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GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/18/2012 : 20:57:13

The lease on my current 10' X 30' slip expires at the end of May. When I checked on signing a new lease they said there would be no rate increase this year. I'm currently paying $220/mth.

Last year they built some new I believe 14 X 40 or 16 x 40 slips. I checked at the time and the cost was prohibitive.

Just for grins I checked with them when discussing signing a new lease and they just so happen to have a special going on these new slips because they haven't been able to fill all the slips (I'd say there are at least 50 slips that are empty).

If I sign a one year lease I can get into one of the new slips of my choice for $268/mth.

Here are the pros and cons of each:

Old Slip Pros - Very close to the parking lot - 150' feet maybe. The slips are approx. 12' below the surrounding grade and surrounded on three sides by tall trees and condos. Even during violent storms the water never gets choppy. It's very quiet and landscaped very nice.

Old Slip Cons - It's much warmer than the just outside the marina. There is almost no air movement in the summer. It's at least 5 minutes farther to motor. There is one restroom that has a shower. It is very clean but you sometimes you have to wait in line to use it (rarely). The docks are old and wooden. The decking is uneven and my wife had to have surgery one time to remove a splinter from between her toes. The poles were tall enough during Ike and the docks held up OK but they are old and wooden. I have a 10' wide slip with a finger on only one side so I have to share the slip with another boat. There's maybe 2' between our boats. Having one finger means my boat rubs against the fenders about half the year.

New Slip Pros - There is more wind and it's much cooler because you're farther from shore. The docks are new, have Trex decking that is level and free of splinters and the docks float on very tall poles. The slip is either 12 or 14' wide and I have a finger on both sides so no more sharing and plenty of room to remain away from the dock. There is a much nicer and larger restroom and shower facility. There is a very nice swimming pool with picnic tables and bar-b-que pits. I get a dock box. I've already met a couple of my new dock mates if I do move. I would have a C250 in the next slip if I choose one of the available slips. My wife gave the thumbs up right away.

New Slip Cons - Cost more per month. I have to walk farther to the slip although not much if I choose a couple of the slips. Only problem with those is there are a couple of large cruisers that block some of the wind. I will have to purchase a $150 power cord adapter to convert from 50 amp to 30 amp. My wife already let me know she's going to spend more money on the kids and grand-kids which is probably only fair.

So I can't make up my mind what to do. Any suggestions?

Association Member

GaryB
Andiamo
'89 SR/WK #5862
Kemah,TX

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 05/18/2012 : 21:49:23

First, barefoot on the wooden planks is asking for trouble, Buy your wife some shoes.

Why might you need a 40' slip for a 25' boat?

The selling point for me would be the cooler temps and the better facilities.

Is the "Special" price for a limited time or can you expect a substantial increase next year when you've fallen in love with the new location?

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3462 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2012 : 04:50:00

Gary - Well, looking at the annual cost ($576 difference between old and new to a total of $3216 but including electric)..it is a lot of dough.....But going with the new - You would be helping the economy !

IF YOU are leaning toward the new and need more reasons to justify the extra cost, then consider you are paying a significant amount right now for an old dock that has negatives concerning some creature comforts, some of which are safety/health related. The new dock expands the reasons for just being on the dock when not sailing - It will be cooler and more desireable to just be there. That may add up to increased usage which then drives your annual cost down per boat use day. Also, if you factor another potential injury at the old dock into the equation by your immediate family or a guest...then this would also help tip your scales toward the new dock.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2012 : 06:47:11

Back in October, I moved my boat from my first marina to it's current spot. It was definitely an upgrade....larger slip, nicer marina, better facilities, more active community, less motoring time to get under sail. I am very happy with the move; it has increased my enjoyment of the boat.

Only you can answer your question. I'm of the opinion that anything you can do to increase your enjoyment and usage is worthwhile....as long as you can afford it.

Jumping up to a 14x40....nice!! I went from a 10x20 to a 13x30. See about making a patio on the new slip....a 14x10 patio would be nice to have....back in....tie up... have some patio furniture, a BBQ....covered or an umbrella.....that's the ticket.

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2012 : 06:57:29

I would have a C250 in the next slip if I choose one of the available slips.

Priceless. Make the move.

Really, if you can afford it the new slips seem better in every way. I would be especially appreciative of the wind/cool at the new slips plus I would love to have a slip without another boat alongside. The pool and facilities seem better for the family and that is important too.

