Association Forum - Attaching forestay with CDI roller furler

Assn Members Area · Join

Home.

Association Forum

Ships Store

Cruising

Racing

Technical Tips

Photo Gallery - New

Boat Search - Updated

Manuals & Brochures

Swap Meet

Links

Officer Flag Line & Staff

Bylaws & Constitution

Members Area

Join the Association

Notice:
The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.

Association Forum

Username:	Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

All Forums

Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 250 Specific Forum

Attaching forestay with CDI roller furler

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Author

Topic

bshin
Deckhand

Member Avatar

USA
16 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/10/2009 : 02:03:42

After trailering our newly acquired 1996 250 WB to our home in Bham, my wife and I wanted to practice raising and lowering the mast while the boat is on the trailer in our driveway. Everything went smoothly until we tried to attach the forestay. We got about within 1 1/2 inches of the pin holes lining up, but that was as far as it would go. I remember the previous owner had a very hard time removing it when we picked the boat up, so much so that he used a hammer and channel locks to get it off (I should have questioned it at that time, but we had a lot going on trying to get ready to pull the boat home). I had the gin pole even beyond 90% to the mast, but it just would not pull down anymore.

I've read in two other posts about loosening the shrouds and even raising the roller furler drum to lengthen the forestay via the turnbuckle. My question is, should I do one before the other, or try a combination of the two. I'm guessing that loosening the shrouds would be easier to do first, but I don't know if that will be enough to make up the distance I have to go to get the forestay attached.

Any input will be greatly appreciated.

Bshin
Athena
250 WB #227

Edited by - on

bear
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
909 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 03:22:45

bshin, I would first ask if the turnbuckles on the mast shrouds rotated freely when raising the mast? Are any of the attach rods now bent? That is the threaded portion that comes out of the lower turn buckle that attaches to the deck attach fitting. If they get hung up and did not rotate to a near vertical position you will not be able to attach that pin.....

Edited by - on

Tom Potter
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1913 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 05:16:08

Along with what bear said, sometimes I would remove one of the pins on one of the legs of the split back stay and that would give me the little extra length I needed. Once I got the forestay pin in I would put the back stay pin back in and then tighen the forestay buckle.

edit,
I should have added, I loosen the forestay turnbuckle as loose as I can get it, even then sometimes depending on if I have help attaching the forestay pin, I might pull a pin on one of the back stay legs. I never loosen any turnbuckles except the forestay.

I marked the turnbuckle once it was set properly, so when I loosen to raise the mast I would know how far to tighen it back. I use to count the turns but its just as easy to mark it for a reference point. I used a sharpie to mark the brass where the threads should end when tight enough.

Make sure to keep an eye on the shrouds and t-bolts on the mast and deck as the mast goes up. If one is twisted the wrong way the forestay will be too short.

Edited by - Tom Potter on 08/10/2009 12:57:27

glen
Captain

Members Avatar

359 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 07:11:03

I have always loosened the forward turnbuckle on the forestay. This allows me to inspect it and add new wire to secure the turnbuckle. You want to be sure that you have either stainless wire or some other locking device on the turnbuckle after you have finished raising the mast. Unless you prevent the turnbuckle from unthreading itself YOU COULD LOSE THE RIG.

Edited by - on

bshin
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
16 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 07:21:02

The turnbuckles on the shrouds remained straight. We used Arlyn's method of putting a plastic tie between the two to keep them straight when raising the mast. I'm beginning to suspect that the mast shrouds were "tuned" (namely tightened) after the last time the boat was launched, which was two years ago when the previous owner put new bottom paint on. Otherwise, he kept the boat in the water at his yacht club.

Bshin
C250 WB #227
Athena

Edited by - on

bear
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
909 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 07:40:07

OK Bshin, On my C 250 Catalina put an extension on the fore stay attach which lengthened it about an inch or so. it was just a stainless steel bracket. If I were you I would check the rigging if possible where it is right now before loosening any turnbuckles. Be sure you have an owners manual and the boat must be level before checking the rigging. What others on this forum relate to you is what worked for them.....

