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Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1775 Posts

Initially Posted - 01/09/2003 : 18:04:04

Hi everyone,

The last few times I've been out sailing I've had a downwind shot back to the marina, so I experimented a bit with the wing and wing configuration. Every time I tried wing and wing, it just seemed awkward. What is the best way to get into wing and wing, and once you've got the configuration, how do you make the most of it?

Thanks for the help!

Buzz Maring, C-25 SK/SR #68, "Freya"
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3df23b3127cce9306a9b3abad0000001010" border=0>

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/09/2003 : 18:33:06

I generally start by sailing off the wind to one side. The outhaul and halyard are eased to allow a fuller sail, the mainsheet is let out and the vang tensioned to keep the boom from rising. Before going directly downwind and putting the genoa on the opposite side, I rig a preventer on the boom to keep it from doing bad things. Once the main is taken care of, I turn the boat to get the genoa on the other side and set the jib sheet. Although I don't have one, you could pole out the genoa to get a full headsail. At this point you just have to keep an eye to the sails, wind, and the waves to remain at the optimum orientation to the wind.

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
Cradled on the hard, 200ft from Lake Erie

Edited by - on

Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 01/09/2003 : 19:35:06

I made a realy nice twist lock pole for about $35. I bought a wisker pole ends kit. Cut the rubber handle end off of a 3 section twist lock docking pole ans assembled the two. Same size and fit as a more expensive wisker pole. Works great under light down wind conditions. In addition when I start to set up for downwind I set up with bot the Gen and main on one side. When Im dead down wind I reach up and throw the boom over and control its movment outboard with the main sheet. If you dont want to rig a preventer you can uncleat your boom vang and cleat it to a blank jib tract car. Works neet but that set up is if you going down wind for a loooooong time. Its also a bit more labor intensive.

Doug&Ruth
Triska (Alberg 29)
Tacoma Wa.

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3324 Posts

Response Posted - 01/09/2003 : 20:22:59

Buzz - with the constantly shifting winds on Canyon Lake it is most difficult to run wing & wing. The best answer is a correctly sized whisker pole. Both my crewmembers are excellent helmsmen in their own right, and coming back from racing I'll often challenge them to go wing and wing - if they can go 100 yards without luffing the genoa they are doing very well! At the coast, with steady winds, it's not a difficult task.
Derek

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1775 Posts

Response Posted - 01/09/2003 : 21:21:57

Thanks Don & Doug for the tips. I suspect there are almost as many techniques for setting up and maintaining wing and wing as there are sailors who post on this Forum ... I hope we get to hear some more.

Derek ... that makes perfect sense. I suppose if there's one thing I've learned while sailing on Canyon Lake (other than to avoid a couple of places where I'm likely to run aground <img src=icon_smile_blush.gif border=0 align=middle> ) it's that the winds are REALLY variable.

I have a whisker pole that I've never tried to use ... I might give it a shot sometime when I've got someone sailing with me ... there's no way I'm going to fool with it while single-handing. BTW Derek, there is a black nylon(?) eye on the front of my mast that I assume is made for hooking one end of the whisker pole into ... it is cracked ... would you mind looking at it sometime? I think I should probably replace it before I try to use the whisker pole, and I'd appreciate your advice.

Thanks everyone!

Buzz Maring, C-25 SK/SR #68, "Freya"
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3df23b3127cce9306a9b3abad0000001010" border=0>

Edited by - on

osmepneo
Past Commodore

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USA
1420 Posts

Response Posted - 01/09/2003 : 21:22:07

Buzz,

The most difficult part of sailing dead down wind (the only time you'd think of going wing-wing) is keeping the genny full. Like Derek said, a 100 yards is good! The use of a whisker pole helps keep the genny out and fully exposed to the wind.

I suspect that sailing down wind, wing and wing is not the fastest way to get where you are going. Normally, a broad reach will be faster, and even though further, it will be faster than sailing dead down wind. I suspect it has somethiong to do with the wind pushing dead down wind, vs. achieving some lift on a broad reach.

the question for me is how brad a reach is best for a given set of conditions.

