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Tragedy in Chi-Mac Race

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Initially Posted - 07/19/2011 : 14:01:20

From [url="http://www.soundingspub.com/news/dispatches/286467-video-tragedy-in-chi-mac"]Soundings Magazine Dispatches[/url]...

I'm amazed they attempted that race in that boat--apparently it's 35', but a pure sport-boat. The race is over 300 miles on a BIG lake.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 07/19/2011 14:20:53

Dave5041
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Response Posted - 07/19/2011 : 15:27:38

The drive to win produces equipment with little reserve and no shortage of those willing to use it. Colin Chapman, the founder of Lotus Racing, once said that if it weren't for the difficulty in finding drivers that the perfect F-1 car would disintegrate from metal fatigue as it crossed the finish line. Most of us are more cautious and seamanly, but those driven to win are free to make the choice. It is fortunate that only two died.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 07:55:39

Apparently all crew were wearing pfds, and at least the 2 who died, if not all, were wearing safety harnesses and were attached to the boat. For some reason, the 2 deceased weren't able to disconnect their tethers, which held them underwater.

I think I see what is perhaps the most serious deficiency of the boat. The boat relies on an outboard motor for its auxiliary power. That undoubtedly means they removed the motor while racing, and stowed it below decks. Thus, when the storm came on them, and they lowered all their sails in preparation for it, they had no auxiliary power. The reports from crew indicate that, just before the high winds and waves hit, the windspeed had dropped to about 5 kts. That means, without auxiliary power, the boat was dead in the water, with no steerageway. When the big wind and waves hit, the helmsman couldn't point the boat in a direction so that it could withstand the waves. The big, steep waves probably hit the boat hard on it's quarter or its beam, and rolled it over. Although the design of the boat was certainly not well-suited to the conditions it was in, it might have survived if the boat had auxiliary power sufficient to give it steerageway, so that they could orient the boat to the waves.

I can't think of any boat of any design that wouldn't have been in extreme danger of capsizing if caught suddenly by 70 kt winds and steep waves, without auxiliary power, and without steerageway. Almost any boat caught without propulsion and with it's beam to the seas in such conditions would probably have capsized.

Edited by - on

redviking
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 08:23:07

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Steve Milby
 Apparently all crew were wearing pfds, and at least the 2 who died, if not all, were wearing safety harnesses and were attached to the boat. For some reason, the 2 deceased weren't able to disconnect their tethers, which held them underwater.

I think I see what is perhaps the most serious deficiency of the boat. The boat relies on an outboard motor for its auxiliary power. That undoubtedly means they removed the motor while racing, and stowed it below decks. Thus, when the storm came on them, and they lowered all their sails in preparation for it, they had no auxiliary power. The reports from crew indicate that, just before the high winds and waves hit, the windspeed had dropped to about 5 kts. That means, without auxiliary power, the boat was dead in the water, with no steerageway. When the big wind and waves hit, the helmsman couldn't point the boat in a direction so that it could withstand the waves. The big, steep waves probably hit the boat hard on it's quarter or its beam, and rolled it over. Although the design of the boat was certainly not well-suited to the conditions it was in, it might have survived if the boat had auxiliary power sufficient to give it steerageway, so that they could orient the boat to the waves.

I can't think of any boat of any design that wouldn't have been in extreme danger of capsizing if caught suddenly by 70 kt winds and steep waves, without auxiliary power, and without steerageway. Almost any boat caught without propulsion and with it's beam to the seas in such conditions would probably have capsized.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Hmmmm.... Me thinks 4 to 6 foot seas are uh way doable for the average 35 footer with a decent keel which weighs at least 15,000 lbs. You shouldn't roll and NOT come back up. It's a 2800 lb. 35 footer. How much of that is keel I have not yet discovered, but this thing has Ralph Nader written all over it. Day sailing dinghy at best as it used human ballast for ballast. Not a good choice for a 300 mile race.

I'm going Darwin on the organizers, the owners and everyone who saw this POS leave. Sorry, accidents like this are sad, but SO preventable hence my anger. Those conditions WOULD NOT have flipped my boat. I've slid sideways off of 12-15 footers with barely a splash in the cockpit. I did start running on a broad reach with the spreader lights on after that!

An outboard is a liability in those conditions, BUT you should always be able to run and if not deploy your hook and hang bow to. All reports indicated that they saw the storm on radar and doused the sails, but those actions alone were simply not enough.

I also checked the weather for that time and did not see anything over 50 knots reported. That's a bit rough admittedly, but not catastrophic... Ask Lyn and Larry or just about anyone who has gone further than a few miles from their homeport...

