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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

GPS/Depth/Chartplotter?

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BCG-Woodbury
Mainsheet Editor

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USA
396 Posts

Initially Posted - 09/29/2012 : 16:49:40

Looking to add one to our boat. Have basic depth but would like a GPS type unit as well. The Garmin units look reasonable. Any thoughts?

Brian & JoAnne Gleissner
Knot So Fast
1984 Catalina 25, SR/SK
Traditional Interior
Lake Candlewood, CT

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 09/29/2012 : 19:34:10

I have a Magellan color plotter with chips from Maine to Annapolis I was going to eBay if you are interested... Otherwise, Garmin is a very dependable and logical buy.

Sten

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britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 09/29/2012 : 19:35:05

We had the Garmin 192C and loved it!

It was a 2005 model, and was past updates, so this year we up'd to a 546.

The menu system is not immediately as friendly as the 192C, but we're getting used to it.

In an effort to reduce the number of buttons to press, they made an App type menu... as I said, we're getting used to it.

We are ordering a spare power/control connector so that we can run it at home off a 12v supply.

So far the only issue I see, is that if we purchase the upgrade for the onboard map, the new chip has to remain in the unit while in use. This sucks as we purchased the G2 Vision card, and it only takes one card at a time! Garmin screwed up on that one.

Paul

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awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 09/29/2012 : 22:23:48

I'm waiting to see how the Raymarine a65/a67 look (and what pricing is like). The previews look very nice!

On my Catalina 25 I used a handheld GPS (Garmin Oregon 450) along with a fish finder (Garmin Echo 300C). That combo was a lot more affordable than a "marine" GPS, especially since I already had the handheld for cycling, hiking, and kayaking. Both mounted easily to the wood trim on the exterior, so I didn't have to make any real modifications to the boat. That also made it trivial to lock them up at the end of the day. Here is a photo:
<img src="http://alexandchristine.smugmug.com/Sailing/San-Juan-Islands-August-2012/i-VGSfs58/0/M/P1020728-M.jpg">

My new boat has a pedestal and wheel and many more sensors (wind speed, wind direction, water speed, water depth) most of which should work with a multifunction display, so that is why I'm looking at much fancier solutions like the a67.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 09/30/2012 : 08:55:23

I have the [url="https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?cID=&pID=14898"]Garmin 640[/url], which I use in the boat and in the car. It comes with mounts for both, full Nuvi-style N. Am. street maps and Blue Charts built in, separate marine and road screens and functions, voice directions, touch-screen interface, internal battery (so I can plan routes anywhere and even use it on a lifeboat), and it's waterproof. (I really appreciate the battery.) The marine power cable includes NMEA inputs and outputs for the DSC VHF and depth sounder. It automatically operates in marine mode when I mount it in the boat, and highway mode in the car mount. It's not as thin and light as a Nuvi, but works well for me. Surprisingly, WM has recently had some of the best sale prices for it--otherwise check GPSDiscount.com.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 09/30/2012 09:06:22

BCG-Woodbury
Mainsheet Editor

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USA
396 Posts

Response Posted - 09/30/2012 : 09:39:38

Thanks for the input. I'll start my research with Garmin and go from there. We have a Nuvi for the car and like it. A hand-held might be nice so I can use it biking and hiking. One of my buddies has a hand-held, maybe we'll try it out on the boat first.

Best regards,

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 09/30/2012 : 10:41:42

BTW, the built-in 640 charts are coastal--I don't think they include inland lakes. That's also true with many other chartplotter models.

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BCG-Woodbury
Mainsheet Editor

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USA
396 Posts

Response Posted - 09/30/2012 : 14:41:24

Thanks Dave -

I figured I would have to buy the Lakes & Rivers. I definitely want a unit that can support both inland & coastal. It appears that some do and some don't. I guess it depends on the price point.