Don Peet
c25, 1665, osmepneo, sr/wk
The Great Sacandaga Lake, NY

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3324 Posts

Response Posted - 01/09/2003 : 23:30:53

Don - dead down wind is indeed the slowest point of sail, and even with the genoa poled-out we keep the wind over the corner of the transom. (If you have a windex, the point of the arrow should be over the windward tab). I think that this is more downwind than a broad reach, but it seems to give the best results. (One time my foredeck crew dropped the pole overboard...bummer! On the next two downwind legs we broad reached, jibing back and forth across the rhumb line - and still won!) BTW - a SCUBA friend dove and retrieved the pole the next day <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>
Derek
P.S. Buzz - I'll be glad to!

Edited by - on

Bryan Beamer
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1038 Posts

Response Posted - 01/09/2003 : 23:35:32

The heavier the wind the easier it is to keep the jib full but the more deadly the boom can be if it jibes. We were wing & wing pushing 5 to 5.5 knots for 2 miles last Sunday with a reefed main and 110% head sail in about 13-18 knot winds. We didn't set the wisker pole. I personally like wing & wing. It's a challenge to keep the jib full without a pole.

I will turn down wind get the main where I want it, then pull the jib to the other side. If you have a wind direction indicator on top of the mast, make it point to the boom side of downwind, not directly behind you but off to the boom side just slightly. That will help keep the jib full and the boom won't jibe on you.

Bryan Beamer
Daylight Again
C250wk #495

Edited by - on

Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 07:25:12

<img src=icon_smile_blush.gif border=0 align=middle> Ok, I'm going to show everyone how "novice" I am, but I'm intrigued by this "wing and wing". I have never heard of this, nor do I know what a "wisker pole" is. I could follow everything else, I think, that was talked about in this thread. Is there a book and website that explains some of these things?

To give you some backround, I've only been sailing for five years, teaching myself. I bought a bunch of books, even Sailing for Dummies, but I still don't understand a lot of what is talked about on this board.<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Thanks!

Ben
Adventurous
#5553
C25 SR/SK

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Bill Holcomb
Admiral

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USA
769 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 08:34:21

Hey Ben,

Wing 'n wing means that the mainsail is set out to one side of your boat and the jib or genny is set out to the other side. This only works if you're sailing dead downwind. If the wind switches a little to one side or the other, it will affect one sail and that sail will try to move over to the other side of the boat - causing a jibe in the case of the mainsail or a luffing genny in the other case. A whisker pole is a pole that is somewhere between 8 and 15 feet long. The pole generally has "hooks" or "jaws" on both ends. One end of the pole attaches to a ring that you have riveted or fastened with screws to the mast about 4' up from the deck. The other end of the pole is fastened either to the clew corner of your jib or to your jib sheet near the clew corner. The whisker pole holds the jib out so that the trailing wind pushes the sail without the sail flapping and luffing.

Now if you all are interested in sailing downwind in light breezes of say 5 to 12 kts or so, try dousing the mainsail altogether. Furl it on the boom. Now, set your genny on one side with your whisker pole and fly your cruising spinnaker on the other side. The two sails really pull the boat downwind; and you hardly have to steer at all since all of the sail power is on the bow holding your course quite steady. To do this, you usually want to be able to (1) count on a fairly steady breeze so that you don't go meandering all over, and (2) have several miles that you will enjoy this trip - since to point of sail means taking the chute down and hoisting the mainsail again. There is a photo of me 'n Snickerdoodle doing this in the photos section of the website. The two sails are my cruising spinnaker and my 150% drifter genny.

http://c25c250.best.vwh.net/snickd2.jpg

If the wind is stronger, you can use a 135% genny with a 110% jib and get similar results. Set the genny flying by not hanking it on the forestay and use the whisker pole on the 110% jib.

Bill Holcomb - C25 Snickerdoodle #4839

Edited by - on

Carl B.
1st Mate

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USA
83 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 08:44:22

I'm confused
"we keep the wind over the corner of the transom.(If you have a windex, the point of the arrow should be over the windward tab)."

