want warm water to rinse my hands or maybe even fill the sink, the heater would run for maybe 30 seconds or a minute or two at most.

By the way, I'm a chemistry professor, so I have to chime in with the following:

CO isn't a problem unless you have combustion happening long enough to start to decrease the local O2 level; "normal" propane combustion only produces CO2 and water. (Well, CO2 and H2O are the <i>major</i> products.) However, if the combustion reaction happens for too long in a confined space, the local O2 level begins to decrease, you get less complete combustion, and more CO.

However, theory doesn't always match reality very well. If you read about a couple found dead of CO poisioning in their C-250 on Lake Tahoe, that would probably be us.

Thanks for pointing this out.

Martin

Edited by - MartinJW on 05/24/2008 16:25:42
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stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 05/24/2008 :  21:14:55  Show Profile
I've been using a Solar Shower with good results or for quicker results... a pot on the galley stove. Sometimes we add some hot water to the solar shower when it hasn't heated up enough.
I looked at those Coleman hot water things and as much as it might have some good applications somewhere - I just could not figure how it would be worth the expense and the considerable amount of room it would take VS the solar shower.
A couple of times I've hung the solar shower off the boom and then opened the hatch, presto - hot water gravity fed above the sink.

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stampeder
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Response Posted - 05/24/2008 :  21:19:35  Show Profile


$18 solar shower VS $185 Coleman fossil burner

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Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/24/2008 :  22:21:11  Show Profile
I saw somewhere, maybe on this forum, where a person put in a 12V electric water pump to run a shower in a small boat. He added a T with a valve in the water supply under the sink and from that T valve ran a hose that could be put into a pot of hot water on the stove top. By adjusting the valve he mixed the hot and cold water to get just the right temperature. I always thought that was creative.

As for us, we either use the solar shower or, more likely, we stay at a marina with showers (and a pool and jacuzzi)!! Our home club has showers too which is nice.

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piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 05/24/2008 :  22:28:47  Show Profile  Visit piseas's Homepage
I vote for solar shower. I have used them and they work great. Cheaper, safer and more convienent.
Steve A

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Steve Blackburn
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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 :  01:11:11  Show Profile  Visit Steve Blackburn's Homepage
Martin,

I stumbled upon this [url="http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/42864-hot-watter-via-coleman-propane-camping-heater.html"]link [/url] about the water heater you meantion for use in small sailboats. Look mostly at the last posts on page 2. People seem pleased with it.

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/25/2008 01:11:50
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stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 :  10:26:53  Show Profile
Note that the responders mentioned that you have to use it outside and that it takes up a lot of room.

The great things about the solar shower, is you can roll it up and stuff it anywhere when not in use, and if you want to use it without leaving it in the sun or you want a longer shower, you simply heat water on your stove and pour it in.

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Steve Blackburn
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Canada
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Response Posted - 05/25/2008 :  15:23:36  Show Profile  Visit Steve Blackburn's Homepage
Mike, how do you shower with the solar shower? Outside in your bathing suits? What's the technique?

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Nautiduck
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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 :  16:28:51  Show Profile
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> Mike, how do you shower with the solar shower? Outside in your bathing suits? What's the technique?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Steve, by all means keep your bathing suit on. Now, as for the Admiral.....


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Tom Potter
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1913 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 :  17:10:24  Show Profile
We got one of these (minus the hot babe)for "day time" showers.
We hang it from the pigtail on the back stay.


Edited by - Tom Potter on 05/25/2008 17:42:10
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stampeder
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Response Posted - 05/25/2008 :  18:40:19  Show Profile
My hot babe and I hoist our solar shower with the jib halyard and shower in our swim suits on the bow.
That hose that hangs down from the bottom is like a very small shower head - you pull on it and the water comes out with a pretty good stream....its a good feature in that you can reach your body parts and its a good feature if you hang it above your sink because it becomes like a sink sprayer.

Edited by - stampeder on 05/25/2008 18:47:34
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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 :  20:08:03  Show Profile  Visit delliottg's Homepage
I vote for the solar shower as well. I've read about people using garden sprayers, and we have one that I bought just for that use, but it doesn't seem to heat up very well. Maybe I need to paint it black or something.

