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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Restoration project C25

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ajmekuto
Deckhand

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8 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/19/2010 : 08:39:50

Hello everyone, I have a 79 C25 swing keel. Its in rough shape. I live in the lower hudson valley area in NY. I would love to restore my boat but do not have the technical skills to complete the mission. If anyone out there lives near me and could offer me advise on how to proceed, if I should proceed or is even interested in joining the cause let me know. The hulls in good shape, minor fiberglass work needed, some electric work needed, new rigging, but mostly cosmetics. Hoping to hear from someone, thanks!

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 09:18:18

You've come to the right place. It would be helpful for you to get more specific about what it is you are trying (hoping

) to do. You'll find someone hear that has already done it. You can also search the archives for topics.

You might consider having the boat surveyed by a professional surveyor. The will give you a prioritized list of things that will need attention. It'll cost a couple hundred dollars but, could save that much in ill-spent efforts directed at the wrong things. Also, insurance companies often require a survey before providing coverage.

One of the items that will certainly need attention is the keel lifting system. If it should fail, 1500Lbs of cast iron will fall suddenly and very likely take out the bottom of the boat along with it. If you're in the water when that happens, you WILL sink. If you're on the hard, you might find yourself trying to figure out how to get rid of all the scrap fiberglass, aluminium, iron and plastic that used to be your boat. Because of all that, this system requires frequent inspection, periodic maintenance and occasional replacement.

Other common problems (None nearly as serious as the keel) include leaking ports, leaking decks where the stanchions are through bolted, problems with the head if so equipped (many have replace the marine head with porta-potties). You want to take a close look at your rudder and inspect it for cracks. You mentioned rigging. Do you mean the standing rigging (stays and shrouds) or running rigging (lines)? I'm guessing, but both probably need replacement. Finally, what condition are the sails in? They might be re-conditionable (is that a word?) at a place like Sailcare but, if they are the originals, they will likely need replacement.

Remember, a $5000 boat will cost $5000 no matter how much you paid for it up front. Remember, too, that BOAT stands for Break Out Another Thousand.

Edited by - on

ajmekuto
Deckhand

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8 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 09:49:30

Thanks John, I appreciate the advice. I think I should definitly find a boat surveyor. I am lucky I didn't spend a lot of money for the boat. The first year I had it was great I sailed it all the time. I bought it from my sailing instructor with the intention on learning the inner working but then came kids and work was busy and the boat hasn't seen the water in 4 years. The sails are in good shape. I would need to replace both the standing and running rigs. Well just the fact the boat hasn't been used in 4 years should say it all. It breaks my heart because I love to sail and I have a boat. I just don't know if I should cut my loses and move on but if it wouldn't require major money to get it back in the water it would be worth the try and fun to learn. I hope someone see's this post who lives by me who might want to join in the cause or knows of a company that does restoration work.

Edited by - on

jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 10:24:29

I'm out on Long Island, so not too close, but am willing to discuss as much as you wish...as already said, an inspection is the best first step.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 11:04:51

The swing keel is certainly your first concern--its cable, attachments, and winch.

Another somewhat scary issue on boats earlier than about 1983 (not sure of the year) is the thru-hulls--"affectionately" referred to as "to-hulls" on this forum. These are threaded bronze pipes burried in a mushroom of epoxy on the inside of the hull, such that the outside is just a hole in the fiberglass. There are various threads in our archives about removing and replacing them with proper thru-hull fittings that are either bronze or (better) Marelon, with a mushroom or flush plate on the outside of the hull.

A few other items on older boats include the spreader sockets on the mast (originally aluminum, later changed to stainless), and the stem fitting (later changed to include a tang that runs under the rub-rail and 6-8" down the bow, where it's through-bolted).

Are you familiar with [url="http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_ID=7"]Catalina Direct[/url]? They're a third-party specialist in upgrades and maintenance items for the C-22, C-25, and a growing list of Catalina models. I recommend their C-25 Handbook--a looseleaf notebook that's essentially the catalog, but that also has some good ideas and information. Last I knew, they charged $10 for it, including lifetime updates.

Unfortunately I'm over 100 miles east of you, although I spend many weekends in Darien, CT, and could possibly meet with you on a Saturday or Sunday... However, I'm not a swing-keel expert--I owned a fin. (The swingers scare me!

) Where is the boat?

There's lots of help here--answers, pictures, directions, experiences, and moral support. Keep in touch!