"If you have a wind direction indicator on top of the mast, make it point to the boom side of downwind, not directly behind you but off to the boom side just slightly."

"OBLIVIOUS" C25 '82 #3098 SR/FK/Trad

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Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2984 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 08:45:50

Ben, I had a friend that took an introductory course to sailing and after only a short while into the course asked, "Would it be possible to speak English here". Sailing indeed has a language of its own... and like building a house, its one board at a time.

Wing and wing is when the main and jib are set on opposite sides of the mast. Only used for downwind sailing

A whisker pole is used to hold the clew of the jib outward and therefore keep the jib shaped to receive aft winds. Only used for offwind sailing in light to moderate winds. It is extendable and cleats to the active jib sheet on one end and an eye on the mast a couple of feet or so above the deck on the other end. It rides the sheet out to the clew of the jib and is extended to provide the desired sail shape.

Arlyn C-250 W/B #224
R&R N/E Texas and Great Lakes

[url="http://www.cox-internet.com/arlynstewart/"]Arlyn's C250 Mods n Cruisin Stories[/url]

Edited by - on

Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 08:55:55

Thanks Bill and Arlyn, that clears it up for me. I have been able to wing and wing before while on my Cal 21. It didn't last long though. I was afraid I'd jibe really hard, so I re-positioned my boat.

Bill, you have some really nice looking sails. Mine are plain white. The Capri 14.2 that I started with had very colorful sails. I loved that boat.

Thanks again,

Ben
Adventurous
#5553
C25 SR/SK

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aeckhart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1709 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 09:12:20

[quote]
"The heavier the wind the easier it is to keep the jib full but the more deadly the boom can be if it jibes. We were wing & wing pushing 5 to 5.5 knots for 2 miles last Sunday with a reefed main and 110% head sail in about 13-18 knot winds. We didn't set the wisker pole. I personally like wing & wing. It's a challenge to keep the jib full without a pole".

Bryan,

I also enjoy down wind sailing wing-on-wing. One particular day to remember was a 20 mile run with 15+ MPH winds using a cruising spinnaker. We sailed for 3 1/2 hours surfing down 3 foot waves doing 12 1/2 knots. I was pulling a 8' Zodiac to boot. It was, to say the least, the finest afternoon I've had in 15 years of sailing.

Al
GALLIVANT #5801

Edited by - aeckhart on 01/10/2003 09:13:41

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3324 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 10:13:59

Carl - I was also confused when I read Bryan's post, but after much thought realized we both mean the same thing. Keeping the wind over the corner of the transom means that the arrow on the windex will be over the windward tab or that the tab on the end of the arrow (not the tip) will point to the boom side of the boat. (If you keep checking this position it ensures that you don't sail by the lee which can lead to an accidental jibe). BTW - if you practice running wing-on-wing (w/out a pole) it will give you a real "feel" for the helm.
Derek

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5937 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 12:13:44

As Arlyn said, wing and wing is when the mainsail and jib are set on opposite sides of the boat. Therefore, in order to sail wing and wing, you have to gybe one of your sails – either the mainsail or the jib – to get it onto the opposite side from the other sail. Whether you gybe the mainsail or the jib depends upon the tack on which you are presently sailing (starboard or port), and the tack (starboard or port) on which you will be sailing after the boat is brought onto the wing and wing course. In other words, after you bring the boat onto the wing and wing course, will the wind be coming over the port corner of the transom (port tack), or over the starboard corner of the transom (starboard tack).

If, for example, you are presently sailing on starboard tack, and you will still be on starboard tack when you are sailing wing and wing, then you have to gybe the jib.

If I need to gybe the jib, I use the method described by Bryan Beamer. He turns the boat downwind and pulls the jib over to the other side.

If you are presently sailing on starboard tack, and your stern will cross the eye of the wind, so that you will be on port tack when you are sailing wing and wing, then you have to gybe the mainsail.