Edited by - on

windsong
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
318 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 07:55:59

Why not start with the turnbuckle in the forestay to see if it will give you enough length? Lifting the drum on a CDI roller furler to expose the turnbuckle is pretty easy and takes only a minute:
1) Untie the tack of the sail.
2) Remove the long pin that goes thru the heart of the drum
3) Lift the drum and secure it so that it doesn't fall on your hand. (Or have someone hold it)

NOTE: You did NOT need to remove either shackle. You do NOT need to untie the halyard. Do NOT drop the pin overboard!

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 12:35:35

We had the same problem. Now we loosen the shrouds and backstay and it solved the problem. Prior to taking the mast down we loosen the shrouds and backstay by a certain number of turns - I use about 8. Let the rig be loose. Then when we raise the mast and the forestay is attached we tighten up the shrouds and backstay by 8 turns. Easy. I never mess with the forestay turnbuckle. Once it was set for proper rake I pinned the T-bolts so they wont move.

Edited by - on

jbkayaker
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
299 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 14:32:58

You can get a little extra help by using the spinnaker halyard to pull the mast forward. Just attach the end of the halyard that would be used to pull up a sail to any convenient spot on the bow. Run the other end of the halyard to a winch. When you crank the winch the mast top will be pulled toward the bow. That can give you that last inch of movement that you need and it's good insurance against the mast toppling backward.

Edited by - jbkayaker on 08/10/2009 14:33:30

britinusa
Web Editor

Members Avatar

USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2009 : 19:20:28

We do not attach the backstay until the forestay is set.

Then we atach and tighten the backstay such that all slack is taken up in the forestay, the result is easier boat handling, less rounding and longer times without helm adjustment.

Welcome to the forum.

Paul

Edited by - on

bshin
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
16 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2009 : 02:28:34

Well, whatever we do, it looks like we'll be in the market for some new T-bolts. Upon closer inspection, three of the four shroud bolts do have a small bend in them. Don't know if they were already like that or if we did it in our efforts to pull the mast far enough to attach the forestay. I went as far as putting a 2nd winch on the trailer and attached it to the jib halyard, but with no luck. The forestay never got any closer to the securing bracket.

Considering all, I'm leaning towards just loosening the turnbuckles on the shrouds and backstay. I've looked at the roller furler drum, and it has intimidated me (LOL).

Are the T-bolts 1/4" or 5/16"? I see that West Marine has them in 5/16" for about $15 a piece.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

Bshin
C250 WB #227

Edited by - on

windsong
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
318 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2009 : 05:15:44

Sorry to hear about your T-bolts. Don't be intimidated by the roller furler, though.

http://blumhorst.com/potterpages/forestay-adjustment-with-cdi.htm

Print this out and put it in your binder, as the CDI manual tells you in great detail how to assemble the furler, but not how to simply lift the drum. This spells it out nicely.

Edited by - on

bshin
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
16 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2009 : 08:00:08

Michael,

Great article. I found the CDI manuel, and you are right. They don't say anything about taking it off. I also found the Catalina manuel the previous owner gave us. Finally took the time to read thru it, and low and behold, the point out the necessity of having the shroud and backstay turnbuckles loose when raising the mast.

So I think Randy is "right on" in his procedure, so we'll do that the next time we try it. If the forestay still won't attach, then I'll do the roller furler. Also, the manuel showed the size of the T-bolts to be 5/16", so I should be able to get them from West Marine.

Thanks,

Bshin
C250 WB #227

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2009 : 12:46:51

Any time a component on a sailboat is so hard to move that you need to start winching, it is a great time to <b>STOP </b> and figure out why the thing isn't moving. I have bent those T-bolts myself and other things as well. When you are tempted to increase the power and leverage it is time to do the opposite. Figure out what is wrong, fix it, and then it will be easy.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 08/17/2009 : 20:58:12

Spiro,

I've thought about doing the same thing. It could even be done at the dock. Northern Tool has several ATV winches with various adapter plates. One could be slid over the far side of the dock to hold it in place.

Are you related to the Pappas family of restaurant fame?

Where do you keep/sail your boat?

Edited by - on

britinusa
Web Editor

Members Avatar

USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 09/17/2009 : 07:49:29

I didn't read in this thread that you had disconnected the backstay before raising the mast.

In our case (as mentioned above) we disconnect the backstay before lowering the mast and do not reconnect it till the mast is up and forestay secure.

paul

Edited by - on

Topic

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Jump To:

Association Forum

Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.