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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Exhaust leak in powerhead

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pfduffy
Captain

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USA
317 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/20/2012 : 15:01:59

So I brought my motor to the mechanic this past weekend to have him figure out why the cooling stream was so weak. Apparently, they are not busy because it was in the test tank this morning. Anyway, he called me to tell me that I have an exhaust leak through a corrosion hole in the power head. His advise is to not spend any more money on this motor.

Motor is a very old honda 8 - not sure of the year, but it is at least 20 years old. Apparently, there was a very large salt buildup inside. I try to flush it after using it but the flush seems ineffective. I don't think prior owner of the motor ever flushed with fresh water.

So I'm not even sure what questions I should be asking about this. I did not budget for a new motor this year and I am wondering if there is a way to make this limp along. Mechanic made it sound like a safety issue, particularly if I were to experience a fuel leak under the cowling.

Should I bite the bullet and buy a motor or should I try to do some sort of patch and get the thing to run another year? Sailing without a motor is not an option for me.

Pat Duffy
1984 SK/SR #4113
Slàinte

Edited by - on

JimGo
Admiral

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USA
962 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2012 : 15:17:22

Pat,
Sorry to hear about your engine. Will this work to tide you over?
http://cnj.craigslist.org/boa/2860933633.html

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2012 : 15:18:48

I've seen some good o/b options on ebay recently. If you do not need electric start and do not need to battle big waves, the Tohatsu/Nissan 6 hp sailmaster might interest you. Otherwise go with a 9.8 hp extra long shaft Tohatsu/Nissan/Mercury, Honda or Yamaha.

I'm not associated with this offering:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NISSAN-9-9-2-STROKE-XX-LONG-ELECTRIC-MANUAL-START-TILLER-/130648568727?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item1e6b42f397&vxp=mtr

Edited by - dmpilc on 02/20/2012 15:26:42

pfduffy
Captain

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USA
317 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2012 : 15:57:55

Jim - I've sent an email and will see what happens. David - thanks for the heads up!

Edited by - on

Tom Potter
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1913 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2012 : 16:01:50

You could try [url="http://jbweld.net/products/uses.php"]J.B. Weld[/url], it might hold you over a little while. I would not plan any long trips.

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2012 : 16:29:13

Or this one, An exhaust leak(burned a hole internally) through to the water jacket in the powerhead means you need a new powerhead.JB Weld ain't going to do it. Also if you use your engine to charge your batteries, Ask if the engine has a charge (alternator)system. Many do not.
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/bod/2859315457.html

Edited by - islander on 02/20/2012 16:47:20

Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2012 : 19:30:35

Keep an eye outon CL - as posted here, the engines will come up from time to time. You are waiting for someone who has screwed their lower end to come along so you buy their powerhead. Half an outboard is all you need. The two halves can be put together in your backyard.

Edited by - on

JimGo
Admiral

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USA
962 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2012 : 11:53:52

Pat,
I was poking around the Honda site and saw that they are having a sale right now with good financing deals. Thought I'd pass this along in case you decide not to fix your current engine or find a used replacement.

http://marine.honda.com/finance/details/sellabration

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2012 : 12:04:52

Just a reminder that Association members are eligible for a discount with Online Outboards. Makes the $22 membership dues seem real cheap.

Edited by - on

Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1181 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2012 : 14:43:41

You don't say if you were actually having problems with the outboard. If it is not overheating or allowing water into a cylinder I am not sure an exhaust leak is that big a deal. Where is the exhaust leaking to? Is he saying that is the reason you have reduced water stream? Don't understand how the two would be related. I would remove your intake manifold and clean your water passages before I popped for a new outboard.

Edited by - on

pfduffy
Captain

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USA
317 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 08:45:28

Joe - other than the weak cooling stream, the motor ran OK considering its age. I don't think it was overheating, but I'm not certain. The weak stream, however, was a change from prior years and had me a bit concerned. Mechanic indicated that there is alot of salt buildup in the water passages. I have not yet seen the exhaust leak, but he indicated that it was a safety concern. I am considering retrieving it from the mechanic and trying to get it to run well myself. If I screw it up, then I'm probably not too far off where I am now. But the question - is this truly a safety issue?