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 02/19/2010 11:08:49

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 11:13:00

AJ,

As my father used to say, "most things are much simpler than they first appear."

If you use the search function on this website - you can uncover a lot of valuable information.

Ask away, there are some real babbling brooks here too!

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 11:35:01

Get the survey. Then decide on cost/benefit. I'd think that hiring a restorer to do the work could possibly cost you more than the boat is worth. My marina charges $80/hour for labor,

parts and supplies are added to that. I'd guess that in your part of the country the rates may be higher.

Dave makes a good point about Catalina Direct. You might also want to find yourself a copy of [url="http://www.amazon.com/Caseys-Complete-Illustrated-Sailboat-Maintenance/dp/0071462848"]Don Casey's Complete Illustrated Sailboat Maintenance Manual[/url] I bought one at my local Border's.

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 14:42:21

Welcome! And don't be timid about asking questions about things you are not sure of. Thats what this forum is all about, besides we love to spend your money!

Edited by - on

Jan Briede
Navigator

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USA
162 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 18:17:35

Hi AJ,
It seems I'm in the same boat (?) as you. On Monday, I'll be taking ownership of a 1979 boat as well. It too needs a lot of TLC and restoration. Mine is a fixed keel. A pity we don't live closer together so we could learn together (I'm in Yorktown, VA). Immediate issues for me will be the mast and all the various fittings/cables and the windows.
Jan

Edited by - on

Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 19:21:05

A logical approach would be to do the "sail & safety" related items first. Regardless of what you choose to eventually do with the boat, it'll sell better if stuff works. All the rest is cosmetic. Your choice of whether the to hulls or the rig comes first, but if it hasn't sunk and doesn't leak, get it ready to sail. You or the next owner can do the holes next year.

Unless the running rigging is really frayed, a pillow case and the lines in the washing machine or a very good solution.

Edited by - Stu Jackson C34 on 02/19/2010 19:21:46

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 19:59:12

I agree with Stu. Make it safe and sailable - a few times out will give you more incentive to keep working. Good luck, and here's to being a better sailor by really knowing your boat.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5369 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2010 : 21:43:19

AJ
What town are you in? I'm up in Stratford.
But I don't know anything about swing keels.

I got Don Casey's book on Amazon, and his writing style and illustrations makes repairs easily understood, and gives you all the knack you need to do the work yourself.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2010 : 10:01:08

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Voyager
 ...But I don't know anything about swing keels...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Strange coincidence...

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bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1776 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2010 : 12:33:28

I have been there and done that -- but with a fin keel version. Yes, get a survey. But/and -- talk to the surveyor about what he finds and be specific about asking how difficult or expensive would it be to make the boat safe vs having all the bells and whistles. A solid hull, working and safe swing keel, and rigging are needed. Electrical and plumbing, IMHO, are optional. I found the basics were manageable and/or relatively inexpensive to fix while the electrical and plumbing can be overwhelming and/or expensive. In my case I bit the bullet on safety up front and have been whittling away on the other projects slowly and as I can understand/handle. Finally, if the cost for the basics are more than finding a usable comparable boat, and you really have little or no interest in working on her, then cut your losses -- but remember-- all boats require commitment and TLC so the next one may also . . .

Happy to chat off-line in more detail if you want.

Edited by - on

ajmekuto
Deckhand

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8 Posts

Response Posted - 02/22/2010 : 08:55:07

Thanks everyone for all your advise and responses. I am very happy to report that over the weekend I meet a fellow Catalina owner who lives 5 minutes from my house. If it wasn't for this web site we would have never met and I wouldn't know what to do. This site is truly a God sent. Everyone is so helpful and knowledgeable. The gentlemen I met has an 1980 C25 swing keel. Our boats are practically the same. He's offered to help me get her back in the water. I am very excited and will report back in now and then and let you know of the progress we are making. I'll do some before and after pictures too. As I mentioned before the boat itself is very sturdy and upon his inspection he too confirmed the structural integrity was there. It just needs some good old elbow grease and a few mechanical things and she'll be back in the water. Once again thank you all and thank you for this web site!!!!

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 02/22/2010 : 10:29:28

BTW, welcome to the forum and the Association. This website is paid for with membership dues. You might consider spending $22 and become a member of the Association. In addition to supporting this website, you'll be able to purchase and fly a cool new burgee on your re-conditioned boat. You'll also be able to take advantage of some discounts from marine vendors available in the Member's Only area of the site.

Edited by - on

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