If I need to gybe the mainsail, I use two methods to put the boat on wing and wing, depending on how hard the wind is blowing. In light or moderate wind, I turn the boat downwind until the stern passes across the eye of the wind. Then I reach up and grab the mainsheet, and throw the boom over to the opposite side. In heavy air, I pull the mainsheet in tight, turn the boat downwind, and, when the mainsail passes across the eye of the wind and the wind blows on the opposite side of the mainsail, then I quickly let the mainsheet out.

When sailing wing and wing in light or moderate wind, you need to hold the jib out with a whisker pole, in order to keep the jib from collapsing. In strong wind, you can sail wing and wing without using a whisker pole, and without losing much speed. The strong wind keeps the sail from collapsing. One advantage of sailing downwind without a whisker pole in moderate to somewhat strong winds is that, when the wind shifts, you can tack the boat downwind very quickly, if you don’t have to unclip and reset the whisker pole.

If you want to tack the boat downwind, you steer the boat onto the new course. While doing so, you grab the mainsheet, and throw the boom over to the opposite side. At the same time, your crew pulls the jib over to the opposite side. If you do it just right, both sails fill and start drawing very quickly.

I would never use a preventer to prevent the boom from gybing in strong winds. If your mainsail gets backwinded in strong wind, while the boom is held down by a preventer, all hell breaks loose. When sailing wing and wing, I warn my crew to be constantly aware of the possibility of a gybe, and keep their heads down, and I concentrate on steering the boat carefully, to avoid the possibility of an unintentional gybe. In light air, I use crew weight to heel the boat slightly to leeward, which causes the outboard end of the boom to dip down closer to the water, and reduces the likelihood of a gybe. I would only use a preventer in very light air, while cruising, and when short on crew.

Ben, there is only a risk of gybing really hard when sailing wing and wing if the wind is blowing hard. An unintentional gybe in strong wind presents a risk of injury to crew and damage to the boat. When you are learning to sail wing and wing, practice it in winds of less than about 10 mph. If you keep your head down and keep tension on your boom vang, an unintentional gybe in wind of that strength isn’t likely to harm anything. With practice, your fear of gybing will diminish, and your self-confidence will increase.

Steve Milby "Captiva Wind" C-25 T/FK #2554

Edited by - Steve Milby on 01/10/2003 17:02:07

Edited by - on

jellyfish
Navigator

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USA
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Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 12:17:38

I have always found the best way to run dead down wind is to set the old iron genny in motion while flying jib only! of course Im a very lazy cruz'n type sailor!<img src=icon_smile_cool.gif border=0 align=middle>

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Bryan Beamer
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 12:38:49

Sorry to confuse everbody with my post, but posting how to sail wing & wing is difficult it is a feel that can only be mastered by practice. The best discription was the post by Steve Milby it covered alot. The best way to learn wing & wing is to go with someone who is very familiar sailing wing & wing. Watch, learn and listen while doing it then it will become second nature.

Bryan Beamer
Daylight Again
C250wk #495

Edited by - on

jellyfish
Navigator

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USA
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Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 16:49:55

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
[quote]

Bryan,

I also enjoy down wind sailing wing-on-wing. One particular day to remember was a 20 mile run with 15+ MPH winds using a cruising spinnaker. We sailed for 3 1/2 hours surfing down 3 foot waves doing 12 1/2 knots. I was pulling a 8' Zodiac to boot. It was, to say the least, the finest afternoon I've had in 15 years of sailing.

Al
GALLIVANT #5801

Edited by - aeckhart on 01/10/2003 09:13:41
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

doing 12 1/2 knots??? isnt that a little over the hull speed for a C25?

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2003 : 18:32:33

"doing 12 1/2 knots??? isnt that a little over the hull speed for a C25?"

Didn't you see the video that Steve Milby posted?

http://www.skiff.org.nz/movies/Stagecoach2.mov

Don Lucier, 'North Star'
C25 SR/FK
Cradled on the hard, 200ft from Lake Erie

Edited by - on

MattL
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 01/11/2003 : 01:14:56

I read an article in some magazine a couple of years ago talking about downwind sailing, in regards to angle of attack. What was said made sense.