Be safe out there.

sten

Edited by - redviking on 07/20/2011 08:30:53

Steve Milby
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 08:44:27

Sten, I was on a full keel Triton 28 when about a 50' Sea Ray overtook us on the Severn River and very nearly rolled us so far with his wake as to put the mast in the water, and I'm sure his wake was less than 6' high. The capacity of a wave to roll a boat depends on not just it's height, but more so on it's shape.

I was on another Triton 28 in winds on the Chesapeake Bay measured at 55 kts and waves that I would estimate at 4-6', and those conditions sank a 40' trawler, and I have no doubt they would at least have swamped us if we lost engine propulsion and couldn't stay oriented to the waves.

4-6' waves aren't generally a particularly big deal, especially in deeper water, and most of us have or will sail in them. But, when you combine steep 4-6' waves with 70 kt microburst winds, and a boat that has no steerageway, a capsize is, in my mind, highly likely.

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redviking
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 08:51:11

But you didn't go over 'cuz you had a keel. Trawlers have windage and little keel most of the time, so does this POS...

2800 lbs. is a tad more than the ballast on a C25 with 10 feet LOA less. Not brilliant vessel design in my opinion.

[imghttp://www.sailingnetworks.com/boats/view_picture/5035?photo=576282[/img]

Edited by - redviking on 07/20/2011 09:05:14

Steve Milby
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 09:05:49

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking
 But you didn't go over. Trawlers have windage, so does this POS...

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redviking
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 09:20:00

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Steve Milby
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking
 But you didn't go over. Trawlers have windage, so does this POS...

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
We didn't get caught without steerageway and with our beam to the wind and waves, and we only got hit by 55 kt winds, not 70 kt winds. Nevertheless, even in 55 kt winds and 4-6' waves, we were in serious danger of capsizing, and were spared it because of the smart helmsmanship of our skipper.

Usually, a boat isn't put in jeopardy by the force of the wind alone, or the force of the waves alone. What matters is how the two forces combine at any particular moment, and whether the boat is oriented, at that particular moment, so as to ride out those conditions, or be overwhelmed by them.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Did the fact that the vessels you were on weighed more than a Datsun B210 have anything to do with it? They were not designed to be human ballasted vessels and probably had inboards. 35 footers typically do not depend on a 5 horse outboard and doing a race on such a vessel is unthinkable. I'm no marine engineer, but the idea is that monohulls roll back up. Had that happened, the skipper and first mate may have survived. Glad the Triton came back up as it was DESIGNED to do. Short chop can be tricky, winds in the 50-70 range can be too, but this incident still says wrong boat, wrong tactics.

Sailing is calculated risk. They calculated wrong. But hey, a J24 just sank in NY after catching the spinnaker and capsizing with it attached. I'm going with safety over speed and if I get caught with MY pants down you can tar and feather me too.

If the engine had failed on the Tartan 28, would you have capsized? If so, that changes my opinion of that particular vessel...

Edit: Capsize ratios can be calculated based on ballast, displacement, hull design, etc. My advice on a C25 in heavy weather is to drop everything and go below and put the hatchboards in. She should roll back up according to the numbers.

sten

Edited by - redviking on 07/20/2011 09:47:39

Steve Milby
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 09:47:09

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking:

If the engine had failed on the Tartan 28, would you have capsized? If so, that changes my opinion of that particular vessel...sten
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

The boat was a Triton 28, not a Tartan 28. Tritons have crossed the Atlantic and Pacific and have circumnavigated the world more than once. The Triton is a full keel boat that weighs about 8,000 lbs, as I recall. It's pretty difficult to quarrel with their record of long distance sailing.

We don't have to speculate on what would have happened if the Triton's engine failed, because, as it happened, another Triton was caught in the same storm that we were in, and his Atomic 4 engine quit, and he deployed his anchor and was able to get it down and to hold in the middle of one of the spans of the Chesapeake Bay Bridge. In my opinion, he was extremely lucky.

The wind was gusting and lulling in a rhythm. It would blow in what I would estimate to be the high 40s for about 7-8 minutes, and then it would gust to 55, or perhaps higher for about 7-8 minutes. In my opinion, the boat could probably cope with the waves during the lulls, if it was caught beam to the waves, but I was there, and I have no doubt the Triton would have been capsized by the much higher, steeper, more violent waves during the gusts. I can only guess that the other Triton must have lowered the anchor during a lull. Moreover, in those winds, we were all running downwind, and, if the engine quit, we wouldn't have lost steerageway for awhile, because there was enough wind to keep us moving downwind under bare poles. By contrast, the guys in the race boat were apparently dead in the water when the storm hit all at once.