Most important - My wife gave the thumbs up right away.

End of story.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2012 : 07:39:19

First, me wife had dress sandals on. Second, this was a large sliver of dried wood sticking up as you would see on an old deck where the wood has dried out. Third, it was partially her fault because she kept shuffling her feet instead of walking which I had warned her about several different times.

I have to admit I'm leaning towards the move. It's been blistering hot where my current slip is because there's almost no breeze at the dock. The 3 or 4 times I came down last summer it was significantly cooler just outside the marina where there was a breeze but I couldn't take the heat getting the boat ready to go or put away. I just stayed at home in the AC.

As mentioned my main reason for wanting to move is it would definitely be cooler. In one of the slips the boat would be parallel to the prevailing summer breeze and it would blow right through the boat. My only concern with this slip is I don't have a real strong reverse with my motor and I'm afraid there might be times I couldn't back out of the slip.

In the other slips the breeze would be more across the slip but I wouldn't have to worry about backing out. Either way the temperature would be lower because the breeze will be traveling a long distance across water vs the 150' or so it travels from shore now.

When I first bought my boat it was over in the same area of the marina but Ike wiped the old fixed docks out (they've since reinforced and raised the bulkheads plus I have a trailer now). My wife really liked the pool area and has indicated she'd be more likely to come down to the boat. When I mentioned the option of moving she jumped on it despite the increased cost.

I have electric now but it is extra and would be at the new slip. The most I've ever paid for a months electricity was something like $2.00

My rationalization/offset for the increased cost is I currently have XM Satellite Weather on my GPS and it's costing approx. $43/mth. I rarely use it because it almost never rains anymore around here (drought). I also now have a mobile hotspot and a small laptop that I can get my weather radar on so I really don't need the XM anymore. Dropping the XM weather will almost completely offset the difference in slip fees.

There is no guarantee they will discount the slip next year but there is also no guarantee I won't get a raise or lose interest in the boat by next year.

BTW... my other option was to pull the boat during the summer months and work on it while it is hot. Completely eliminating the slip fees.

PS - I'm at the boat right now and there's a boat 2 slips over with a 3 x 5 flag flying almost straight out (10 mph?) at the spreaders. In my cockpit there is an almost imperceptable breeze and the water is like a mirror.

Edited by - GaryB on 05/19/2012 07:56:51

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2012 : 17:30:59

Spent the day trying out new slips. Finally settled on the first one I thought I wanted. It's next to a C250 named Knot Guilty. I spoke to the owner for a few minutes. He's aware of this forum.

It is definitely cooler out at the new slip. I went back to my old slip to retrieve my lines and power cord around noon and it was very warm in the inner marina. At the new slip there was a nice breeze all afternoon and it "felt" at least 10 degrees cooler. So far I'm happy with my decision but only time will tell.

I spoke to the marina manager and she advised these slips are normally $380/mth but they are trying to fill these new slips which is why they are running the special. She advised unless there's a miracle and they fill up all the slips the rates will remain where they are now. The rate is actually 263/mth not $268. With the current slump in boating she said they will probably never fill up all of the slips while she's around.

My thought is that I may move back inside during the winter months when it's cooler and I should be able to save some money over the course of the year so the total increase in fees will not be as much.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2012 : 17:31:44

Damn...$43 a month? Is that for XM Weather alone or with a channel plan?

I think I pay about $150 a year for Sirius in the Jeep....I have a Garmin Zumo 550 on my bike and was thinking about getting an XM puck for it so I could have XM Weather radar overlays....and XM channels too....but $43 a month....

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2012 : 20:55:57

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 First, me wife had dress sandals on. Second, this was a large sliver of dried wood sticking up as you would see on an old deck where the wood has dried out. Third, it was partially her fault because she kept shuffling her feet instead of walking which I had warned her about several different times.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Sorry Gary, Just yanking your chain a little.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2012 : 22:05:18

John - I knew you were. I was just getting you back a little plus I didn't want anyone thinking I wasn't taking care of my wife.

Joe - I think I have the Sailor Package plus a channel plan -->> http://www.xmwxweather.com/marine/data-service-pricing.php It works great on my Garmin GPSMAP378. It's saved my tail a couple of times on the bay and numerous times in the car.

I have two ways I can come & go to work. Just last week I was able to use it to select which way I went home. If I'd gone my normal route I'd have been in heavy rain almost all the way home. By going the other route I was able to avoid all but a couple of light sprinkles. I could have used the laptop and hotspot to do the same thing.

