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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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One Solar Charger Two Batteries?

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John G-
Admiral

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793 Posts

Initially Posted - 11/13/2002 : 00:04:08

I have two batteries with an “A” “Both” & “B’ switch. I would like to get a flexible solar panel. Do I just hook it up to one battery and will they both charge, or do I need to hook it to both, or get two solar chargers?
Also recommendations of brands of solar panels and wattage would be appreciated. Thanks 

[url="http://www.peregrinefund.org/"]<img src="http://www.peregrinefund.org/images/intro_mid_image.GIF" border=0>[/url]
 John G- "PEREGRINE" C25-#4762 FK 

Edited by - john g- on 11/13/2002 00:13:23

Edited by - john g- on 11/13/2002 00:14:12

Edited by - on

Bryan Beamer
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1038 Posts

Response Posted - 11/13/2002 : 10:25:57

Hi John,

I have the same set up you mentioned. I have a rigid solar panel that is mounted to the stern pulpit. It trickel charges the batteries. I do not know what it is called I will have to check next time I'm at the boat. It's like a splitter, the solar panel is wired to the splitter then 2 red lead wires go from the splitter to each positive terminal on the batteries and then 1 black lead goes to the negitive terminals witch are tied together anyway. This system will charge the batteries with the battery switch on or off.

Bryan Beamer
Daylight Again
C250wk #495

Edited by - on

MattL
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 11/13/2002 : 14:35:29

OK, time for my stupid question.
I am using a trickle charger I got at OSH. I just attached it to my one battery and plugged it in. I have not tried to check the battery level. Every once and a while I unplug it and leave the lights on to drain the battery. I was told that for a deep cycle battery you should do this. I would like to get a solar charger so I don't have to rely on power at the slip (not always working).
Question 1; Am I doing the right thing discharging the battery or should I just leave it plugged in all the time to the charger and forget it.
Question 2; If I get a solar charger do I have to worry about over charging also. Do I need to get some kind of regulator?
Thanks for the help.

Matt/Brigitte Loeffler
E.C. Rider
Cat 25 86'
FK/SR _/)

Edited by - on

visio
Deckhand

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USA
12 Posts

Response Posted - 11/13/2002 : 18:18:41

Hi Matt,

I believe I saw an article in the West Marine catalog that breifly mentioned cycle life for deep-cycle lead-acid batteries. It said that each battery is rated for a certain number of charge-discharge cycles, but a battery will exceed its cycle life if it is not fully discharged on each cycle. If I'm remembering that article correctly, it would seem that fully discharging a deep-cycle lead-acid battery would be bad.

I also seem to remember that ceratin nickle cadnium (NiCad) batteries (like older cellphones batteries) need to be fully discharged occasionally to prevent a battery "memory" from forming, but I don't think that this would apply to a lead-acid battery.

I'll find the West Marine article when I get home, so that we don't have to rely on my feeble memory. <img src=icon_smile.gif border=0 align=middle>

I've been lurking since I bought #2580 last June, but this is my first post. Thanks to everyone for making this such a great resource. <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Dave Laws
C25 TR/SK #2580 "Visio"
Stillwater, OK

Edited by - visio on 11/13/2002 18:19:32

Edited by - visio on 11/13/2002 18:20:59

Edited by - on

Leon Sisson
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1893 Posts

Response Posted - 11/13/2002 : 19:05:54

There's lots of good info on this and similar topics in the West Marine catalog and on their website.

John,

To charge multiple batteries from one or more sources, use battery combiners between batteries (2 batteries = 1 combiner, 3 batteries = 2 combiners, etc.)

On my C-25, I mounted two 10w Unisolar flexible solar panels above the head compartment, just ahead of the mast. One panel wired directly to each house battery. Cranking battery wired to engine alternator.

Wiring diagram and photos available upon request.

Matt,

Discharging flooded cell lead acid batteries below 50% of rated capacity significantly reduces their service life.

Solar (or other) chargers that don't exceed 1% to 2% of the total bank capacity don't generally require regulation.

-- Leon Sisson

Edited by - on

visio
Deckhand

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USA
12 Posts

Response Posted - 11/13/2002 : 19:24:14

Matt,

I found the article. It's in the West Marine 2002 Master catalog, pg. 586. Toward the end of the article it says "We don't recommend fully discharging batteries since it dramatically reduces the battery's useful life."

I hope this helps,

Dave Laws
C25 TR/SK #2580 "Visio"
Stillwater, OK

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 11/13/2002 : 20:01:51

Matt,

According to the article that Dave Laws referred to at West Marine,...

Longevity Measurements

"While the other measurements are helpful when sizing batteries to their tasks, boaters need batteries that last a long time, too. This is measured in how many cycles a battery can be discharged and charged. It is the ability to cycle repeatedly that differentiates deep cycle batteries from automotive starting batteries, which cannot withstand more than a few deep discharges before failure.

Battery manufacturers measure battery cycles by discharging fully-charged batteries at 25 amps until their battery voltage drops to 10.5 volts. Then the batteries are charged under controlled conditions, and the process is repeated until the battery has half of its claimed reserve minutes left. At this point, the test is stopped and the cycles are tallied."

So if this is true, then you deep discharging your batteries to near zero before recharging might be shortening the rated lifespan.

