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Capri 25 Specific Forum

Considering a Capri

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Kper
Captain

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USA
417 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/06/2013 : 03:18:12

We sold our '78 C-25 this spring and came across a fresh water '83 Capri w/trailer for $2500. It's a few hours away from us and I was hoping to get some info on the differences between the C-25 and the Capri, like, interior layout, head room comparison, sleeping arrangements, etc. Is there any head in a Capri? It only has a 6hp engine, which I think is a bit small. There is no mention of a furler system or what type of winches.

Here is part of the ad:
<i>It's got a complete set of sails and rigging, with many sail controls replaced in the last 5 years. The mainsail is a very good 2011 Sobstad, the other sails--2 spinnakers and 3 headsails (3 sizes of 155, 130, 110) (They're fine for cruising, and we used them every week last summer, but their shape is gone.)

The hull has no name/graphics and is in good shape, with no structural defects like soft spots or seam cracks; the bottom needs a fresh paint job (last redone in 2011). The interior is clean but a little worn; it has cushions, storage lockers, and working wiring for the stereo, cabin, and navigation lights.

Trailer is included and has been stored indoors at all times -new trailer tires. The boat comes with a Windex wind indicator, a deep-cycle battery, a 6hp 2-stroke outboard and gas can. </i>

Thank you.

Kyle
'86 SR/SK/Dinette #5284 "Anodyne"
In the barn where we found her...

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2013 : 04:14:15

There are a drastic number of differences between the Cat 25, and the Capri 25, they are different purpose built boats.

The Capri is a beamy, low freeboard, purpose built racer. The goal of the boat was to create a boat that could out-sail a J/24 racing boat with more comfort below and more space. I can say I can outsail a J/24 downwind, but upwind they can kick my keester.

USUALLY, the Capri 25 is rigged to race. Furlers are NOT typically installed on them (not saying you can't).
Headroom? There is JUST enough for a 6 foot man to SIT below.
Head - well if a porta-pottie is a head (they are like $60 if the boat does not have one)... there is a dedicated space for the pottie, a man has to sit like a girl to use it, and the hatch bolts forward are real head-splitters if you don't cover them.
6hp too small? HA! I used a 2.2hp motor for a year... I've now upgraded to a BIG motor with a 3.5. The recommended size motor for this boat is 4hp. I was out in 25-30 gusts to 35 the other day, the 3.5 moved the boat into the wind at 4 knots... Add a current and the 4hp might have been better, 6 is overkill!

Sounds like the boat was raced... that's good! especially if you are going to cruise with it! Here's why. Racing sails are replaced often for competitive types. Means you'll get decent quality sails for cruising. I'm sorry to say if you are used to your Cat 25, the Sobstad sails will likely be "rolled" and "load path." Meaning you have to roll them along the foot to store them properly (folding them creases them, and breaks the fibers). This is a tad more work, but they'll also have MUCH more shape than most dacron only sails.

Most Capri 25s will have bolt rope mainsails, not sail slugs (it's a racing sail thing usually). This is neither here or there, but it forces you to remove the sail from the slot, and it forces you to roll the main on the boom before you put the boom cover on.

Generally also, the Capri's run 2 jib halyards, a spinnaker halyard, a spin downhaul, a mainsail halyard, and a mainsail topping lift. This means 3 halyards forward, and 2 aft. It's a lot of lines to replace so BONUS on you if he's replaced them all (expensive).

The width of the boat DOES give a creature comfort below... the pipe berths are HUGE! They are like 30 inches wide, and 8 feet long... even I have a ton of room in them!

The Capri is a screamer in light air. With a full main and a 155 genoa, you can get to hull speed in 8-10mph winds. Throw a spinnaker up (deep runner full size .75), and you can surf in 10mph.

The Capri's usually come with most sail controls... Outhaul, cunningham, reef, flattening reef (usually not used these days), backstay adjuster, spin downhaul, spin topping lift, twings, primary winches, secondary winches, traveler, mainsheet... you get the picture.

The focus of the Cat 25 was to build a good sailing, stable, cruiser that anyone could own, and be safe sailing with the family, with a decent amount of performance.

The focus of the Capri 25 was to create a One Design racer that would outsail the J/24 in some conditions but also be an affordable One Design racer... We could argue that they sort of missed their mark (but I'd argue they were pretty close).

Sadly One design racing is all but out with these, except with Wayzata Yacht Club in MN. They have a great 30+ boat fleet of Capri 25s. As far as I know they are the only ones that have enough Capri 25s to truly race One Design.

I personally find the Capri 25 MORE than capable of giving the PHRF (club racing) circuit boats a decent run at it. Our club has about 6 S2 7.9s (also quick racers properly equipped - grand slam model)... and I find that I can beat them downwind, but they can crush me upwind... Light air I am faster. For a J/24 I can match boat speeds downwind, but struggle with them upwind... I am comparing boat for boat now, the rating shows me slower than both of them. A J/22 races with us, and I've been able to handle the winds as they pipe up better than them, but downwind they can kill me (again on paper they are supposed to be faster than me). I sailed last season with 30 year old sails, and I sailed solo. Our winds were VERY light. I came in second 3 times within the racer fleet with the boat in VERY tired shape (I've purchased a couple sails from Eilliot Pattison over winter, and expect to have a bit better performance this year).