I almost never listen to the XM radio and I've been wasting 8 or 10 dolars a month just on that. I'm bad about signing up for stuff that I end up never using and then never getting around to cancelling it.

As I said above, I now have a 12" laptop and a Verizon 4G mobile hotspot. This setup gives me a bigger screen to look at and I can couple that with my $7.95/mth subscription to Weathertap which gives me higher resolution weather radar and many more features including lightning displays. Having both the hotspot and the XM Weather is an unnecessary expense and I've been planning on cancelling the XM for awhile. I just keep forgetting to do it.

Weathertap is the way to go. It has so many more features for a fraction of the cost of the XM weather. Works great on the desktop, laptop, and they have a mobile app. Of course you can get a lot of the same features for free from NOAA but it's more cumbersome to use.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2012 : 06:46:45

I would only want the NEXRAD overlays on my map view....and I'm very mindful of the weather so it's rare that I'll be out weaving the storms on the bike. Now, I just stop every so often and check the radar on my iPhone....do the same on the boat if there's weather in the area or approaching the area, plus I have a Midland Weather Radio onboard programmed with local SAME codes.

I'll check out Weathertap....never heard of it.

I've had satellite radio for almost 10 years now in various vehicles. It's all I listen to, unless I'm on my way home from a Stars game, then I pop over to AM and The Ticket to listen to a game recap and commentary. I hate commercials and trying to listen to FM broadcast stations is irritating to me now. Plus, no station fade when traveling....I always have my channels with me.

Sorry for the hijack Gary....congrats on the move to the new slip!

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/20/2012 : 07:20:03

John - I forgot to answer your question on the need for a 40' slip. I don't need a 40' slip but that's all they built out where there is wind. I'm thinking they thought they could attract the bigger boats and slowly push the little guys out. More income on the same real estate. I think they forgot there are a lot more of us little guys out here than there are big guys.

Joe - The Nexrad radar is why I got the XM weather for the GPS. I rarely listen to the radio anymore and I live and boat in the same area so my channels go wherever I go too. I like listening to new stations when I travel. Makes me forget about hometown and enhances the feeling of being away.

Unlike some others, I don't care if I get hijacked. I just love talking boats and airplanes and it doesn't matter to me if it's in a separate post or not. I do understand it makes it easier to look something up later though.

Edited by - on

dolivaw
Navigator

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USA
109 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2012 : 19:27:34

Hey Gary... You have a new neighbor!

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2012 : 19:29:51

quote]Originally posted by dolivaw
 Hey Gary... You have a new neighbor!
[/quote]
Where are you?

Edited by - on

dolivaw
Navigator

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USA
109 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2012 : 19:51:29

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 quote]Originally posted by dolivaw
 Hey Gary... You have a new neighbor!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Where are you?
[/quote]
Slip 9-4.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2012 : 20:30:27

So now there are two C25's and a C250 in a row? Sweet!

Is my boat still centered in the slip? I was in a hurry when I left the other day?

I'm still not sure if I'm going to stay out where there's wind or go back to my old slip and save the money. I'm supposed to let Pauline know this weekend.

Edited by - GaryB on 05/21/2012 20:36:12

dolivaw
Navigator

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USA
109 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2012 : 20:51:07

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 So now there are two C25's and a C250 in a row? Sweet!

Is my boat still centered in the slip? I was in a hurry when I left the other day?

I'm still not sure if I'm going to stay out where there's wind or go back to my old slip and save the money. I'm supposed to let Pauline know this weekend.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Everything looked good to me.

I took a look at your old slip too & you're right, it's a sauna down in there.

I'm loving the new slips... The wide finger piers on both sides are nice. I'm not sure I understand the power though. We picked up the $150 pigtail @ WM. It fits one of the two connections on the dock, so we can plug our 30A cord into the 50A outlet, but what does 120/208v mean?

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2012 : 21:21:26

I picked up the pigtail too but never got a chance to hook it up. I think some of the bigger boats may have some 208/220 volt appliances but I'm not really sure.

Where were you before and when did you move in?

BTW.. Do you know anyone in the area that could restitch my mainsail cover? Any idea how much they might charge?

Edited by - GaryB on 05/22/2012 05:17:54

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2012 : 21:36:13

Might be careful to check your line voltage before you plug anything in. If you've got a 208 VAC service, you could do some real damage to your AC equipment.