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 09/30/2012 : 19:54:20

Another comment on the Garmin 640... It's a portable "handheld", but not exactly a "pocket" GPS, although it has been in my pants pocket. The screen is much larger than most "handhelds", especially due to the touch-screen design (no buttons on front). The 620 is the same hardware without pre-loaded marine charts or street-level maps, so you can pick your own. I can't say whether it might be cost-effective for a lake sailor.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 09/30/2012 19:55:04

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5376 Posts

Response Posted - 10/01/2012 : 19:18:52

I started out with Magellan GPSs but switched to Garmin and swear by them. You get so much with the product and they interface with everything.
I like the built-in charting SW, the almanac data (tides, time of sunset, moonrise, hunting&fishing data) and if you have the right adaptors you can connect it with your computer and your DSC VHF. Mine uses two AA cells and it's smart enough to use alkalines or NiMH rechargeables! It reports remaining battery life correctly. Has all the stats you'll need for sailing like VMG. And anchor drag. I like the proximity alarm - if you get too close to a hazard like a shoal it will alarm. I wonder if I can set an alarm for proximity to high end boutiques when out shopping with the Admiral!

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 10/01/2012 : 19:55:38

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Voyager
 ...I wonder if I can set an alarm for proximity to high end boutiques when out shopping with the Admiral!<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">What?? ...to bring them to her attention??

Edited by - on

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 10/01/2012 : 20:10:16

I have a Garmin Oregon 400c mounted to my pedestal using a bicycle handlebar mount. (I think that a bicycle mount might fit nicely on a tiller, too, but have not tried it.) I think the later models of Oregon are still available, but a little more costly than before because you need to by a chip with the marine charts. I used this alone for one full year, but the past two I've also had a netbook in the cockpit. If you go with a handheld, I'd recommend mounting it somewhere, because they generally do not float.

I generally prefer the touchscreen models of both handheld and larger chartplotters, because the context sensitive menus have a lower learning curve. But people who wear gloves often prefer the types with menu buttons.

Don't underestimate what you can do with an iPad or Android tablet, or even your cell phone, or a laptop with a GPS dongle (which can be found for as little as $20) plugged into a USB port. A lot of this depends on what kind of seas and weather you sail in, since water is an enemy of these things. I generally sail in only fair weather, so I have a Netbook in the cockpit, mounted with a RAM mount that allows me to pivot the Netbook to be visible no matter where I am in the cockpit. I've come to rely on it so much that the Oregon is there just to record tracks for every trip, and to be a foul weather backup if I need to put the Netbook down below due to rain.

I had bought the Garmin 640 two years ago, but after reading about the things I could do with computer software like OpenCPN, I decided to go that route and returned the 640 unopened.

OpenCPN is a great product, and it's free. It does not run on Android, but we're on the verge of a flood of Windows 8 tablets coming out, and I suspect that could be a very interesting combination to keep an eye out for. The Windows 8 tablets will also open up a huge number of extremely powerful commercial chartplotter programs as well (though OpenCPN seems to meet all my needs very nicely).

Edited by - TakeFive on 10/01/2012 20:13:27

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 10/01/2012 : 20:41:29

I bought a Garmin with a 12 inch screen a few years ago and love it. But we still have a Garmin handheld in the cockpit so you can hang out in the companionway or tuck behind the dodgers and still keep track of your speed etc. Then down below, the radar unit has a gps, laptop has one, another older Garmin, and the Magellan. What's nice about that is that you can have different screens up in the nav station without having to touch anything. So I thought I was in overkill until I delivered an Oyster 62 and it had two huge Raymarines in the cockpit, one for each wheel, one at the nav station, one in the owners cabin, one in the galley and one in the crews quarters. Cameras attached were a nice feature that allowed you to catch the onwatch snoozing, or see what was going on without getting out of bed after some sloppy sail management noises topside. Toys, Gotsta have em!

Also, having spares means that you can put a couple in the oven in the event of an electrical storm.