Going down wind, if that is where your destination lie, is the the shortest way. Going off at an angle will increase your speed, something to do with vectors (directions of your force not the kind that carries diseases). The angular direction takes you off of the shortest distance line meaning you have to go further. The question now is does the increased speed make up for and pass the increase in distance. They had a graph showing the increased speed needed to make a difference. Put it this way; if you have a West Wright Potter, no offence to the Potter lovers I think they are kind of cool, your best bet is to go directly down wind because your speed is going to be the same no matter what the angle - slow. At the other extream if you have an ocean racing 50' multihull you can go at a 45 degree angle away from dead on and get a tremendous speed that will more than make up for the increased distance travled.
Now the bad news: We are closer to the WWP than to the fast cats
<img src=icon_smile_sad.gif border=0 align=middle> The good news is, you are out on the water sailing if you are going down wind broad reached or close hauled<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Matt/Brigitte Loeffler
E.C. Rider
Cat 25 86'
FK/SR _/)

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5937 Posts

Response Posted - 01/12/2003 : 10:19:00

The general rule for downwind sailing is that you should steer downwind in the puffs, and broad reach in the lulls. As Matt pointed out, the question is, when is it better to run downwind, and when is it better to broad reach? As the windspeed declines, at what point do you alter your course from a run to a broad reach? I generally continue running downwind as long as there is enough wind to keep the boat moving, and until she is close to losing steerageway. When the wind becomes so light that you are about to lose directional control of the boat, that is the time to start broad reaching. When you broad reach, you are not closing on the leeward mark as quickly as when you are running, but you are maintaining enough speed to be able to control the boat. If a puff comes down the lake, and if your boat is still moving, you can steer the boat into the puff, and then turn and run downwind in the puff. If the boat loses all speed and is dead in the water, you won’t be able to go hunting for puffs. You just have to wait for the wind to come to you. This all assumes that the wind is squarely at your back. If the wind shifts, so that it is slanting to one side or the other, then broad reaching across the slant will increase your boatspeed, and, depending on how much it is slanting, it will also increase the rate that you close on the leeward mark. If the wind is shifting frequently from one side to the other, you can tack downwind, alternating from a port tack run to a starboard tack run.

While you are sailing downwind, you are constantly closing on the leeward mark, and traveling the shortest possible distance to get there. The boats that are broad reaching are increasing their speed, but they are making long zig-zags, which greatly increases the distance they must travel, and reduces the rate that they are closing on the leeward mark. From what I have seen, the increased speed rarely makes up for the increased distance that they have to travel. The only exception is that, while you are zigging and zagging all over the lake, you will occasionally get lucky and find a strong puff that will carry you downwind enough to overtake the other boats. If you are desperate to catch a boat that is ahead of you, then you can start broad reaching downwind in the hope that you will find a strong puff, but it’s not a very high percentage gamble. It’s a tactic that you can use when you have nothing to lose.

Let me give an example of how this actually works in practice. In a recent race, we were sailing a windward-leeward racecourse. The wind was coming from astern and intermittently, down the right side, the left side and the middle of the lake, in small, localized puffs. In light and shifting winds, I was alternately broad reaching and running downwind toward the finish line. An S-2 7.9 rode a strong wind puff down the lake and overtook us from behind. As he approached, he got on my wind and kept me from accelerating on the wind puff. When he went by, I reached to the right, across his stern, to get my wind clear and to gain speed. (At this point, I was behind the S-2.) Then I steered downwind, setting my sails wing-and-wing, and rode the puff until it almost disappeared. When I crossed his stern, the S-2 broad reached over toward the left side of the lake, gybed, and then started broad reaching back. When my puff finally died, I saw that another puff was overtaking the S-2 from astern, so I broad reached over toward him to get in on it. When the new puff got to us, my boat was about 40 yards ahead of the S-2, and I steered downwind, wung out my sails, and beat him across the finish line.