If the Triton capsized, it would almost certainly have righted itself. The racer in question didn't right itself. I'm not saying the racer was equally seaworthy as the Triton. I'm saying that I believe the principal reason why it capsized was because it was caught beam-to the seas, without power or steerageway. If it had power or steerageway, the boat at least had a fighting chance to keep its keel down and its decks pointed upwards. If they could have avoided the capsize, they would likely have avoided the loss of life.

Edited by - Steve Milby on 07/20/2011 10:01:34

redviking
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 09:59:58

Agreed on all points... Sorry I wrote Triton once and then Tartan at another point. Brain fart. The Triton has the same blue water pedigree status as just about everything old school about design.

Steerage is a must unless you are just going to ride it out down below which carries its own risks. I agree that dropping all sails was not a good idea. Ultimately, since other boats sought safety and ran with it, their desire to not lose hard earned miles left them sorta like sitting ducks. I am sure the lessons to be learned will hopefully come out soon.

But after looking at Wingnuts - I still say, wrong boat, wrong place. Patrick Childress took a C27 around the world. Tania Aebi, Lyn and Larry, and countless others have done so on well found vessels and perhaps been knocked down, but survived when they came back up. Un safe at any speed. Would you put your 15 or 16 year old on that boat?

sten

PS - I'll do the Mac on a 35 Landfall....

Or an old IOR 39!

Edited by - redviking on 07/20/2011 10:02:33

PCP777
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 10:03:33

perhaps these odd wings are what kept her from self righting.....
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">One of the original sport boats built of Divinycell and Kevlar the boat is very light weight, but it's most unusual feature are it's wings. The hull is 8 foot wide but on deck the wings extend the width to 14'. The boat has been upgraded with the addition of a 12' carbon retractable bow sprit and a carbon mast and extended boom with a big roach main.

Two years after the Kiwi 35 was launched Michael Fay built a 135' version of the boat to race for the America's cup.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Edited by - PCP777 on 07/20/2011 10:03:51

DaveR
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 13:34:55

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">perhaps these odd wings are what kept her from self righting.....<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Absolutely the wings kept it from righting. Not much of a keel but with protrusions out the side like that it may not have mattered. That boat doesn't belong in more than a few feet of seas. But it was just bad luck that the two didn't survive. Wonder why they couldn't get unattached.

Edited by - on

redviking
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 14:08:03

Early reports indicate that the lost were the most experienced. Makes sense they would try to stay with the vessel as that is sorta their duty. Cap and spousal equivalent. Both were considered good sailors. Their final actions were probably to stay with vessel such that rescue was an option. We will never know, but we do know that everyone else jumped in based on the reports coming out. Or were able to un-clip. I will never like the boat. But I don't think a papermache vessel is a good idea for pretty much anything.

Sten

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Response Posted - 07/20/2011 : 19:53:03

I agree with Dave R... If the mast hits the water, the wings will probably give her negative stability, so she'll try to turtle (as she did).

If she didn't have suitable power, I'm thinking they might have tried to turn and run under a bare pole... With steep following seas, that can lead to a yaw across the face of a wave, and a broach. When a wave passes under the boat, for a moment the water moves with (and faster than) the boat, giving the rudder reverse steerage (helm to port, boat turns to starboard), to which the helmsman intuitively reacts in the wrong way. Then just as you end up abeam to the seas, the water reverses direction (it flows in a circular motion as waves go by), and helps broach the boat. Simple wave mechanics, but hard to learn to handle at the helm. It's why many sailors report that their boats are very "squirrely" in following seas. Long, full keels help by keeping the boat on track even when the helmsman is momentarily doing the wrong thing (which is almost impossible not to do).

By the way, my recollection is Lake Michigan is around 300' deep on average, with much deeper spots. Throwing out an anchor might not have done much unless they got within about a mile of the shore, and they could have been 40-50 miles from either shore.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 07/20/2011 20:03:26

redviking
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Response Posted - 07/21/2011 : 05:16:46

The official announcement from the Chicago Yacht Club states:

"A severe thunderstorm crossed Lake Michigan around midnight EDT last night. Windgusts were reported at 52 knots with waves of 4-6 feet.The Coast Guard was notified at 12:40 am via VHF radio by crew members from one of the competing boats "Sociable" that another of the competing boats, "WingNuts," had capsized in these severe conditions."

Note: Sociable is a Bendy toy 40.7 and it stayed upright. The wings, the ballast, everything about the boat contributed to this tragedy. Even enemies shouldn't let each other buy crappy boats! 355 boats and almost 3500 sailors competed this year and this race has lasted for 103 years or something like that with no casualties except for one heart attack victim that was not sailing related.

sten

Edited by - redviking on 07/21/2011 05:25:42

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Response Posted - 07/21/2011 : 06:45:34

Yup--sorta like doing the race on a big Hobie, although there appear to be three Corsairs on the list of 340+ entries, and one is only 25' (F-25).