Here is the link to the West Marine article
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/WestAdvisorDisplayView?advisor=460-461.htm

Here is a link to the marine battery FAQ page at Exide,
http://www.exideworld.com/faq/faq_marine.html#bestway

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
Lake Erie

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 11/13/2002 : 20:05:53

"I've been lurking since I bought #2580 last June, but this is my first post." - Dave Laws

I know what you mean, Dave. I lurked around for quite a bit before jumping into the foray. Now look at the monster I've become! <img src=icon_smile_evil.gif border=0 align=middle>

Welcome to the club!

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
Lake Erie

Edited by - on

ssteakley
Captain

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USA
467 Posts

Response Posted - 11/14/2002 : 12:09:26

This is an interesting thread,
I do not know why batteries are so difficult to deal with. I have a single battery with a small inexpensive trickle charger that I used to leave on all the time. After having to refill the battery water at least twice I finally figured out I was "cooking" the battery. So now I only plug in the charger when I am there and now my battery stays full of water but the problem is it is not fully charged for my weekend activities. My stereo last about 1-1 1/2 hours before the CD player stops. So now I am looking into one of the more expensive chargers that carge the battery and then maintains it at about 80% capacity. Does anyone use this type of unit and how much do they cost?
Thanks,
Steve Steakley

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 11/14/2002 : 18:25:31

"I do not know why batteries are so difficult to deal with. I have a single battery with a small inexpensive trickle charger that I used to leave on all the time. After having to refill the battery water at least twice I finally figured out I was "cooking" the battery. So now I only plug in the charger when I am there and now my battery stays full of water but the problem is it is not fully charged for my weekend activities." - Steve

The previous owner of North Star installed an inexpensive Sears Craftsman fully automatic battery charger/maintainer and I leave it on all the time and because it is an "automatic" unit, it will shut itself down when the battery is full to prevent cooking it. IMHO unless you have some exotic battery bank system, one does not need to buy an expensive marine charging system. Just be sure to buy a fully automatic charger/maintainer that will shut itself down.

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
Lake Erie

Edited by - on

Leon Sisson
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1893 Posts

Response Posted - 11/14/2002 : 19:10:52

Steve Steakley,<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>... looking into one of the more expensive chargers that charge the battery and then maintains it ... anyone use this type of unit and how much do they cost?<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>I installed a Statpower Truecharge 20 Plus so called 'smart charger' several years ago, and have been very satisfied with it. Once installed, it is completely automatic -- so long as you remember to connect shore power. It won't under- or over-charge, manages up to three banks independantly, handles all three popular lead/acid construction types, can detect and compensate for ambient temperature and battery heat build up during charging (battery temp sensor optional), charge status indicator LEDs (remote display panel optional), can act as a 12VDC power supply with no battery in circuit, and probably more cool stuff I can't remember.
<img src="http://www.westmarine.com/images/full/22223_f.jpg" border=0>
As for price, shop around West Marine, Boat/US, Defender, Sailnet, etc. I've seen them on sale for as little as $300 without the accessories. Or you can buy a lot of solar panel for that price, but then where would you mount it?

For me, the big advantage of the smart charger is how fast it can bring a deeply discharged set of batteries back up with no risk of damaging them. For instance: pull into a marina, plug into shore power, take a shower, eat dinner. By then your house bank is fully charged and ready to go.

-- Leon Sisson

Edited by - on

kurt
1st Mate

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27 Posts

Response Posted - 11/20/2002 : 14:47:36

I have a flexible 13 watt panel with a 7 amp regulator that charges the two batteries. My boat is on a mooring, the batteries are always are at the top when I arrive for the weekend. I never have to worry about overcharging if I don’t show up for a couple of weeks. I wired the regulator to the back of the battery switch. It has been working great. I try to find a photo of it

Kurt
86 SR/FK
“Snowfish”

<img src="http://www.snowfish.org/bw.jpg " border=0>

Edited by - on

kurt
1st Mate

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27 Posts

Response Posted - 11/25/2002 : 09:39:37

link to photo of 15 watt solar
www.snowfish.org/boat/vent.jpg

Edited by - on

Bryan Beamer
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1038 Posts

Response Posted - 12/02/2002 : 13:16:56

Checked my solar charging system this weekend. Here it is I have 2 batteries in the v-berth with the 1,2 or all battery switch mounted on the stern storage area. The rigid solar panel mounted behind the starboard stern rail seat next to the outboard motor. In the stern storage area I have a Flex-charge model #PV70 regulator (this one is made for 2 batteries). It is easy to wire 5 wires are well marked. 2 wir 1+ and 1- go to solar panel, 1- to the negative terminals of the batteries, 2+ leads one to each positive terminal on the batteries. I have mine hooked to the 1,2,or all switch, the same terminal as the lead coming from the batteries. The system was an option at the dealer it has been almost 3 years (boat in water year round)no problems with system. I also have a inverter/charger 120-volt ac 975-watts to 12-volts dc 55-amps with a charge rate of .5amps Magnetek model #7455 it is the size of a shoe box and weighs in at 8lbs. witch I added. This allows me to charge the batteries with shore power and with the inverter allows me to not use the batteriers to work all the 12-volt equipment in the boat.

Bryan Beamer
Daylight Again
C250wk #495

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