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Old Disco Queen
1st Mate

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USA
66 Posts

Initially Posted - 10/19/2008 : 18:56:01

So...I want to run the halyards and downhauls, ect back to the cockpit. I saw the price at CD...whew!

Old Disco...she is currently rigged with the wires, which I will be replacing with "all Line".

Questions:

1. She currently has the jib sheets coming back to the winches, then to a Mooring cleat on each side. I am used to a cam cleat here on my old 14' Cat Capris. Anyone put a cam cleat here, or do you all use the mooring cleats (seems like a bad idea to have to undo a mooring cleat wrap to release sails in an emergency, or adjust sails....)

2. Has anyone used the CD Kit? I also want to add a Jib downhaul and put my Jiffy reef with the lines.

3. Is it necessary to buy that special "Mast Step Haylard Plate"?

4. What is the purpose (and how do you use) a rope Clutch?

5. I want to lay out the lines so that I can still walk up to the bow

, anyone have pics about what you did?

Thanks
Stephen

Stephen J. Moore

Edited by - on

triley
Captain

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USA
251 Posts

Response Posted - 10/19/2008 : 20:47:31

You need a mast plate, blocks and enough rope clutches on each side to organize your lines. I have 3 to port and 3 to starboard. main spinnaker and vang to starboard; genoa,outhaul and cunningham to port.

When you finish you will love it.

Forget about mooring cleats, get self tailing winches!

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 10/19/2008 : 21:16:14

There are two albums of Catalinas here
http://gallery.mac.com/fhopper#gallery
Look hard at the hardware layouts in the various shots. You will see different implementations of the same criteria; good equipment, well placed. Different people value different things. My '82 has everything led back, the '89 has less led back for a cleaner deck. I loved the stacked doubles Harken turning blocks on the '82 but the much cheaper Catalina Direct double turning blocks are just fine, especially with the ball bearing upgrade sheave. Spend your money on the clutches. I really like Spinlocks, the local knowledge there is to know the right size. Modern 1/4" line does everything on a C 25 now, you vary the composition of the line for the different jobs; reefing lines on a boom do not need to be hi-tech core halyard. One Spinlock has 1/4" as the low line size for the clutch, do not buy that one. By the next size down, it has 1/4" in the middle of it's range.

[url="http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|118|3800|312072&id=136945"]Defender.com[/url]

PS, IMHO selftailing winches are horrible and a waste of money, especially if you like to trim your sails. But that topic is well discussed in several searchable threads that provide plenty of reasons for them too.

Edited by - pastmember on 10/19/2008 21:21:54

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 10/19/2008 : 22:33:52

I bought the whole shebang from CD--mast base plate, swivel blocks, organizers, clutches, and all-rope halyards. The only thing they didn't have then was the right size sheaves for the masthead, to handle the rope instead of the wire. As I understand it, CD now has that covered. The "kit" price I got from them was in line with what I would have paid for the components from somebody like Defender, but I was comforted by CD's selection of the overall combination, so it looked like a no-brainer to me.

Yes, you want a mast base plate. The alternative is thru-bolting stand-up blocks to the cabintop, which is a much less desirable approach.

Rope clutches are very useful for lines (like halyards) that need to be tensioned at high loads. The clutch can operate as a one-way "grabber" that allows you to tension the line without releasing the hold on it. But then you can totally release the halyard to drop a sail--the tension will not prevent it's release (as a cam cleat can). Clutches are not needed for lines like downhauls, but are very nice for halyards, reefing lines, vangs, etc. that carry loads.

I'm pretty sure you can find pictures of the cabintop arrangements using deck organizers and clutches in the Tech Tips. As for "walking to the bow", that normally is done on the side-decks--in heavy weather, with your butt on the cabintop. The lines from the mast go around the front and sides of the pop-top (if you have one) and don't get in the way of anything.

Happy hunting...

