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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

Pig Tail

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Stardog
Captain

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USA
319 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2008 : 18:10:40

The pigtail does reduce swinging of the boom. If you've ever had your main down and supported by topping lift in the midst of heavy chop, you know what I mean. Even if you snug the sheet down the boom will swing a couple of feet to port and starboard. The pigtail is just to eliminates the problem and make it safe for those on deck.

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2008 : 18:48:40

with my topping lift supporting the boom, and with the main sheet tight, my boom does not move.

Edited by - on

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2008 : 21:10:40

Mike, without the pigtail on my C250 even with the main sheet real tight it still swings.

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Dave Bristle
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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2008 : 21:44:18

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by stampeder
 with my topping lift supporting the boom, and with the main sheet tight, my boom does not move.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Neeeyahhh... In chop big enough to roll the boat 15 degrees to each side, it will. In my slip, it was fine. If I were on a mooring with rock-n-roll, I'd run a line cleat-to-boom-to-cleat to steady the boom, rather than letting the mainsheet tackle or backstay take the constant shocks.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 07/21/2008 21:45:32

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 07:48:01

With a topping lift and a taut mainsheet, I have no real movement either with my boom. Think about it, on a C25, if you have a taut line running from the masthead to the stern, how much movement can there be 4 feet from the end?

Edited by - on

jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 07:52:45

Dave - good point about easing the strain on the backstay - thanks!

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Champipple
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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 08:03:44

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

If you have a topping lift installed, why the need to use the pigtail at all?
[/quote]

If you are single handing it can come in handy for a quick fix until you can get to the topping lift. (depending where the topping lift is cleated) For example we actually used the main halyard for a season. The pigtail held it until we had a chance to move the halyard from the sail to the booom.

We used to take the boom vang off the mast and move it to the rail and raise the topping lift so the boom was out of reach when entertaining at the dock. (I can't remember if we took the mainsheet off for that? This also works good for keeping your line out of the prop if trolling.

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Dave Bristle
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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 08:20:44

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 With a topping lift and a taut mainsheet, I have no real movement either with my boom. Think about it, on a C25, if you have a taut line running from the masthead to the stern, how much movement can there be 4 feet from the end?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Add a 25 lb. (?) penduluma (the boom) 4' from the end, and it moves enough to be a hazzard when the boat is rocking severely, which it can be on a mooring or at anchor. Sarge out--you get the last word.

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stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 10:25:43

I've never had a problem with the pigtail, other than forgetting to unhook from it, which has not proven to be that big of an error, just something that requires a quick four-letter word and leaping heroicly to action.
With my current topping lift; a line from the mast head to the aft end of the boom, then forward to the mast where it is cleated - my boom does not swing when the main sheet is hardened.
I am suprised a topic as simple as this has garnered so much attention. I can only think that someone is doing something wrong if their boom is swinging more than a couple inches.
I'm on a mooring ball on a very windy lake where the stupidest, most ignorant powerboaters you can conjure, leave wakes and waves that test my mooring ball, my topping lift/boom management system, knot tying ability and etc.
I can see how, on a C250 with that bendy mast, how boom swing could be a problem with a hardened main sheet. If I had a C250, I would probably have the boom tied off to a cat bird seat or a stern rail.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 11:23:12

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Champipple
 If you are single handing it can come in handy for a quick fix until you can get to the topping lift. (depending where the topping lift is cleated) <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Exactly. The location for cleating, and adjusting, the topping lift is important. Having to adjust a topping lift that is cleated on the end of the boom doesn't work well for me. Mine is ran to a cabintop cleat. I do this for a couple of reasons.

First is safety. Just last week I was dropping my main in 30+ mph winds. As I turned into the wind, the main sail and boom started flailing madly. If I needed to engage the topping lift at the end of the boom or worse, attach a pigtail, I would've needed a football helmut for protection. Not good. With my topping lift led aft, I simply tensioned it, while safely seated, away from the dancing boom.

Another reason I run my topping lift aft is, when the bimini is up, access to the boom is somewhat impeded. Also, when stowing or deploying the bimimi, the boom has to either be lifted out of the way or swung over the side (I do the latter). Try doing that with a pigtail.

Lastly, when raising the main one doesn't have to think about or even remember the topping lift. Some even set their lifts to slacken when the main goes up so they don't have to do anything with it.

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 11:54:00

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Some even set their lifts to slacken when the main goes up so they don't have to do anything with it.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
That's what I do.
I raise my main, as far as it will go with the topping lift engaged, then when the main is as far up the mast as it will go with topping lift engaged, I loosen the topping lift and hoist the main that final foot or inches, depending on how tight I want the luff. I hoist the main primarily from the cockpit - but the final adjustments I make from the mast, hence my topping lift attachment point is at the mast. When I douse my main, I do so from the cockpit - so I have my topping lift cleated off - the boom will drop at most 6" but it is still at least 5' above the cockpit floor.
I find this to be very safe and allows for adjustments to be made without the boom dropping.

Edited by - on

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 12:44:50

I think another factor when comparing the C25 to the C250 is that the C25 main sheet attaches at the end of the boom while the C250 attaches about 1/3 down? That would definitely cause more swing on the C250.

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 07/22/2008 12:45:27

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2008 : 16:18:05

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">That would definitely cause more swing on the C250.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I would agree. With the C25, the mainsheet pulls the boom down and aft. (daft?)

Edited by - on

Deric
Captain

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USA
408 Posts

Response Posted - 07/23/2008 : 16:26:20

I have both pigtail and topping lift. I use both. The pigtail does take some swing out of the boom.

I have not forgotten to release the boom from the pigtail before the main sail is hoisted, but now that there is a message board regarding this topic, I am a shoe-in to forget the next time I head out.

Thanks,
Deric ;-)

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3462 Posts

Response Posted - 07/23/2008 : 17:58:13

90% of the time I am singlehanded sailing. I use both the pigtail and the topping lift and quite frankly do not fully understand all the concern expressed about the pigtail. A pigtail should not be used with a mainsail raised - That is asking for trouble.
Maybe it is in the misuse of it, that it is getting a bad rap. If one is happy with just using the topping lift, that seems fine as well.

In my case, I have the tall rig and in this configuration the boom is lower on the mast. I find that when I am in the slip, the use of the pigtail is fine keeping the boom at a higher height than what I normally have the topping lift set. Attaching it to the pigtail is quick and easy. It also helps keep the boom stationary. I leave my boat docked using the pigtail. When I get ready to go sailing, I take the boom off the pigtail while I am still in my slip. The boom is then held by the topping lift. My mainsail is still captured by web straps and I only take them off after I leave the marina. When I come back from sailing and I am right outside my marina, I have by this time already furled up my headsail and then just outside the marina, I lower my mainsail while it is still held by the topping lift. After the main is tied up with straps, I then will generally attach the boom back onto the pigtail to get the boom out of the way above my head. There is no concern with high winds at this point since the mainsail is captured and I am just within a minute or so of entering the marina.

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