The move that put us 40 yards ahead of the S-2 was when I crossed his stern to get clear air, and headed downwind, wung out on the last of the puff. While he was reaching off toward the left side of the lake, he was sailing at an acute angle to the finish line. He was not getting significantly closer to it. He took a long zig and zag to keep broad reaching in the light air. As a result, he traveled a much greater distance than I did, and he sailed out of the puff that he had been in. While we were sailing downwind on the last of the dying puff, it seemed dreadfully slow, but we were constantly closing on the finish line, and traveling the shortest possible distance to get there. By the time my puff died, and I reached over toward the S-2 to get into his new puff, our courses had converged, so I didn’t have to reach very far to get in position to make my turn downwind and run for the finish line.

Steve Milby "Captiva Wind" C-25 T/FK #2554

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aeckhart
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 01/13/2003 : 10:24:14

"doing 12 1/2 knots??? isnt that a little over the hull speed for a C25?"

Yes, sailing down wind is supposed to be the slowest point of sail. Exceeding hull speed is no trick however, when you are able to surf large waves down wind. Small lake sailers experience this only on rare occasions. We on the Great Lakes, particularly on Lake Superior I suspect, are more apt to experience the wind and wave conditions which allow you so sale at these greater speeds. It is a major rush when it does occur. I believe my email address is somewhere on this site. I can demonstrate if you would care to come to the best sailing area in the country. Big water, good wind most times, no salt, a harbor of refuge every 20 miles (generally with pump-out facilities), easy access to facilities in three states and Canada.

Al
GALLIVANT #5801

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jellyfish
Navigator

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Response Posted - 01/13/2003 : 11:51:31

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
"doing 12 1/2 knots??? isnt that a little over the hull speed for a C25?"

Yes, sailing down wind is supposed to be the slowest point of sail. Exceeding hull speed is no trick however, when you are able to surf large waves down wind. Small lake sailers experience this only on rare occasions. We on the Great Lakes, particularly on Lake Superior I suspect, are more apt to experience the wind and wave conditions which allow you so sale at these greater speeds. It is a major rush when it does occur. I believe my email address is somewhere on this site. I can demonstrate if you would care to come to the best sailing area in the country. Big water, good wind most times, no salt, a harbor of refuge every 20 miles (generally with pump-out facilities), easy access to facilities in three states and Canada.

Al
GALLIVANT #5801

<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote> Al, sorry if I remain a little skeptical. you stated 12.5 kts for 3 1/2 hrs. must have been a hell of a wave you were surfing. I know you can exceed hull speed and I am no small lake sailor(unless you consider the Gulf of Mexico a small lake) I would also remain skeptical about "best sailing area in the country" even if we do have salt in our water.

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Gary B.
Admiral

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969 Posts

Response Posted - 01/13/2003 : 12:04:29

Steve: Can you go further in explaining why a preventer is a bad idea in a breeze? I use a preventer in nearly all conditions, and, while I haven't jibed the main over in a strong breeze, it seems to me that it would be preferable to an accidental jibe, which also could do some damage. When the preventer is affixed and the boat jibes, only a small percentage of the main is in a position to catch a lot of wind. Basically, it's going to have so much twist in it that the pressure on the back side of the main would seem to be minimal, compared to the full main catching the breeze when it swings through with no preventer attached.

I once had a nasty day on the ocean in my old Tartan 30. The mainsheet was affixed to the transom (like our C25s), but this boat had wheel steering. A nasty jibe in 25 knots saw me hit with the mainsheet as the boom came over. I was knocked down in the cockpit with such force that I broke a number of ribs, even though wearing a vest. I later moved the mainsheet to forward of the wheel, but have rigged preventers as a matter of course since. It makes me a little nervous, I'll admit, but I think I have much better control of the boat, and, to me, the damage is likely to be less severe that with an uncontrolled jibe. Please let me know what I am missing here. If other folks have experiences that relate, I'm all ears. Thanks

Gary B.
Encore! #685 SK/SR

Edited by - on

jellyfish
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Response Posted - 01/13/2003 : 12:19:42

I am really confused here! why would anyone being running wing n wing in a 25kt breeze when the prudent thing would be putting a reef in the sail? what am I missing here?

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