I've used solar showers for years, and a couple of years back, the pull on/push off spray head cracked so I thought I'd have to buy a whole new shower unit, but REI carries replacement shower heads, so I was back in business. I've used the same one for probably 15 years or more. It's amazingly durable.

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MartinJW
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USA
241 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 :  23:17:33  Show Profile
As always, I appreciate the comments, opinions, and suggestions from everyone here.

I was looking for some method to have convenient hot water in the cabin at the sink, and the Coleman water heater might work for this application. (<i>However, my wife has reminded me that our HOUSE has some minor hot water problem that I should attend to BEFORE I attempt to add this to the boat. Sometimes I don't understand her priorities, but I'll honor her wishes for the time being.</i>)

In terms of shower-like applications, I'm definitely going with the simple solar water heater hung outside during the day.

Thanks,
Martin

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redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 :  07:01:25  Show Profile
Aaaahhh, this one is easy... One of the "tricks" we took to Lysistrata from our c25 was our Zodi stovetop water heater.

http://www.zodi.com/web-content/Consumer/zodihotstovetopshower.html

Most days the sun takes too long or whatever. So we connected the stovetop heater to our pressure water (easy mod) and the heated effluent goes into a normal solar shower bag. It does come with a pump if you don't have pressure water.

We still use our zodi for hot water on SV Lysistrata and other cruisers marvel at the practicality of it all... Hot water on demand. Even "big" boats with hot water tanks burn a lot of water pushing hot water from the engine area to the head which is typically forward. In my experience, it takes several hours of motoring to make hot water with engine heated hot water on "big" boats. I've had to mess with the head a couple of times and I simply love the fact that I can heat water up hotter than hell and litterally sanitize the head. I also love the ability to scrub the cockpit with a lot of really warm soapy water after that red wine incident last night! Coffee and red wine should be banned from boats.

For privacy needs, the aforementioned inflatable enclosure does work, but for those of you salty enough, consider making wind dodgers for the cockpit. Basically a piece of canvas attached to the lifelines and the deck such that you have a protected cockpit.

Sten

DPO C25 #3220 "Zephyr", SR, FK
SV Lysistrata - C&C 39 - Deltaville VA - anyone want me to check on their boat while I am here?


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Happy D
Admiral

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921 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 :  11:59:44  Show Profile
I was going to try one of [url="http://cgi.ebay.com/Zodi-Hot-Camp-Shower-One-Burner_W0QQitemZ250252081351QQihZ015QQcategoryZ52484QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]these[/url] in the cockpit. Seeing Lake Michigan is fresh water I was just going to use a bilge pump over the side and run it off the house batteries.

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DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 :  10:12:21  Show Profile  Visit DaveR's Homepage
A lot of great contraptions, but IMHO way to many parts and more junk to over busy the boat. With our boats I'm sticking to the solar shower or the next marina!

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piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 :  12:39:50  Show Profile  Visit piseas's Homepage
Dave, I second that. If you want all the extras, I just say, "get a bigger boat."
Steve A

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piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2008 :  18:15:51  Show Profile  Visit piseas's Homepage
Just an update. I went to my local Walmart and found a 5 gallon solar shower for $6.95! Defender, which has great prices, has same basic item for $25.
In the same department they had Type IV throwable flotation cushions(in red, white and blue)and Type II life vests, both under $7.
Steve A

Edited by - piseas on 06/06/2008 18:16:52
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Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 06/07/2008 :  09:31:09  Show Profile
We used to shower in bathing suits in the cockpit with the solar shower slung up on the boom. What we find is that we have to modify our "bathing habits" from first thing in the morning to afternoon before sundowners because with either a sun shower or engine driven heat, there isn't hot water in the morning unless you cook it or make it by some other means. Just takes a day to get used to the different routine. Just another excuse to spend longer time on the boat: "Honey, I need to stay the extra day(s) to get used to the new shower timing!!!"

Edited by - Stu Jackson C34 on 06/07/2008 09:33:49
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