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 10/19/2008 22:35:54

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 10/19/2008 : 22:47:51

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Old Disco Queen
 1. She currently has the jib sheets coming back to the winches, then to a Mooring cleat on each side. I am used to a cam cleat here on my old 14' Cat Capris. Anyone put a cam cleat here, or do you all use the mooring cleats (seems like a bad idea to have to undo a mooring cleat wrap to release sails in an emergency, or adjust sails....)<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I added cam cleats, positioned so that the sheet could be slipped under one horn of the horn cleat to hold it level to the deck, and then snapped into the cam. (I also fed the bitter end back through the cleat base and put a figure-eight stopper knot on it.) Others have use "risers" to lift the cam cleat to a level and angle to take the line straight off the winch. Still others have found that one simple wrap around the base of the horn cleat holds and can be release easily--I never tried it. Here was my setup (now owned by "Voyager" Bruce):

Edited by - on

Justin
Admiral

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502 Posts

Response Posted - 10/20/2008 : 08:30:53

I used Dave's idea on my boat and love it.

When cranking in the sail you can pull the bitter end lead through the cleat. When letting it out you just have to make sure you take it out from the cleat and feed the line to the winch properly. Not a big deal, but it's something I always have to show to new people when sailing aboard.

Edited by - on

jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2008 : 15:15:28

Justin - what's the winch aft of the cleat for?

Edited by - on

andy
Navigator

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USA
228 Posts

Response Posted - 11/07/2008 : 00:22:47

here's how 45 North is rigged.

harken windward sheeting traveler car
garhauer adjustable genoa cars (not really worth the money)
winches are Lewmar 16 self tailers.

Last year we added a Rudder Craft HDPE rudder from IdaSailor marine.
it's awsome.

Edited by - andy on 11/07/2008 00:27:07

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 11/07/2008 : 08:38:36

Wow, quite the setup Andy, you don't have to leave the cockpit for anything! Do you have trouble lining up the pop top when you put it down?
although I use a wrap around my horn cleat or just wedge the line on the "jam" side in light winds, this can break free at inopportune moments and I like the cam cleat idea.

Edited by - on

Peregrine
Admiral

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830 Posts

Response Posted - 11/07/2008 : 10:03:13

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Old Disco Queen
 So...I want to run the halyards and downhauls, ect back to the cockpit. I saw the price at CD...whew!

Old Disco...she is currently rigged with the wires, which I will be replacing with "all Line".

Questions:

1. She currently has the jib sheets coming back to the winches, then to a Mooring cleat on each side. I am used to a cam cleat here on my old 14' Cat Capris. Anyone put a cam cleat here, or do you all use the mooring cleats (seems like a bad idea to have to undo a mooring cleat wrap to release sails in an emergency, or adjust sails....)

2. Has anyone used the CD Kit? I also want to add a Jib downhaul and put my Jiffy reef with the lines.

3. Is it necessary to buy that special "Mast Step Haylard Plate"?

Yes from the example above and in this post, it is where you can attach blocks to turn the lines toward the "Deck Organizer". See photo below.

4. What is the purpose (and how do you use) a rope Clutch?

The rope clutches allow you to just pull on the line and it will "lock" the line where ever you want. Once the line is threaded through the clutch and the clutch is closed the line will stay where it is under pressure. To release the line you open the clutch.

5. I want to lay out the lines so that I can still walk up to the bow

, anyone have pics about what you did?

The way the illustration below is laid out the lines will be inside the cabintop hand rails leaving the deck beside the cabin free of lines.


Thanks
Stephen
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Stephen,
Running lines back to the cockpit can IMO be the best investment you can make.
Being able to raise yur sails and reef your main without leaving the cockpit will make sailing alone safer and easier.
The [url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/tech/tech.asp"]Tech Tips[/url] section of the web site as many good suggestions submitted by members.
Here is the[url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/tech/tech.asp"]Tech Tip[/url] I submitted for [url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/tech/tech25/tt008.asp"]Triple Rope Clutches[/url]
Underlined words are HOT links.

Here are a couple of photos from the Tip.

It's pretty clearly labled. Sorry it was pre-photo shop.[/

This was not done from a kit and was already on the boat, it was one reason I bought thiis particular boat.

I hope ths helps.
John G-
Peregrine #4762
'85 SR/FK

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 11/07/2008 : 14:34:23

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by andy

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Black bear cub??????

Edited by - on

andy
Navigator

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USA
228 Posts

Response Posted - 11/08/2008 : 18:38:07

That's Jolly Roger the sailing Schipperke.
They look just like bear cubs when they're babies.

No clearance problems with the pop top.

The boat is fully found... we like to keep tweaking it though. It sails like a dream.

Edited by - andy on 11/08/2008 18:38:28

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 11/08/2008 : 23:10:13

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by andy
 7The boat is fully found...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I'd say so!

Edited by - on

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