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Lake Lanier Warnings

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redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/19/2012 : 05:31:42

A running topic to let others know what can happen if your Lake gets heavily populated.

http://www.ajc.com/news/gwinnett/1-child-killed-1-1460391.html

Last night at 11PM a Speed boat side swipes a pontoon boat with 13 on board and keeps going... One dead 8 yo., one teen missing.

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

Edited by - on

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 05:42:13

Man, that's awful. Even waisted, how can you go out at 11PM and NOT understand that there will be other folks out and you can't just mindlessly haul *ss around.

Edited by - on

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 05:43:30

Your kidding right... They are probably home right now, waxing the boat, wondering how it got scratched.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
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1218 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 06:32:22

Tragic....very tragic. The driver of the boat killed a child. I can only hope he suffers the full penalty of law and maximum financial responsibility to the family.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
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1218 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 06:33:25

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redeye
 Your kidding right... They are probably home right now, waxing the boat, wondering how it got scratched.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

No, driver has been arrested.

Edited by - on

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 07:30:11

<< mindlessly haul *ss around. >>

Yepper.... I keep a careful lookout at 3 knots.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 07:35:29

Internet news article says suspect has been arrested and charged with BUI at a minimum, more charges could be added later. Hope they add manslaughter, wrongful death, etc.

Edited by - dmpilc on 06/19/2012 07:35:53

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 08:28:24

...and another kid is "missing." Both vessels were under way... lights? The hit-and-run part ("failure to assist") should be simple, but the rest might get complicated before it's over.

A place like Lanier should have a 5 knot speed limit after sundown. Don't like it? Go to Alabama.

Edited by - on

pfduffy
Captain

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USA
317 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 08:38:05

I've owned my boat for 3 years now (my first) and I still don't feel confident enough to be out after sunset. Goal for this year is for a sleepover with the kids out on the bay. Stories like this really rattle me!

edit: I know this is not about me and recognize how tragic this is for the families involved.

Edited by - pfduffy on 06/19/2012 08:41:47

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 09:02:38

Just stay away from the dam at Lake Lanier...

very unusual place.. High density, all kinds of craft and lots of drinkin.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4303 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 17:21:18

Back when I ran my SeaRay on Lake Conroe I was coming out of the marina after dark one night and had just cleared the No Wake Zone when I heard some people screaming and yelling. I didn't see anything at first but as I continued out I came on a boat with no lights on and the people were frantic. I immediately headed over to see what was going on. There were two guys and two girls on board and they were cover in blood.

Turns out they were stopped with there lights ON while one of the guys (the driver) was relieving himself off of the swim platform. While they were stopped there was a guy who had just purchased a boat and was out doing donuts and driving erractically after dark. He ran right over the boat I came up on. He hit right at the windshield on the drivers side and destroyed the instrument panel, drivers seat, and most of the passenger glove box area including the windshield. There was a perfect, and I mean a perfect outline of the outdrive and prop right through the side of the boat in the drivers/windshield area.

If the driver had been sitting in his seat the boat would have killed him instantly and the prop would have carved him up into pieces. Although everyone was cut up pretty bad by flying glass and getting knocked out of their seats they were all OK.

Turns out the guy that hit them had nevered owned a boat, his windshield was very darkly tinted, and he was sitting down behind the windshield instead of standing up so he could see clearly at night.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 17:56:05

That's terrifying to hear (both stories).

Washington State has incorporated a required [url="http://www.boat-ed.com/washington/boating_card.html"]boater's education course[/url] that's being implemented on a by-age basis. The younger you are, the sooner you're required to get the certification. However, if you're operating a boat with less than 15 horsepower, apparently the card isn't required.