The Chi-Mac is virtually an ocean race--without the long swells created by storms thousands of miles away, but potentially with big nasty stuff created by 100+ miles of fetch in a storm or frontal system. 6' is pretty big for Lake Michigan, but not huge, and you won't like it when you see it.

A few years ago, folks here discussed doing the Chi-Mac on a C-25... I don't recall whether anyone did, but I wouldn't. In a big blow, you'd probably survive, but you'd be "questioning your judgement!" ...especially when all the other boats (30s - 50s) would be over the horizon ahead of you.

At least Wingnuts, a [url="http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=1014"]Kiwi 35[/url], would be well up in the pack when she dumped. Poor O.H. Rogers now has the distinction of designing the only boat that produced fatalities on the Chi-Mac. Not his fault.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 07/21/2011 06:53:34

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 07/21/2011 : 07:28:41

I get Sail-World.com by email on a regular basis. Yesterday's edition has an article on the tragedy. One skipper and co-owner, Tim Profit, of the north American 40, Fast Tango, reported and included a photo of the laptop screen, that, after the wind spiked up very suddenly to around 60 kts, their anemometer recorded a 7 minute period where the wind pegged between the instrument's max reading of 100 kts and 90 kts. He stated that 100 kts is approx. 115 mph!

Edited by - dmpilc on 07/21/2011 07:30:07

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Response Posted - 07/21/2011 : 10:02:38

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dmpilc
 ...the north American 40, Fast Tango, reported and included a photo of the laptop screen, that, after the wind spiked up very suddenly to around 60 kts, their anemometer recorded a 7 minute period where the wind pegged between the instrument's max reading of 100 kts and 90 kts...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">...and the 17000 lb. N.A.40 with its 7900 lbs. of ballast was still standing (as was everyone else). I wonder if the conditions dramatically exceeded the capabilities of his wind instrument. (I don't mean the scale--I mean the function.) I think 100-knot winds would have taken some others out.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 07/21/2011 10:06:38

dlucier
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Response Posted - 07/21/2011 : 15:03:34

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Stinkpotter
 A few years ago, folks here discussed doing the Chi-Mac on a C-25... I don't recall whether anyone did, but I wouldn't.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

In 2001, Greg Jackson completed the Chicago to Mackinac on his C25, Compass Rose...Oh, and he did it singlehanded.

[url="https://www.youtube.com/user/moosetree87#p/a/u/0/R4Bc2oFPMH4"]2011 Chicago to Mackinac Realt na Mara[/url]

Edited by - dlucier on 07/21/2011 16:32:13

Dave5041
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Response Posted - 07/21/2011 : 20:31:42

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> I wonder if the conditions dramatically exceeded the capabilities of his wind instrument. (I don't mean the scale--I mean the function.) I think 100-knot winds would have taken some others out.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

My thought too. Recreational equipment is really not designed for extreme conditions, and dutiful display of numbers doesn't mean they are correct. No doubt there was plenty of wind, but 100 kts should have knocked a few others down.

Edited by - on

Ape-X
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Response Posted - 07/22/2011 : 04:34:48

Read in the Bay City news today: Confirmed it was head trauma to both sailors, which explains why they could not clip free from the boat harness. My heartfelt condolences to the close friends and family of the sailors lost. Prayers for a safe race for my buddy, and all crew sailing this week in the Huron - Mack race

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DaveR
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Response Posted - 07/22/2011 : 05:57:29

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> Confirmed it was head trauma to both sailors <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That would explain it. Condolences as well .........

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Response Posted - 11/09/2011 : 14:55:51

http://www.sailmagazine.com/racing/chicago-mac_panel_wingnuts_shouldnt_have_been_racing/

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delliottg
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Response Posted - 11/09/2011 : 15:08:18

Hah, you beat me to it, I was just going to post the results from the inquiry.

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aeckhart
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Response Posted - 11/10/2011 : 09:55:15

An early report indicated that the two who died where asleep below, where they were found, and that when the boat capsized, they were violently slammed against the bulkhead - thus the head trauma.

The report in Sail magazine on line noted that the wings may have contributed in the capsize by presenting a wide, flat surface to the wind as the boat was hit by a wave and went over, thus compromisinmg the designed "righting moment" of the hull. It's design righting moment was 107. When the wind hit the wing the righting moment dropped to 74.

I assume that when it finally turned over it could not right itself because of the wide flat surface created by the hull wings similar to a catamaran or tri.

Edited by - aeckhart on 11/10/2011 10:05:52

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