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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 250 Specific Forum

Ballast tank valve failure

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sterngucker
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USA
169 Posts

Initially Posted - 03/22/2010 : 00:00:54

Has anyone ever had the water ballast inlet valve fail on them? As in , came off the rod? In preparing the boat to get back in the water I was underneath the boat checking out the centerboard, the kevlar control line and the valve. I noticed that the pin connected to the valve that keeps it from turning when you raise and lower it, was no longer connected. I grabbed the valve in my hand to see if I could reconnect the pin and THE VALVE CAME OFF IN MY HAND! The , I assume, welded connection was very corroded, but it hasn't been in salt water for a year and a half (been dry docked in the driveway, sad but true). I am very glad I found this problem before launching the boat. I'm sure the valve would have found it's way to the bottom of the cove in a hurry when I went to seal it.

We decided to trailer the boat to San Diego anyway, and secure our slip at the Marina. Where better to get a boat repaired than San Diego? I plan to call Catalina Yachts in Woodland Hills in the morning to get their recommendation for repair.

I searched the Forum for any reference to a valve failure but came up with nothing. Anybody heard of a similar problem?

Charlie
"C Angel" 250WB #799

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britinusa
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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 03/22/2010 : 06:41:44

Charlie, no sign of the issue you suggest.

Could you clarify... Did the 'Alignment pin' break/snap/unweld so that the lower valve plate and Valve Shaft could rotate freely?

Did the lower plate still have the foot-plus long S/S shaft (Valve Shaft) connected.

Was the wing nut atop the Valve Shaft to prevent it and the valve from falling out?
Was the nylock nut in place above the wing nut on the Valve Shaft (to prevent the wing nut from coming off the Valve Shaft)?

You probably have <b>every</b> C250's owner's attention!

Pictures would be really helpful.

FYI, To my recollection, the Valve Stem is Welded to the Valve Plate, but I did a mod to my WB valve system a couple of years ago. I upgraded the top of the 'hump' under the steps, but saw no issue similar to what you are descibing.

Paul

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sterngucker
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169 Posts

Response Posted - 03/22/2010 : 08:22:28

Hi Paul, Both the alignment pin and the valve shaft unwelded. I will take photos this morning and post them. The hardware on top is still on the the rod which is still in the boat. The valve and alignment pin are in the truck. Talked to Kent at Catalina in Woodland Hills and he is checking to see if he has one there, as well as checking with his vender. He also said I could order one from the plant in Florida. I could drive up to Woodland Hills if I had to. I could also check to see if I could find ksomeone to reweld it here in San Diego. I'm on spring break till Friday so I have some time available, but was really hoping to spend it sailing!

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sterngucker
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Response Posted - 03/22/2010 : 10:19:55

[url="http://cid-41e1742b3a47c514.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/valve%20parts/valve%20parts.jpg"]Valve photos[/url]

After close inspection it looks like the parts are welded. Getting them rewelded is probably the way to go.

After some retrospection, I seem to recall the wing nut being diffcult to turn when I opened the valve prior to loading the boat on the trailer last Nov 2008. I hadn't kept the rod and wing nut lubricated while it was in the slip (hadn't used it, out of sight out of mind)so my maintenance or lack thereof is suspect. However the part does show a considerable amount of corrosion. The purpose of some of us is to be an example (or warning) to others.

Keep those water ballast valve rod threads well lubrication and protected!!!!!!

Edited by - sterngucker on 03/22/2010 10:23:56

528
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181 Posts

Response Posted - 03/22/2010 : 19:59:13

I'm not a metalurgist, but that looks like galvanic corrosion. I wouldn't think they would use dissimilar metals there, but possible? Anyone else know if stray current would cause that kind of failure?

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britinusa
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Response Posted - 03/22/2010 : 21:12:51

Like I said, "You have every C250's Owners attention" and those photo make the point - inspect the valve assembly.

Fortunately, our boat is at the side of the house, so we will check our valve come daylight.