I wonder if courses like this actually make any difference. You really can't legislate stupidity.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5368 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 19:18:04

David
CT has a compulsory boater education law, and nonetheless, BWI incidents are up in the past few years hereabouts. Last year several boaters under the influence crashed into a big rock on Candlewood Lake killing some passengers but I think the driver walked away with a few scratches (they always do, don't they?).
It is a big problem. People who would never choose to drive drunk will boat drunk. As Commander of a local USPower Squadron I was invited by a local TV station for an interview. I referred the reporter to the District's Communications Officer who was equipped with examples, stories and statistics on the topic and he had the time to handle the interview.
Unless tons of publicity, big fines, confiscation of boats and prison sentences are amped up, don't see how law enforcement will ever be able to prevent the few irresponsible ones from endangering the innocents.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 19:52:18

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by delliottg
 Washington State has incorporated a required [url="http://www.boat-ed.com/washington/boating_card.html"]boater's education course[/url]...
I wonder if courses like this actually make any difference...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Connecticut has required a Safe Boating Certificate (course) for 20+ years, to operate any boat with a motor, or sailboat over 19.5' with no motor. This hasn't eliminated all stupidity, but I noticed a difference in awareness of the rules, and generally in more intelligent operation in the early years of the program. Absent something like that, people don't know there are any rules or conventions. Red buoys, green buoys, white buoys... what's the diff? Other boats around you? Just wander around any way you want and let the others stay out of your way... Lights? I'll just carry a million-candle spot and shine it at anything I see. Red and white lights ahead on your right? So what?

Hopefully when you sit in one of those courses, you hear about how difficult it can be to see other boats (or even figure out where you are) in the dark with shore lights around you. Of course you have to experience it to really believe it, but better to hear it than learning by running into somebody...

Edited by - on

Arlington
Navigator

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USA
196 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2012 : 22:48:23

With a prayer for the family of the two boys.

What a terrible story! Even though the sight of the Lake Officer and the Game Warden is not always welcomed, I am glad to see them enforcing the laws to keep drunks off of the lake. I count the fishermen as friends, but I am leery of the racers I see mindlessly tearing up and down the lake. If they can't see a boat, what chance does a swimmer have in the water?

Doug

Edited by - on

Davy J
Master Marine Consultant

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1511 Posts

Response Posted - 06/20/2012 : 05:20:59

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I've owned my boat for 3 years now (my first) and I still don't feel confident enough to be out after sunset. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
When traveling at night, we keep a handheld spotlight in the cockpit. If I feel that another boat is on a heading with us and the sails are up, I light them up. If that tactic doesn't seem to get attention, I will for a short time point the light directly at the offender. It may not be the right thing to do, but has unfortunately, or maybe fortunately, worked on more than a couple of occasions.

Edited by - Davy J on 06/20/2012 05:22:40

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 06/20/2012 : 08:18:05

We 'always' acknowledge local authorities when they are on the water, a welcome sight anytime!

It's amazing that similar, awful, incidents like the one that began this thread don't get reported here very often.

Virtually every time we are at anchor in our favourite spot, some yahooo will tear through the no wake, swim area and folks get their air horns out, we're normally one of the first to alert.

Our launch area when busy during daylight hours is the start of a story like this one virtually everyday! Just watching the boats getting overloaded with party goers, kids of all ages, is dishartening. So we welcome the law authorities (we have several down here) at the ramps. True, they are mostly looking for the arrival of illegal aliens and illegal catches, but would sure like to see them inspect boats before leaving the dock. Beers break out as soon as they are underway, 15+ people on a boat and you know they don't have the correct safety equipment. And don't even wonder for a few seconds if they have checked out the Local Marine weather report.

So I salute the local authorities, and support any request for funding those services.

Edited by - on

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 06/20/2012 : 11:22:32

Yepper... My Grilfriend wants me to add little strobes on each side like an airplane.. She said she wanted to light LeeKee up like a christmas tree next time we went out at night.

So rather than the Disco Ball now I have visions of a Big Angel on the top...

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4303 Posts

Response Posted - 06/20/2012 : 11:55:06

I'm going to charge up my 10 million candlepower flashlight and start using it. Last Friday night I was out when they were doing the weekly fireworks display. Had all my running lights on and was holding my LED Maglite in one hand. I wasn't anchored and was also not under sail or power. I was hanging close to several big cruisers thinking they would be seen and I would be noticed also.

Sure enough, one late straggler comes motoring through the pack semi on-plane (maybe 10 - 12 mph -- still too fast for as many boats as were in the area). I saw them coming and started waving my flashlight around without directly shining it in their face so they would see me.

Past right by me about 15' away without ever slowing down. I could tell they saw me but I was tempted to light them up with my big flashlight. I didn't do it because I didn't want a confrontation and with so many boats around didn't want the liability if I blinded them and they ran into another boat. Plus I was in a laid back mood.