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 10:55:06

Safety issue? Like is it going to hurt you? I don't see how. The engine will run, The problem is when you shut the engine off you run the risk of hydrolocking the engine. (Water running back into the cylinder,). This will probably happen when you tilt the engine. So If you want to use it this way for a while I would recommend just raising the engine but Not tilting it. In the mean time keep looking for a replacement cuz this one can stop working anytime. The weak stream is because some of the cooling water is going out the hole into the exhaust creating less back pressure in the water jackets.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> I would remove your intake manifold and clean your water passages <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I guess you could do this if you want to clean the Gas/Air mixture passageways but you won't find any water jacket there. Try the head and block.

Edited by - islander on 02/23/2012 11:47:04

panhead1948
Captain

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345 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 11:50:51

I would check with another dealer. I had a Honda dealer tell me my engine was to old to get parts for. I talked to another dealer and he said part were not a problem. He told me to give hin a call in Feb. as they are slow and have a discount on labot. He installed a new impeller, cleaded the carb, change oil,new plugs and tuned it up 310 dollars. I may have to drive a little farther but it is worth it.

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 12:32:08

The problem here isn't getting the parts, What he needs are very expensive just to buy let alone the labor for what basically would be an engine re-build. The cylinder head alone is @ $480 online.The mechanic would charge more.

Edited by - islander on 02/23/2012 12:33:59

Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1181 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 12:52:14

<s>Scott</s>, Pat,
Is your weak water flow based on how your indicator stream is flowing or overall water being expelled through the lower end? The indicator stream on my 96 came through passages which are engraved into the intake manifold. These passages are not indicative of how your main water passages are flowing. Totally independent. When I removed the manifold I was able to use a dremel tool to clean the passages out and also inspect the thermostat. These are tasks you could do yourself and require no special tools or knowledge. I think your thought that you might want to investigate further by yourself is a reasonable approach given the alternative of buying another engine. I ran mine for two years with no overheating before I realized there was suppose to be an indicator stream. Mine was completely plugged. I think the only safety issue to consider is if you are out motoring and the engine fails. For some that is a minor inconvenience. For others a major catastrophe.

Edited by - Sloop Smitten on 02/23/2012 14:40:39

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 13:42:52

Joe This is Pats problem, Not mine (Scott)

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islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 16:26:00

This is what salt build up/blockage looks like. The water passages around the cylinder bores are almost fully blocked. I don't think a dremel is going to reach these areas. This is a Honda 1996 9.9.

Edited by - on

JimGo
Admiral

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USA
962 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 22:17:49

Scott, what's the width of the water passage? It looks to be pretty wide. I bet a [URL="http://www.wayfair.com/Dremel-1-2-60-Grit-Trio%99-Mandrel-and-Sanding-Band-TR407-TR407-OEO1541.html?refid=GPA49-OEO1541&gclid=CLegqfnsta4CFYXe4AodqAmLpQ"]1/2" dremel sanding drum[/URL] or even a [URL="http://www.toolup.com/dremel_430_14-sanding-drum.aspx?gclid=CKWuv_zsta4CFQff4Aod8gGKqA"] 1/4" sanding drum [/URL] would fit in there. If the bit lenght is a problem, you could always chuck the bit in something like a [URL="http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&gs_nf=1&cp=11&gs_id=15&xhr=t&q=drill+bit+extension&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1366&bih=644&wrapid=tljp1330060491806020&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=5126564186558777329&sa=X&ei=xRxHT5jNKcXZ0QGn_smhDg&sqi=2&ved=0CHgQ8gIwAA#"]drill bit extender[/URL] and use a drill instead. Of course, you'll want to be as careful as possible in cleaning it out so you don't remove anything but salt.

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2012 : 06:52:59

Sure you can clean the water jackets with the engine completely disassembled but as in Pats case a mechanic would charge him way more than what the engine is worth. My other point to Joe's suggestion on using a Dremel was that a Dremel going through the thermostat housing is just not going to get to these areas of the engine.

Edited by - on

Ape-X
Admiral

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USA
662 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2012 : 07:14:51

ultrasonic parts cleaner? reassemble, and acid flush?

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2012 : 07:37:15

Those will work, Flushing the engine with Salt X or something similar can prevent or slow the accumulation. I've heard that running Vinegar through the engine will dissolve the deposits also, I guess its the acid in the vinegar.

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Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1181 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2012 : 09:32:28

If you re-read my suggestion it had nothing to do with the combustion chamber cooling jacket.

Edited by - Sloop Smitten on 02/24/2012 09:32:50

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