Thanks for Posting Charlie!

I was under the impression that the metal is S/S, but that corrosion looks serious.

So, what's the recent history of the boat, in a slip? in a marina?, marina has 110v supply ??????

Paul

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JimB517
Past Commodore

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3285 Posts

Response Posted - 03/23/2010 : 12:17:45

Charlie is here now and the boat is back in the slip next to me. He got the repair done yesterday. There was a fine crack in the weld which caused crevice corrosion. It is welded up good as new, but Charlie is getting a new part from Catalina anyway. The boat has been in a slip for a year or two as well as stored on the hard for several years.

This fault couldn't readily sink the boat. But it could make the water ballast system inoperable.

Check this, if it failed at sea all the parts would be lost.

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britinusa
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Response Posted - 03/25/2010 : 12:09:01

It took less than 2 minutes to drop the valve and remove it for inspection. Looks in really good shape, no sign of corrosion.

Took another 5 minutes to put the valve back in place (peggy in the cabin to catch the valve shaft as I pushed the assembly up from under the boat.

While at it, I applied some silicone grease to the threaded end of the valve shaft and wingnut.

An easy inspection, and not something to worry about afterwards. I'll add it to my growing of 'things to check often' list.

Paul
Paul

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JimB517
Past Commodore

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Response Posted - 03/25/2010 : 13:29:37

Charlie and the welder believe it was a Catalina factory defect (bad weld) that is hopefully pretty rare. We'll see if Catalina steps up to the plate on this.

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sterngucker
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169 Posts

Response Posted - 03/28/2010 : 09:30:08

To conclude this saga, I took the pieces to the Driscoll boat yard next to our marina and they suggested Thomas Marine in Point Loma, San Diego. I went there had asked them if they could do the repair that day so I could get on the water and not spend another night in a motel. The service there was fantastic. We dropped the parts off before lunch and by the time we had finished our incredible lasagna at La Scala they called and said it was ready to pickup. Brian Thomas of Thomas Marine said that there was probably a pinhole in the original weld that allowed the extensive corrosion as seen in the photos I posted. The corrosion had occurred to both the lifting rod and the alignment pin. He also stated that bronze would have been the better choice for a part that is immersed constantly. They cut off the 3/4 inches of corrosion and welded the rod and pin on both the top and bottom of the plate. They charged me $60 for the repair.

We also replaced the gasket material on the plate, one sheet of dense neoprene (Marine Exchange gave us a piece as a "sample") and one sheet of thick open cell neoprene from a custom dive suit shop's scrap barrel for 99 cents. We glued it all together with 4200 and reinstalled the valve that afternoon. With Jim Baumgart's help we had the boat rigged and launched by the time it got dark and motored to the slip. I lost some travel on the valve due to the shorter rod but it didn't seem to affect the time reqired to fill the ballast tank.

We had some fine sailing during the remainder of our spring break week. Thursday afternoon was the best with relatively flat water and winds around 10 to 12 mph. C Angel sailed beautifully. It was great to be back on the water.

It took a couple of days for Kent from Catalina Yachts to get back to me. He couldn't find a valve at Woodland Hills and suggested I order one from the factory in Florida. I will call them on Monday, state that the problem was a manufacturing defect and see what happens.

Inspect those ballast tank valves whenever you can! I am just glad I discovered the problem before we launched, or the plate would have ended up at the bottom of Mission Bay.

Edited by - sterngucker on 03/28/2010 09:42:36

Skipper Paul
1st Mate

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34 Posts

Response Posted - 04/01/2010 : 08:42:44

I had the very same thing happen to my ballast tank valve. Close inspection revealed internal corrosion that could not be seen easily from the outside. the small pin seemed to be fine but the large pin broke easily. My solution was to weld it back with lots of shoulder weld to support it. This was still not good enough for my paranoid nature, so I bought a new one (about $85.00 at the time) and I have kept the old one as a backup that I probably will never use.

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