On another night, away from other boats, might have been another story.

Edited by - on

JohnP
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1520 Posts

Response Posted - 06/20/2012 : 17:40:21

I always have my million candlepower spotlight ready when sailing at night. I very rarely see irresponsible boaters on the Chesapeake Bay, but it only takes one!

Those are two sad and tragic stories.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 06/20/2012 : 19:38:04

I love sailing at night in the summer....under a full moon.....

Fortunately Eagle Mountain is sparsely populated at night. Since the lake is not a Corps lake, most boats are back in the marina, in their boathouses or private docks. Those on the hook are snugly back in a cove, out of the way.

Our Lake Patrol is very active, day and night, and will swing by for a friendly wave. At night, I've seen them change course and cross a distance just to swing by and wave. Now, I know they're not just "being nice"....we have several bars on the lake. You can tie up at their dock and pop in for a few....and the docks have as many boats as the parking lot has cars. We also have a CG Aux on the lake...their office is at my marina in fact....and they monitor 16 and will respond, as do the marina offices and ships stores.

Constant vigilance....is key....defensive boating as it were....using appropriate tools to signal. Folks may not like it, but I have no issue lighting you up if you're coming my way and getting too close.

I enjoy night sailing too much to stop doing it. We're getting to that time of year where the daylight hours, between Noon and 8:00 PM....are just too brutal heat wise to enjoy being on the lake. A cool night breeze, a full moon....sweetness.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4303 Posts

Response Posted - 06/20/2012 : 20:02:00

I have to agree with Scott, I won't be day sailing much longer. Night sailing is the way to go here in Texas, especially down here along the coast.

Scott has the advantage of maybe 40% humidity at night in North Texas. I have maybe 75% in the evening on a good day and 90% plus the rest of the time.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 06/21/2012 : 05:37:45

:-) It's a push on the heat.

Lower temps but high humidity...it's an oppressive steambath. I lived in Houston when I was a young child, and I've been to the beach, from Galveston to South Padre, in the summer many times in my life. Houston can be a real bear in the summer.

Higher temps but lower humidity....it's still friggan hot.

The humidity keeps the temps down....won't allow the temps to really spike. Once the air dries out, the temps can really rise....especially when a high settles in, compressing the air.

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 06/21/2012 : 07:01:31

While clearly the guilty party has been identified and will be brought to justice, I think there is a lot of preventables in this situation.

What were 13 people, including a 9 and 13 yo, doing on a "late night" cruise? From the looks of the pontoon boat, that exceeded the occupancy rating.

Pontoon boats have only one purpose. Keep the occupants and their ahem, beverages in the vertical upright position. If this were a commercial collision, both Captain's would be tested for sobriety. I would not be surprized if the pontoon Captain had consumed and if that contributed to the accident.

There is no evidence that the pontoon Captain attempted to signal the other vessel which would in my opinion constitute poor watch keeping. Again, you are on a "late night" cruise and everyone knows that the crazies and the zombies come out at night. Situational awareness would seem to be lacking in this case, at least according to the reports thusfar. Normally, victims make an affirmation of some sort if some attempt to avoid tragedy had been attempted.

Pontoon boats are a known hazard. Drunk people on a grey and in this case red square vessel that is notorious for poor running lights, often obstructed by the operator or guests or the vessel design itself, in and of itself constitutes a hazard. The picture of the pontoon boat looks like it would appear as just a black shape on the horizon from certain angles.

If you don't want to blind the other operator, use the light to light up your vessel. Keep a proper watch and a light handy at night. This isn't the first collision and won't be the last.

sten

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 06/21/2012 : 07:50:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking
 ...Pontoon boats are a known hazard...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Like this one...

...which is almost drowning its engine...

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 06/21/2012 08:07:10

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 06/21/2012 : 08:42:07

And that's the Hall County Sheriff's dive team? Wow...........

I'm not going to subscribe to a "Pontoons are evil" though, I'm actually looking at pontoons right now. I think they have their problems as do all types of vessels, but properly lit and properly operated they're just fine. And whether you're drinking or not you need to act like a captain, be vigilant and responsible.

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