Sten

Edited by - on

AkaBud
1st Mate

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27 Posts

Response Posted - 10/02/2012 : 17:37:46

I just installed this Garmin 441.
I like it a lot.

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BCG-Woodbury
Mainsheet Editor

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USA
396 Posts

Response Posted - 10/02/2012 : 20:33:34

I like the mount and arm, is it homemade? If not what brand and model #?

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AkaBud
1st Mate

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27 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2012 : 19:15:12

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by BCG-Woodbury
 I like the mount and arm, is it homemade? If not what brand and model #?

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">It's homemade. Works great. Easy to see from both side of the cockpit. If you need to go below just push it out of the way.

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Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5376 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2012 : 20:19:20

I love the headbang protection tape. Even if it doesn't soften the blow, it reminds you that a bonk is coming shortly!

Edited by - Voyager on 10/04/2012 20:20:02

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2012 : 20:23:24

The 640 doesn't have a fish finder or sonar. This seems like a major limitation given it's price point. The sonar gets at least as much use as the GPS on our boat. Our new boat doesn't have the fish finder, just a depth finder, and I already miss it. I don't fish, but the fish finder gives you a much clearer picture of what is under the water.

We use our iPad with an external GPS (made by Dual, it is one of the few bluetooth/iPad GPS devices available) as the "large display" nav device when we want something better than the Oregon. Without a built in compass and with the less sensitive GPS it isn't that great. Speed readings are all over the place for instance, sometimes it'll jump between 2 kts and 5 kts. The iPad doesn't work in rain (not waterproof) or in bright sun (display is too dim) so it only works in dry and cloudy. I'd prefer a commodity PC/tablet based solution with a good GPS/compass module and NMEA support because Garmin and Raymarine write mediocre software at best, but I haven't seen the right tablet hardware yet.

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Arlington
Navigator

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USA
196 Posts

Response Posted - 10/05/2012 : 21:07:23

I thought that Garmin was the only choice, then I started looking at the Lowrance and now I am leaning toward Lowrance. When you ask at West Marine or Bass Pro and they demo both of them side by side for you the Lowrance seems to easily out preform Garmin. Second Garmin's customer service seems to reflect indifference.
Doug

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awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 10/06/2012 : 07:25:06

Raymarine is another easy to find option. A new lower price point model is coming out any day now that looks great:
http://www.raymarine.co.uk/view/?id=4977

I like the small bezel (maximizing the display size), touch screen interface, and feature set. I'm very curious to see what they sell it for. My guess is that it'll be in the $800 price range, but I don't really know.

Edited by - awetmore on 10/06/2012 07:27:21

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 10/06/2012 : 08:11:59

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by awetmore
 The 640 doesn't have a fish finder or sonar. This seems like a major limitation given it's price point. The sonar gets at least as much use as the GPS on our boat. Our new boat doesn't have the fish finder, just a depth finder, and I already miss it...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">If you add one with a NMEA interface, you can connect it to the 640 and see the depth on the GPS screen, for whatever that's worth. (I simply have a fishfinder and GPS--no connection--so I have to look up, down, up, down...

)

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TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 10/06/2012 : 13:27:13

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Stinkpotter
 [quote]Originally posted by awetmore
 ...If you add one with a NMEA interface, you can connect it to the 640 and see the depth on the GPS screen, for whatever that's worth. (I simply have a fishfinder and GPS--no connection--so I have to look up, down, up, down...

)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
On a related note, Raymarine SeaTalk devices can be easily connected together to talk to each other. A previous owner installed the depth in the starboard bulkhead, and the wheel autopilot on the right coaming. Only problem is that my wife often sits (and sometimes naps) against the starboard bulkhead, so I was always asking her to move. All it took was a $20 cable to connect the two together, and now I can see the depth on the autopilot display. So now I can "look over" instead of "looking up."

One of these days I will get a Seatalk-NMEA converter to put the depth into my chartplotter so I won't ever have to look up at all.

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