Edited by - on

dolivaw
Navigator

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USA
109 Posts

Response Posted - 05/21/2012 : 21:53:45

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 I picked up the pigtail too but never got a chance to hook it up. I think some of the bigger boats may have some 208/220 volt appliances but I'm not really sure.

Where were you before and when did you move in?

BTW.. Do you anyone in the area that could restitch my mainsail cover? Any idea how much they might charge?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

We were on pier 6. Had to get out of there though... Those old piers are getting scary. We packed it up and moved next to you this evening.

I plugged the boat in for a few minutes & didn't trip the breaker, so I'm guessing it's probably ok. I'll have to dig out some books and try to figure out how it can be both 120 & 208. Makes no sense to me. For now I cut off the breakers at the dock.

I don't know anyone that can mend a sail cover, although we're about to attempt to fixing one for ourselves.

Edited by - dolivaw on 05/21/2012 21:58:02

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2012 : 05:27:17

The Dock Power Pedestals on the new docks has 50 Amp/125 volt service and 50 Amp/125/250 volt service. The male end of the pigtails are different. The first has one leg that has an out-turned prong and the second one has two out-turned prongs.

We need to use the 50 Amp/125 volt service. In the diagram below I purchased a Part #110A.

Scroll down and look at the diagram of the plug configurations for each -->> http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/WestAdvisorView?langId=-1&storeId=11151&catalogId=10001&page=Shore-Power

Edited by - GaryB on 05/22/2012 05:35:28

dolivaw
Navigator

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USA
109 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2012 : 10:39:35

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 The Dock Power Pedestals on the new docks has 50 Amp/125 volt service and 50 Amp/125/250 volt service. The male end of the pigtails are different. The first has one leg that has an out-turned prong and the second one has two out-turned prongs.

We need to use the 50 Amp/125 volt service. In the diagram below I purchased a Part #110A.

Scroll down and look at the diagram of the plug configurations for each -->> http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/WestAdvisorView?langId=-1&storeId=11151&catalogId=10001&page=Shore-Power
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I think I found a pretty good explanation of what the 120/208 connection is and why it works for both 120v and 208v...

http://www.askmehelpdesk.com/electrical-lighting/whats-difference-between-120-volt-120-208-volt-system-421369.html

Basically, the 120/208v connector in the dock pedestal has two hot 120v wires, one neutral, and ground on the plug case instead of a prong. The pigtail simply uses one 120v line, the neutral and ground. The other 120v isn't connected through the pigtail.

The pigtail is labelled 50A 125/250v Plug (Shore) and 30A 125v connector (Boat). http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=1004534&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50523&subdeptNum=50524&classNum=50526

Edited by - dolivaw on 05/22/2012 10:40:22

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2012 : 14:45:39

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dolivaw
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 The Dock Power Pedestals on the new docks has 50 Amp/125 volt service and 50 Amp/125/250 volt service. The male end of the pigtails are different. The first has one leg that has an out-turned prong and the second one has two out-turned prongs.

We need to use the 50 Amp/125 volt service. In the diagram below I purchased a Part #110A.

Scroll down and look at the diagram of the plug configurations for each -->> http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/WestAdvisorView?langId=-1&storeId=11151&catalogId=10001&page=Shore-Power
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I think I found a pretty good explanation of what the 120/208 connection is and why it works for both 120v and 208v...

http://www.askmehelpdesk.com/electrical-lighting/whats-difference-between-120-volt-120-208-volt-system-421369.html

Basically, the 120/208v connector in the dock pedestal has two hot 120v wires, one neutral, and ground on the plug case instead of a prong. The pigtail simply uses one 120v line, the neutral and ground. The other 120v isn't connected through the pigtail.

The pigtail is labelled 50A 125/250v Plug (Shore) and 30A 125v connector (Boat). http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=1004534&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50523&subdeptNum=50524&classNum=50526
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
The Part #110A I mentioned above is the same as the Marinco EEL P504-30 you and I bought.

Edited by - on

dolivaw
Navigator

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USA
109 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2012 : 20:37:50

Gary... Went out to the boat today... Andiamo is centered in her slip. Watch that first step. =)

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/22/2012 : 21:02:12

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dolivaw
 Gary... Went out to the boat today... Andiamo is centered in her slip. Watch that first step. =)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Thanks Ron!

Edited by - on

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