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C25 Tall Rig boom height question

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djdurrett
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Initially Posted - 08/03/2010 : 08:44:13

Okay tall rig owners. I am trying to figure something out. I am a fairly new owner of a tall rig C25 and the PO had a stopper below the "gate" or slot in the mast that kept the boom gooseneck slide below said slot. The result was the head of the sail looked like it was about a foot from reaching the top of the mast. Is this correct? My sailing brain says that I want the sail as high as possible, which would mean that the gooseneck slide and boom would be above the mast slot. Is that correct? Or is there a chance the PO has a standard rig main on and I have the wrong sail? Last night I slid the boom above the slot and raised the sail all the way. Sail trim seemed improved with the 155% up, speaking of the slot, but the boom seem rediculously high (about 40 to 45 inches above the deck). Thanks in advance!

"Belafonte"
79 C25 TR/FK #1130
Bay View Marina
Lake Ray Hubbard
Dallas, TX

Edited by - djdurrett on 08/03/2010 08:47:21

Steve Milby
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 09:03:54

The mainsail should rise to within a few inches of the top of the mast. If the stopper prevents it, remove the stopper, move all the slides above the mast slot opening, and then replace the stopper, to prevent the slides from falling out of the mast slot opening when the sail is lowered. If your boat doesn't have a "mast gate," which closes the slot and prevents the slides from falling out, you can, and should get one from Catalina Direct, or you can fabricate a set.

If the boom seems "ridiculously high," it might be that the mainsail on your boat was made for a standard rig C25. Some owners of tall rigs use a standard rig main sail, in order to raise the boom higher over the cockpit. (The mast on the tall rig is 2' higher, and the boom on a tall rig is 1' lower, than on a standard rig. Therefore, the boom on a tall rig is normally 1' lower than the boom on a standard rig boat.) By using a standard rig mainsail, the boom is raised to the same height as the boom on a standard rig boat. You lose a little sail area by using a standard rig mainsail on a tall rig boat. The boat should still perform reasonably well, but not as well as with a tall rig mainsail.

Personally, on my tall rig boat, I liked the inproved performance and speed of the tall rig, and simply learned to keep my head down in the cockpit. The lower boom didn't bother me. For those who don't like the low boom, using a smaller mainsail is a reasonable remedy.

Edited by - Steve Milby on 08/03/2010 09:08:46

djdurrett
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 09:17:04

Thank you, this is very helpful. I am going to run a tape up there and measure the luff of the sail. I just can't settle for loss of potential perfomance!

But just to be clear, the boom should be above the mast slot?

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 09:42:10

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by djdurrett
 Thank you, this is very helpful. I am going to run a tape up there and measure the luff of the sail. I just can't settle for loss of potential perfomance!

But just to be clear, the boom should be above the mast slot?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I sold my tall rig C25 a few years ago, but the tall rig boom was below the mast slot opening when the mainsail was fully raised, but the sail slugs should all be held above it by a stopper when the sail is down, unless you have a mast gate, such as the one from CD.

I only saw a standard rig mainsail on a tall rig boat once or twice, and that was many years ago, and I don't remember whether the boom was above or below the mast slot opening when the sail was raised, but I believe it was just below the slot opening, but very close to it.

Edited by - on

djdurrett
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 10:09:30

Based on that, it sounds like the PO (I like to call Nancy) put a standard rig main on to make room for the bimini, however the boom as it was rigged when I took possession was below the slot with the sail lug stopper as you described.

So the question now is should I project the sail as high as possible and have the boom above the slot or correct the boom position and wait until I can get a new main... will measure tonight to make sure, but I suspect that to be the deal.

Good news is that I have been able to sail every night for the past 3 and have plans to sail the next 3! I love it!

Edited by - on

PCP777
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 10:18:19

Darren, want to race on JV tomorrow with me?

Mine comes to within a few inches of the top.

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 10:50:41

IMHO, the boom should stay below the gate, regardless of the sail. A SR sail is a full 3' shorter than a TR sail, so I would expect the gooseneck to end up above the gate when you fully hoist the SR sail on the TR mast. In fact, at 2' higher than a SR boom (which is already a foot higher than the normal TR), I'd expect it to look a little silly, but it'd be plenty high for Yao Ming to stand in the cockpit. I even wonder whether, at that height, the boom will hit the backstay. Another possible risk is that if you drop the sail and the impact of the gooseneck on the stopper drives it down (it's happened to me on my SR), the stopper and gooseneck could come out of the gate (this part hasn't happened to me), which could be a little hard on the sail, not to mention somebody on the cabintop. Gate plates could prevent this, but I don't think they're really meant to contain the gooseneck--just the slugs.

If this is a SR sail and you put a stopper above the gooseneck and a few inches below the gate, you'll be able to raise a SR sail to a point that it looks and acts like a reefed TR sail, and still has a little more power than a SR boat (given that your headsail is bigger).

I don't know the height of the TR gate relative to the SR gate on the mast, but you might be able to find or have made a sail that, fully hoisted, lifts the boom a little higher than the normal TR without lifting it to or above the gate. In other words, with a luff about a foot longer than yours.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 08/03/2010 10:53:38

djdurrett
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 11:06:37

Makes senses. I was planning on new sails anyway although it will be a little while... In all the sailing I have done since May on this boat, I have yet to have to reef. This probably explains that as well. Thank you for your help.

Peter, yes, I think I should be clear to race with you guys on Wednesday. Me, you, Keelan, Robert and another?

Edited by - on

PCP777
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 11:53:30

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by djdurrett
 Makes senses. I was planning on new sails anyway although it will be a little while... In all the sailing I have done since May on this boat, I have yet to have to reef. This probably explains that as well. Thank you for your help.

Peter, yes, I think I should be clear to race with you guys on Wednesday. Me, you, Keelan, Robert and another?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Might be just us four.

Might be just us four. BTW, if we could get together this weekend and replace my sheaves on the mast head at Inland marine on that tower it would probably go a long way towards comparing rigs.

Edited by - PCP777 on 08/03/2010 11:56:04

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 12:08:03

On our TR the boom sits just below the mast gate with the sail fully hoisted. It sounds like you have either a SR rig main or a main for a Capri 25, which has a luff about 1 ft. shorter than a TR main.
A C-25 TR main has a luff of 27.66 ft. according to the Sail Warehouse, while a SR fig main's luff is about 24.60 ft. hope that helps. A reefed TR main is about the same size as a non-reefed SR main, which is why some TR owners order a second set of reef points when buying a new main. I plan to do likewise.

Edited by - on

djdurrett
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 13:56:02

David,

Thank you for that thought. I will measure it but it does make allot of sense as to why I never have to reef...

Peter,

I would be happy to help. When is good?

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Response Posted - 08/03/2010 : 18:19:01

Many people like to reef their standard rigs at around 15 knots. If you expect to be sailing in that kind of breeze or stronger, and have a sail made that's maybe a foot shorter than the TR main, the "typical" first reef might give you a little less sail than the SR (unreefed), but more than a first reef on a SR. You can take this up with the sailmaker--discussing how you want to use the boat and in what conditions. A tall rig with a sail that raises the boom a foot or so could be a very nice compromise between TR light-air performance and SR cockpit comfort (including room for a bimini). And remember, the main is not the primary driving force on a C-25 --the jib/genoa is. So a few square feet less on the main will have an infinitesimal effect on speed.

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