For $2500, I'd say you were getting a bargain! The trailer is worth that if it's not rusted out.

Some things to check when you look at it?
Look for soft spots in the bulkheads (especially near the compression post), and the bottom of the aft bulkheads (standing on your head in the port and starboard lockers), poke them with a screwdriver see if they are soft.

Check chainplates ON the bulkheads...
Darn near ALL Capris leak at the windows... it's actually normal (sorry not normal) it's a common problem. The original oval windows are angled wrong, and prone to leak. 1983 or 1984 they replaced them with surface mounted chiseled look lexan. This is much better, an should not leak.

The T-tracks for the genoa cars (2 or 3), sometimes leak as well, its actually not a huge deal to rebed them. (they are accessible by normal humans, no contortion required).

There are also T-tracks along the aft 1/3 of the boat, right at the boat seam. These are for blocks/twings for the spinnaker cars. I've not seen them leak, but I think they'd be harder to rebed.

Rudder slop - the rudder likely will be "sloppy." It's a pretty easy fix (out of the water).. There are washers on the rudder post top and bottom, generally just replacing them tightens it back up.

OK the real reason a person would buy this (rather than that crazy low price)... THESE ARE GREAT SAILING BOATS!
They dig in, and heel, and accelerate like you press a gas pedal. They are WIDE, and EASY to walk around. You feel like you are on an aircraft carrier walking the decks. Sitting and steering is quite comfortable, as it's light winds... then as you start to heel about 10 degrees, you move your keester to the rail (angled nicely), extend your tiller extension (they all seem to have them), and lean against the lifeline, and hang on! Dig your heels into the nicely shaped curl on the seats (for JUST that reason), and you'll be to 25 degrees before you feel like you are working to stay seated.

The boat slows down quickly if you heel past 25 degrees. The tiller is connected to a massive rudder, steering these boats is VERY VERY easy (almost too easy). It's said you can "crazy ivan" with them.. able to do 360's before people even notice (I guess if you are playing bumper boats that's helpful). But because it's got such a light tiller you can steer down all the way to 30 degrees of heel, at 30 degrees the rail is in the water... you are VERY VERY SLOW, the boat stiffens like mad, and you are now fighting the boat to keep it heeling (not sure why you'd do that but you can!)... My point is these boats stiffen like mad after 25 degrees.

Broach? Sure any boat can... I suspect the only real way to do it with this boat is to have CRAZY overkill headsail up and a CRAZY puff... or you can do it with a spinnaker up pretty easily. But have no fear.. the water rolls over the rail, into the cockpit and out... just make sure your lockers are locked... and it's a non-event... YEP, broach (if you can figure out how), is a NON-EVENT.

Can you tell I really like this boat?

It's not as comfy as a Catalina 25 (which I love too), or as pretty/comfy as a Cat 250.. but it sails like MAD!
I MOSTLY daysail my boat so, the accomodations down below are of less a concern for me. So take into account how you will sail it.

I'd not want to launch/retrieve this boat (or the Cat 25) each time I sail, but if you get a marina slip this boat would put a smile on your face every time you sail it.

Oh one last "feature."

The cockpit is 8-9 feet long. Because it's wide, 2 adults can sit forward of the skipper EASILY... 4 is doable. you could also have 2 to 3 behind the skipper. My only grip is they didn't throw in catbird seats for those of us who sail sometimes and NOT race.

$2500... if it was near me I'd probably buy it JUST to have a spare! Might drag a club member and hand it to them to race boat on boat!

Seems like a bargain if you check those few things (I'm crazy so I'd probably buy it anyway, and deal with any problems, but that's just me).

Edited by - on

Kper
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
417 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2013 : 05:04:09

Wow, John, thanks for the indepth info!!
I'm going to take this all in before I respond properly.
Thanks again!!!

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2013 : 06:30:13

Kyle... I think I saw that one (yeah crazy me scours the country via craiglist)... in Iowa. Probably a bargain.

feel free to email me shnool @ yahoo

Edited by - on

Kper
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
417 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2013 : 07:26:28

Shhhhhh.... not so loud. ;)

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

Members Avatar

USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2013 : 09:38:25

it's OK Kyle, only us 2, and 2 dozen people at WYC and perhaps a handful across the country would be interested. 30 some odd people in 300 million... I'll take those odds.

Edited by - on

Kper
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
417 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2013 : 11:08:31

So, what you're saying is resale is tough with Capris?

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2013 : 12:30:03

Not if you are winning races ;)

Edited by - on

Kper
Captain

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USA
417 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2013 : 12:33:59

Good one!

Edited by - on

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