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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Roller furling: the goose or the egg

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dave holtgrave
Captain

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USA
427 Posts

Initially Posted - 11/05/2002 : 14:53:28

as my 25 tall rig is in storage for the winter.i am considering purchasing a roller furler. never having used a furler i have many questions that are confused by opinions of riggers and sailmakers, so i thought i would go to the best scource, you guys.

i am considering the harken 00al or the cdi ff4 and i want to order the sail before sring ang when i set up the mast.

questions:

1.is the harken 00al large enough for a 155 on a tall rig or should i look at the 0 system?

2.harken products. if i use a toggle at the top of the stay in the second pin from the front (forward pin for spinnaker), can the foil go as high as the 2 1/2 inches from the top cap without interfering with hitting the mast when it is furled? with this how high can i raise the halyard swivel(internal halyards)? is it possible to run the swivel up to the halyard sheave and will it still swivel? or do i need a retainer and keep the halyard down a short distance? i am trying to get as much luff length as possible.

3. cdi and harken products. i want to place the drum as low as possible and as forward as possible on the fore chainplate i am trying for either the three holes. has anyone tried ths and does it work?

4.how do people like the cdi furler with 155 genny's compared to the harken. there is a lot of money differance.

5. when you reef, say from a 155 to a 130 and the roll starts to develope on the furler does it effect your pointing ability?

6.if i am looking for a maximum tight luff length am i close to correct if i am considering a tall rig length of 31'-5" for harken and 30'-8"?

your help is appreciated in advance.
i guess what it all comes down to is if someone with a tall rig could give me a tight luff length and what type furler they are using this would allow me to order my sail.

thanks again and again
dave
5722

Edited by - on

osmepneo
Past Commodore

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USA
1420 Posts

Response Posted - 11/05/2002 : 17:19:02

Dave, osmepneo is a std rig and has cdi furler. It is easy to operate, and makes sailing more fun for my wife as I get to stay in the cockpit more.

Luff lenght for the re-cut 155 was a pain to get. It seems l;ike a comody of errors as the sail maker and struggled to finally come up with a number. For the life of me I don't know where that calculation is but the number we came up with was right-on.

I suspect you'll love yours!<img src=icon_smile.gif border=0 align=middle>

Pointing ability is a tough call for me to give any wise comments. One time I had the sail open and it was way, way to much sail, overpowering my son and me. I reduced sail to about 130 and popped right along at hull speed.

Don Peet
c25, 1665, osmepneo, sr/wk
The Great Sacandaga Lake, NY

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osmepneo
Past Commodore

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USA
1420 Posts

Response Posted - 11/05/2002 : 17:21:41

Dave,

just a second thought. When you install the luff of cdi ff4, have your mast down! Some place I read you could do it, but it was very hard, like trying to keep a string straight as you raise it and let more out.

Don Peet
c25, 1665, osmepneo, sr/wk
The Great Sacandaga Lake, NY

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Mike Vaccaro
1st Mate

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77 Posts

Response Posted - 11/07/2002 : 08:35:48

Dear Dave,

We use a Harken 0 on our tall rig. We've got it rigged to the "spinnaker" pin, as you suggested. The drum mounts to the forestay band on the stem fitting (not the three adjustment holes immediately aft)--this is the top portion of the piece that wraps over the stem and continues down the bow. Although it's not required, we use a block on the mast to pull the halyard aft of the foil at an acute angle, this minimizes wrapping potential (along with a swivel fitting on the halyard). A halyard wrap will make it impossible to furl and has the potential to damage the headstay. This will effect the luff length to some degree, i.e., a "full hoist" will not go all the way to the top of the foil if you rig this way. Having suffered halyard wraps, we think that that reliability is more critical than another foot or so of luff at the head.

Furling will affect pointing ability. This can be somewhat minimized by adding a foam luff to your headsail. Realistically, headsails can only be furl reefed 20% (or so) without affecting pointing ability. A sailmaker can point you in the right direction. We can only recommend that you size your sail for your average sailing conditions (i.e., don't buy a 155 if a 135 makes sense for your area, figuring that you can furl for average conditions and have a "large" #1 available for less air) and roller reef occasionally.

We highly recommend the Harken system. If you go to www.harken.com, you can find phone numbers and on-line manuals. Their technical support is outstanding, and I'm sure that they can help you size a system for your boat. The system is utterly reliable and has proven to be essentially maintenance free. You might consider down-loading the manual--it should answer most of your questions.

Best of Luck!

Mike Vaccaro on the "Swoose"
84 TR/SK #4707

Edited by - on

jwilliams
Captain

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USA
357 Posts

Response Posted - 11/07/2002 : 13:11:55

Hi Dave,

Hey Jude is an '82 std rig, fin keel. The CDI FF4 was a great add to her. With roller furling and leading all lines aft, it is easy to sail with or without crew. I spend many days singlehanding.

Downside is I cannot point as close as my buddy Paul on his Sparkey. We often sail side by side and the difference is apparent. His sail shape is also better in general. His Jib is 110, my furler Jib is 150, so I can make up for sail shape with size and compete.

Mike Vaccaro's comment about selecting the proper sail size is right on. I am a SF Bay sailer. Usually, after 11:00am, there is lots of wind (15-20kts) and if I had it to do over I would have probably gottn a 135 or 140 because often I have to start furling down to about 110 before Paul even thinks about changing Jibs. This means I compromise sail shape and power.

I think the CDI rig is simple, does not exhibit the top wrapping I hear from others, and is robust enough for our boats. Having said that, it is the only one I have ever owned, so comparison is biased.

All in all, I would not think of going back to a hanked-on Jib unless I was racing all the time (of course whenever I am out with Paul...), so the compromises of ease of use, safety (no trips to the foredeck to change Jibs like I used to), fast furling and no un-hanking and folding makes it a good investment.

I bought mine with sail from Sail Warehouse in Monterey, CA. I think their prices are very competitive.

Jim Williams
Hey Jude C25fk 2958

Edited by - on

luckystar
Navigator

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USA
236 Posts

Response Posted - 11/07/2002 : 13:36:49

I too have a std rig '82 and my boat came with CDI FF4. It's in bad shape and ugly too. During the move, the hauler wrapped my foil in a coil on the end and it left a "squiggle" in the foil. It has finally started to relax after 4 years, but has never really seemed to affect my performance. The reason I mention the condition is because this is an original furler from '82! And it still works just fine, never a problem. I would suggest getting the bearing upgrade as it will make it easier to furl in and out. I don't have it, so I just take the drum apart about twice a year and spray SailKote in there and it works great again! Good luck with which ever way you go, but when I rerig, I'm ording a new FF4. It's cheaper and I can use the money I save over a harken or profurl system to by the new rigging! The FF4 is perfect for our rigs!

Patrick Burnett, Little Rock, AR
S/V Lucky Star #2707 1982 SK/SR

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Dennis Pierce
1st Mate

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USA
59 Posts

Response Posted - 11/08/2002 : 08:06:00

I went with the Harken. It's a quality product and easy to use. I've had other furling rigs on 2 different C-30's and I think that the extra money for a Harken is worth it over the long haul. I have a 110 and 150 set up with luft tape. Did the 150 first and came to the conclusion that single handing on Mission Bay called for a 110.

Dennis Pierce
Gypsy Witch #1719

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DC_Sailor
Deckhand

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5 Posts

Response Posted - 11/11/2002 : 11:08:44

Dave,

I like my CDI; it is a quality furler. It was a lot less expensive than other furlers and works great. I installed it with a couple of buddies in an afternoon. Definitely do it with the mast down and buy the ball-bearing kit. Good Luck!

Mike

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